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Subject: A few healthy rules for RSD


Title: Message

1. RSD does not allow for any reply header (remember, RSD is really an XML document without the tags !)

 

2. Any response must be inserted in the discussion otherwise, it cannot guess what you replying too (please do no change the content of a tag, otherwise the merge fails.

JJ@

This is good

DM@

This is even better

@DM

@JDJ

 

Is equivalent to

<author name=”jjd”>this is good

            <author name=”dm”>this is even better</author>

</author>

 

JJ@

This is DM@

This is not good at all, it not merge with the initial element as its canonical form has been modified.

@DM good

@JDJ

 

3. No commentaries in the discussion. If you want to put commentaries use comments

||David, this is a comment (it will not show up in the discussion file)

 

||good day !!

 

|| JJ

 

|| Again think XML ! tag RSD.


From: David RR Webber [mailto:david@drrw.info]
Sent: Monday, February 09, 2004 7:49 PM
To: Dale Moberg; Jean-Jacques Dubray; ebxml-bp@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: Re: [ebxml-bp] WSDL / BPSS proposal

 

DRRW@

 

Dale,

 

Having re-read this - actually looks like you are saying technically

what I was thinking - and summarized - in my previous message.

 

Ok!

 

And as you note this requires support in CPA, not just BPSS

alone.

 

Thanks, DW

 

@DRRW

----- Original Message -----

From: Dale Moberg

Sent: Monday, February 09, 2004 9:50 AM

Subject: RE: [ebxml-bp] WSDL / BPSS proposal

 

 



 

Discussion|oasis.ebBP;

Topic|WSDL;

Point| Abstraction level for  BT element, WSDL lacks business transaction semantics, specializations of BT, signals and faults ;

 

 

 

DM@

 

 JJ states. 

This proposal is based on WSDL 2.0.  

 

We introduce in BPSS a new activity type called OperationActivity, that performs like a BusinessTransactionActivity or a CollaborationActivity

 

 

 An OperationActivity references an operation within a WSDL interface. 

 

In WSDL 2.0, the MEP character (one-way, request-response and others) is found in a pattern attribute. I think this MEP feature of WSDL is really below the abstraction level

of BPSS.  A BPSS BT actually can go over several kinds of MEP, and can use several approaches to messaging/services. For example, a bpss:BT with its requesting and responding activity can in fact go over a wsdl:requestresponse or two wsdl:one-ways. The same business semantics can be variously implemented.

 

 

If there is some defined business semantic for WS, say a standard business contractual situation, then I agree we can introduce a WS content model for a specialization of BT and its referencing context (a specialization of BTA, called OperationActivity in JJ proposal without violating our abstraction level. I am dubious about the existence of a standard WS contractual situation. I doon't think there is any tie to the business level for WS.

 

Also, I think the selection of a specific WSDL bindingshould really occur within the CPA as an implementation agreement.

 

What is not in the CPA at present is an indication of the Document(s) (soap:envelope/soap:body contents) thatare conveyed in the WSDL "message". The division of labor had been to put that sort of information in the bpss:Document element. The wsdl:type definition, referenced by the operation usually, is the perfect candidate for that information.

 

I think that there is something distinctive about the SOAP/WSDL situation. WSDL defines MEP patterns with faults. The closest analog of these are (negative) signals.

Martin Roberts is developing an approach to BT that regards BT as the base class, with several specializations. Some specializations include information about signals.

I believe that the wsdl definedfault information belongs there. If so, there would be a case for having a WSDL specialization of BT, and possibly the OA you suggest. Whether we reuse the current UN based categories of BTs or add to them, I think there could be a way to regard WSDL as just another flavor of BT, differing mainly on signals vs. faults

 

At least there will need to be harmonizing between Martin's BT specialization enhancement and JJ's wsdl enhancement. I also really think we must not omit the wsdl:type element. In many ways, wsdl is just a complicated container for chunks of xml schema, where schema chunks are associated with SOAP messages. I do not think we should lose track of what is really going on in it because of WS-hoopla.

 

 

DM@

 

 

 



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