Re: [ebxml-cppa] isConfidential

[Christopher Ferris <chris.ferris@sun.com>]

Pallavi,

I don't believe so except in the context of "persistent storage".
We're not talking about storage, but of a characteristic of
the message itself, which may have opportunity to reside
in some persistent storage media as a mere side effect of
its processing.

per·sis·tent   Pronunciation Key  (pr-sstnt, -zs-)
adj.

    1. Refusing to give up or let go; persevering obstinately.
    2. Insistently repetitive or continuous: a persistent ringing of the 
telephone.
    3. Existing or remaining in the same state for an indefinitely long 
time; enduring: persistent rumors; a persistent infection.
    4. Botany. Lasting past maturity without falling off, as the calyx 
on an eggplant or the scales of a pine cone.
    5. Zoology. Retained permanently, rather than disappearing in an 
early stage of development: the persistent gills of fishes.

per·sistent·ly adv.

Source: The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, 
Fourth Edition
Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.
===================================================================
persistent

\Per*sist"ent\, a. [L. persistens, -entis, p. pr. of persistere. See 
Persist.] 1. Inclined to persist; having staying qualities; tenacious of 
position or purpose.

2. (Biol.) Remaining beyond the period when parts of the same kind 
sometimes fall off or are absorbed; permanent; as, persistent teeth or 
gills; a persistent calyx; -- opposed to deciduous, and caducous.
Source: Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary, © 1996, 1998 MICRA, Inc.
====================================================================

persistent

adj 1: never-ceasing; "the relentless beat of the drums" [syn: 
relentless, unrelenting] 2: continually recurring to the mind; "haunting 
memories"; "the cathedral organ and the distant voices have a haunting 
beauty"- Claudia Cassidy [syn: haunting] 3: (biology) retained; not 
shed; "persistent leaves remain attached past maturity"; "the persistent 
gills of fishes" [syn: lasting] [ant: caducous]
Source: WordNet ® 1.6, © 1997 Princeton University

Cheers,

Chris

Malu, Pallavi G wrote:

> I wonder if "persistent" is right word to use. Doesn't persistent means some
> kind of storage is involved.
> 
> -Pallavi
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Christopher Ferris [mailto:chris.ferris@sun.com]
> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 1:23 PM
> To: Tony Weida
> Cc: CPPA
> Subject: Re: [ebxml-cppa] isConfidential
> 
> 
> Then might I suggest the following:
> 
> A mechanism that is applied to the message itself, irrespective
> of the communication protocol(s) used to convey the message, such that
> its content (in whole, or in part) can only be revealed to
> the authorized holder of the key that is used to decrypt the
> encrypted content.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Chris
> 
> Tony Weida wrote:
> 
> 
>>By way of background, the new wording arose from discussion of the
>>
> previous
> 
>>wording:
>>
>>"It MUST be encrypted above the level of the transport and delivered,
>>encrypted, to the application."
>>
>>Arvola wanted to weaken the wording and I didn't.  In particular, I wanted
>>to ensure that the "application" controls when and where decryption takes
>>place.  However, there was a general feeling that the definition of
>>"application" would be hard to agree on.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>Tony
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Christopher Ferris" <chris.ferris@sun.com>
>>To: "Tony Weida" <rweida@hotmail.com>
>>Cc: "CPPA" <ebxml-cppa@lists.oasis-open.org>
>>Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 2:33 PM
>>Subject: Re: [ebxml-cppa] isConfidential
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>I took that as a given. However, as I indicated, it
>>>really has nothing to do with "persistence on some
>>>media". The fact that I use XML Encryption on a message
>>>does not necessarily require any manner of persistence
>>>(e.g. storage on some form of media such as hard disk).
>>>
>>>The confidentiality accorded a message that is characterized
>>>as "isConfidential='persistent' is a function of the message
>>>itself. isConfidential='transient-and-persistent' is a
>>>function BOTH of the communications protocol that is used
>>>to exchange the message between two adjacent network nodes
>>>and of the message itself, independent of the mechanism
>>>used to convey the message between network nodes.
>>>
>>>The fact that a message that has used a persistent form
>>>of confidentiality *might* be stored (locally or elsewhere)
>>>on some form of storage media is secondary to the definition
>>>of what this property means.
>>>
>>>Cheers,
>>>
>>>Chris
>>>
>>>Tony Weida wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>The isConfidential attribute has four potential values: "none",
>>>>
>>>>
>>"transient",
>>
>>
>>>>"persistent", and "transient-and-persistent".  The cited text applies to
>>>>
>>>>
>>the
>>
>>
>>>>persistent cases.  Sorry for omitting the qualification.  THe motivation
>>>>
>>>>
>>is
>>
>>
>>>>to address the case of confidential exchange between applications, not
>>>>merely MSHs.
>>>>
>>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>>From: "Christopher Ferris" <chris.ferris@sun.com>
>>>>To: "Tony Weida" <rweida@hotmail.com>
>>>>Cc: "CPPA" <ebxml-cppa@lists.oasis-open.org>
>>>>Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 2:09 PM
>>>>Subject: Re: [ebxml-cppa] isConfidential
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Why would persistence (I assume on some media) be a
>>>>>consideration? True, the confidentiality is "persistent",
>>>>>but persistent only to the degree that the feature is
>>>>>not a function of the transfer or transport mechanism
>>>>>but of the message itself.
>>>>>
>>>>>Tony Weida wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Here's the text we arrived at during the last call to characterize
>>>>>>isConfidential:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  "...persisted locally in encrypted form, and made available to the
>>>>>>  application in accordance with local security policies implemented
>>>>>>  to preserve confidentiality."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Tony
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>
>>>----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription
>>>manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl>
>>>
> 
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription
> manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl>
>