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Subject: RE: [energyinterop] RE: Initial Port of OpenADR to EnergyInterop
I’m not sure I lump then
onto one box. They are a penetration of the firewall around building systems.
They can be used to induce changes in energy using systems or corporate
purchasing behavior, so they all have a specific set of security requirements.
These requirements all apply to energyinterop. Now whether the ESI is for an
entire neighborhood as in some HAN implementations or for one per floor of a
commercial building is something else. My personal preference is that we
firewall off the home/office/industry from direct access/control by third
parties in general, utilities in specific -
Utilities do not
know enough about building systems -
I do not assume that
the equipment manufacturers will be make the [refrigerator] secure enough to be
placed on the grid -
There should always
be the opportunity for the enterprise (or home) in the middle. -
Even the Home-based
PEV should be able to check the little league schedule before responding to DR… Especially when most things will
be legacy for some time, I have to assume that the EMS will be unsecured, preferably
kept on a private network, and instructed by the ESI… Now if in some future
new-installation world, it makes sense to bolt an ESI on the outside of the
EMS, that also is fine. tc "A man should never be
ashamed to own that he has been in the wrong, which is but saying ... that he
is wiser today than yesterday." --
Jonathan Swift
From: Michel Kohanim
[mailto:michel@universal-devices.com] Toby, this is excellent
information. Now, my question is: why should we
lump the “interfaces” that the facility uses to interact with the
outside world all into a BOX called ESI? If they are interfaces, they should be
treated as such with appropriate actors … i.e. Market Operations
Interface, actors: Market Operations Service, Facility EMS/Manager, etc. Thank you. ******************************** Michel Kohanim,
C.E.O Universal
Devices, Inc. (p)
818.631.0333 (f)
818.708.0755 http://www.universal-devices.com ******************************** From: Considine, Toby (Campus
Services IT) [mailto:Toby.Considine@unc.edu] I must say that ESI and what is
the ESI is a matter in a lot of conflict on the smart grid team. I think we get
to define it. As I see it, ESI is the
abstraction for all communications, occluding internal technologies, enforcing
security policy, etc. There are three external interfaces that I know: 1)
Market Operations 2)
Curtailment 3)
Verification 4)
Proxy for Direct
Control I think energy interoperation is
concerned with (1) and (2). (4) is something else. (3) is one of the great
questions on the draft. What does it mean going forward. I expect we may spend
as much time on determining what if any of (3) is involved. I highlighted it in
the draft for that reason/// As to using BACnet-ws in
energyinterop—I just can’t see it. BACnet-WS was never designed to
be in the wild. tc "A man should never be
ashamed to own that he has been in the wrong, which is but saying ... that he
is wiser today than yesterday." -- Jonathan Swift
From: Holmberg, David
[mailto:david.holmberg@nist.gov] Toby, Sharon, I believe Ed’s reference
to BACnet was to the use of BACnet web services in the OpenADR spec as one of
the options between DRAS and DRAS Client. Thus BACnet WS is in scope, but
otherwise I agree. So, what is the ESI? In my mind it is an external gateway
for access to the facility network, often owned by the IT dept (if there is
one), with the purpose of firewalling and routing to appropriate box on the
inside (like the EMS). David From: Dinges, Sharon
[mailto:sdinges@trane.com] Toby, I believe this is a fair assessment. The interactions between
the EMS and the external ESI are more appropriately communicated using XML and
web services. Then, at the EMS level, the systems would communicate using BACnet,
LonWorks, OPC, HAN, DALI, etc. Regards, Sharon From: Considine, Toby (Campus Services IT)
[mailto:Toby.Considine@unc.edu] In terms of the smart grid
diagrams, outside communications should be with Energy Services Interface
(ESI), which is something different than the Energy Management System (EMS).
Makers of BACnet, LON, HAN, DALI, et al will each figure out what the middle
layer is. Oft times, the enterprise will be in between the ESI and any
EMS. It certainly will be in any industrial environment… BACNET, LON and friends are out
of scope… "A man should never be
ashamed to own that he has been in the wrong, which is but saying ... that he
is wiser today than yesterday." -- Jonathan Swift
From: Edward Koch
[mailto:ed@akuacom.com] Enclosed is a pass on the
document that Toby sent out. I mostly tried to answer some of his
questions and added some comments of my own. Here are some general comments: It looked like there is some
material missing at the end. Clearly there needs to be some
verbiage added concerning security requirements. There needs to be some meat
added for the interaction and data models. Perhaps adding in some of the
diagrams from the spec will fulfill this requirement. We need to give some thought to
what we are going to do with the various interfaces, i.e. BACnet versus REST
versus SOAP, etc. -ed koch The
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