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Subject: RE: [ebsoa] Does SOA Require Registry-Based Dynamic Discovery?


Title: Message
Thanks John - I'm going to take all 4 parts of your excellent comments below separately, and comment further. You basically said:
 
An SOA without registry by definition is limited
 
[JMC] Limited in what way? I assume because there is no dynamic discovery, and if the interface requirements and/or service location changed, it would require an out-of-band mechanism. I would assert that it is limited if the technical and business requirements led to an anticipation of updates to the interface requirements and/or service location on a regular basis - otherwise, is it *really* limited?
 
An SOA without registry by definition is private
 
[JMC] So if a SOA-based system is being used among 2 or more organizations, and the technical and business requirements *do not lead* to an anticipation of updates to the interface requirements and/or service location on a regular basis, then the SOA is "private"? Seems orthogonal to me...
 
An SOA with a registry is open
 
[JMC] Open to who? If it does not have a registry, it is not open?
 
An SOA with a registry is dynamic
 
[JMC] Agree! (one out of 4 ain't bad ;)
 
Thanks again!
 
Kind Regards,
Joseph Chiusano
Booz Allen Hamilton
Strategy and Technology Consultants to the World
 


From: Yunker, John [mailto:yunker@amazon.com]
Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2004 12:06 PM
To: Chiusano Joseph; Matthew MacKenzie; ebSOA OASIS TC
Subject: RE: [ebsoa] Does SOA Require Registry-Based Dynamic Discovery?

From my view the "registry requirement" is more a function of the distributed nature of the participants, the number and type of services, and the amount of change.  A registry provides a method for decoupling "the use of an SOA" from "direct communication of the participants about HOW to use the SOA".
 
An SOA without registry by definition is limited and private
 
An SOA with a registry is open and dynamic
 
John
-----Original Message-----
From: Chiusano Joseph [mailto:chiusano_joseph@bah.com]
Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2004 9:01 AM
To: Matthew MacKenzie; ebSOA OASIS TC
Subject: RE: [ebsoa] Does SOA Require Registry-Based Dynamic Discovery?

Thanks Matt. From that I take:
 
- Discovery in general is required for SOA (cannot function without it)
- Whether it is (what I will call) "fundamental" discovery - meaning your first example below - or "registry-based" discovery depends on technical and business requirements.
 
I just cannot foresee trying to convince a current or potential customer that they have to put up $XX,XXX for a registry product if the technical and business requirements do not call for it, just to comply with someone's definition of the term "SOA".
 
Kind Regards,
Joseph Chiusano
Booz Allen Hamilton
Strategy and Technology Consultants to the World
 


From: Matthew MacKenzie [mailto:mattm@adobe.com]
Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2004 11:57 AM
To: Chiusano Joseph; 'ebSOA OASIS TC'
Subject: RE: [ebsoa] Does SOA Require Registry-Based Dynamic Discovery?

My opinion is that a registry is nothing more than a very explicit service discovery device.

 

An SOA does need a method of discovering services, and consuming them, but this method may in some cases be subtle.  For example, my SOA may operate on the premise that consumers all are aware of an enumeration of service types, and their port numbers (think /etc/services in the unix world), and allowable IP ranges for finding services.  Clients may be configured something like:

 

{

            Services imap, http, ssh, daytime, pop3, portmap

            IPRange 192.168.0.0/24

}

 

A client with such a configuration does have a way of discovering services that are available to it, and of course, a way of binding to them.

 

Contrast this with a registry driven SOA:

 

{

            ServiceRegistry http://foo/registry

}

 

The only difference is in the implementation detail and verbosity of information available.  Conceptually, they are the same.

 

 

--Matt MacKenzie


From: Chiusano Joseph [mailto:chiusano_joseph@bah.com]
Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2004 11:38 AM
To: ebSOA OASIS TC
Subject: [ebsoa] Does SOA Require Registry-Based Dynamic Discovery?

 

What is the TC's opinion on the answer to the question of "does SOA require registry-based dynamic discovery"? I know that Discovery is a pattern in the .047 spec, which leads me to believe that the position is that SOA does not *require* registry-based discovery.

 

For example, suppose that:

 

- 2 organizations are using Web Services in a "SOA-like" manner (meaning shared services represented as Web Services, that are invoked by other Web Services).

 

- There is no registry-based dynamic discovery, perhaps because the organizations agree that these service locations are completely (or relatively) stable, and that if the locations change, there will be some out-of-band mechanism for propagating updated WSDL documents

 

Are these 2 organizations therefore *not* using a service-oriented architecture? That is, does the second point completely negate the first? Or, is it all really a matter of business and technical requirements?

 

Kind Regards,

Joseph Chiusano

Booz Allen Hamilton

Strategy and Technology Consultants to the World

 



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