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Subject: RE: [ebxml-bp] BPMN -> BPSS via XPDL and xslt?


Dale,
 
OK fully accept that BPSS to BPMN is lossy!
 
That's not the direction I was proposing!!!
 
Since everyone is versed in creating BPMN diagrams (very simple for the seasoned BP analyst to learn this in 30 minutes or so) - BPMN itself is very lightweight syntax - that's part of its appeal - its easy.
 
However - for real machine implementation you need to power of BPSS.  So the idea is this.
 
1) BP analyst prep's quick BPMN diagrams for business logic flow.
 
2) Users confirm big picture BPMN.
 
3) Exports to XPDL.  Runs xslt to create base BPSS - enough to pass schema check as valid BPSS instance.
 
4) Load into XML Stylist - now use that to fully flesh out the complete details. Publish BPSS diagrams from Stylist and XML instance.
 
5) Deploy BPSS to SOA engine to control interactions.
 
No round trip back to BPMN for now - as not needed for initial use.
 
DW

"The way to be is to do" - Confucius (551-472 B.C.)


-------- Original Message --------
Subject: RE: [ebxml-bp] BPMN -> BPSS via XPDL and xslt?
From: "Dale Moberg" <dmoberg@us.axway.com>
Date: Thu, June 28, 2007 12:48 am
To: "David RR Webber (XML)" <david@drrw.info>,
<ebxml-bp@lists.oasis-open.org>

The OMG RFP for BPMN 2 submissions asks for a merge and completion of BPMN 1.0/1 and BPDM 1.0 (soon in the near final standards process phase, theFTF). Why is this happening? If you look at our BPMN diagrams for ebBP 2, you will note that they actually are speculations on how BPMN would incorporate public process descriptions (called InteractionProtocols in BPDM and presumably in BPMN 2). So actually BPMN had a gap in its graphical depictions (and its semantics) that is being repaired.
 
So I have heard XPDL is used as a temporary exchange format among BPMN 1.0/1.1 systems. But how are those systems really capturing InteractionProtocols of the collaborating participants? At present it would be a speculative guess by tool makers of what these diagrams look like and how they relate to the private processes (which are covered to some degree by BPMN).
 
I would guess that BPSS to XPDL would also involve a loss of all QOS related material. So BPMN 1.0/1.1 doesn’t capture BPSS public process and XSLTing to XPDL from the BPMN diagrams won’t help in getting the right descriptions exchanged.
 
I actually am interested in another XSLT project, and maybe that would connect to your interest in XPDL variants of content. BPDM now has produced XSDs for their MOF MM, and it seems plausible to have a lossy XSLT from BPSS to BPDM, the schematized flavor. (Lossy because BPDM has no QOS model built in.) Maybe there is then a way to XSLT that result back and forth to XPDL.  Meanwhile Steve Ross Talbot is working on transforms from ebBP (minus QOS) into WS-CDL apparently. The other direction, WS-CDL into a (QOS defaulted?) BPSS is a task endusers (more theoretical ones, anyway) have expressed some interest in seeing done also.
 
So the era of having many stable approaches to aspects of BP modeling  is transitioning into a connecting and relating phase. I think that the worry here is how well the semantics align through these conversions. The state transition graph parts (especially with some visual rendering) can probably be (with non trivial effort) connected together, but whether these diagrams really have the same interaction protocols (or whatever “the” semantics gets explained in) is probably going to take a while to sort out.
 
Just some thoughts…
 

From: David RR Webber (XML) [mailto:david@drrw.info]
Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 9:01 PM
To: ebxml-bp@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: [ebxml-bp] BPMN -> BPSS via XPDL and xslt?
 
Team,
 
I've been working with BPMN and the Avantage ActiveModeler and the Tibco Business Studio (both free starter packages) - and generating XPDL from BPMN diagrams.  There's also the Intalio open source BPMN Eclipse editor as well.
 
Looking at the XPDL - it looks a short hop using xslt to create a basic BPSS instance from that.   Once there - open the BPSS in the XML Stylist and finish the BPSS details.
 
Making the xslt looks like a very short hop between BPMN and BPSS via XPDL.  Anyone else interested in contributing?
 
DW

"The way to be is to do" - Confucius (551-472 B.C.)


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