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Subject: Re: [office] Defining Alternative Glyphs
I think I have got a rough understanding what alternative glyphs are, but I still have a couple of questions whose answers would help to get an understanding what supporting alternative glyphs would mean for ODF? How are the alternative glyphs used from user perspective? Do I enter a Unicode character, let's say a "g". The rendering engine then detects that there are multiple glyphs available for the Unicode character, and asks me which to show? Or does it select one for me that I can overwrite, similar to how I can make a character bold? Or does it select one based on some algorithms, and this is used? In the first two cases we would probably need a new formatting property. In the last case alternative glyphs could be supported by application without any change to ODF itself. How many alternative glyphs may exist for a Unicode character? Could there be more than two glyphs for a character, and is one of these the default? How are the alternative glyphs identified? Do they have names? If there is only a default glyph and an alternative glyph a boolean attribute may be sufficient. Otherwise there must be a way to identify the alternative glyphs. Best regards Michael Duane Nickull wrote: > I’d like to suggest if this is done, some form of anti-phishing > operation is established to prevent people from spoofing URL’s using > glyphs. IRI’s can be used to trick people. > > Duane > > > On 07/07/08 2:56 PM, "Patrick Durusau" <patrick@durusau.net> wrote: > > Rob, > > robert_weir@us.ibm.com wrote: > > > > This is a specific feature in OpenType called "Alternative Glyphs" > > where a single font can contain alternative glyphs for the same > > unicode character. > > > Yes, but that is the same point that I made from a different > perspective. > > With OpenType you have a font and hence a "default" glyph, so specifying > an "alternative" glyph makes sense. But that presumes the use of an > OpenType font which has that capability. > > My point was that in the abstract there is no default glyph, only the > Unicode character point. For more you either have to rely on font > technology (thanks for the OpenType reminder) or the markup layer. The > point being that the support does not reside in the Unicode encoding. > > Hope you are having a great day! > > Patrick > > > > See, for example: http://allthingsdesigned.com/alternativeglyphs > > > > -Rob > > > > Patrick Durusau <patrick@durusau.net> wrote on 07/07/2008 04:50:40 PM: > > > > > Greetings! > > > > > > I think there may be two separate cases that are being covered > by the > > > term "alternative" glyphs. > > > > > > Properly speaking, Unicode points represent characters and not > glyphs, > > > so any glyph associated with a character is a matter of the font you > > > choose and not an "alternative glyph." To say "alternative" glyph > > > implies there is some default glyph, which is not true. The glyphs > > shown > > > in the Unicode standard are illustrative only. > > > > > > The first case for "alternative" glyphs is where I wish to specify a > > > particular glyph for a character but other that perhaps being > > > unattractive display, the information content of the text is the > same. > > > Choosing any of the Latin fonts would be a good example. > > > > > > The second case and I am not sure how often it would come up, > would be > > > where I use a particular code point, say for Middle Egyptian, but I > > want > > > a particular glyph, which was used for that character in a > particular > > > historic period or type of text, and not some other glyph for that > > > character. While it is true that it is the "same" character, the > > meaning > > > on of the text would be changed if another glyph were > substituted for > > > the one I specify. Typically that sort of additional information is > > left > > > by Unicode to the markup layer. > > > > > > Rather than saying "alternative" glyphs I think it would be more > > > accurate to speak of specifying a particular glyph or set of > glyphs for > > > some portion of text. > > > > > > Considered that way, how it that different from specifying a > specific > > > font be used with some particular span of text? > > > > > > Hope everyone is having a great day! > > > > > > Patrick > > > > > > -- > > > Patrick Durusau > > > patrick@durusau.net > > > Chair, V1 - US TAG to JTC 1/SC 34 > > > Convener, JTC 1/SC 34/WG 3 (Topic Maps) > > > Editor, OpenDocument Format TC (OASIS), Project Editor ISO/IEC 26300 > > > Co-Editor, ISO/IEC 13250-1, 13250-5 (Topic Maps) > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC that > > > generates this mail. Follow this link to all your TCs in OASIS at: > > > > https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php > > > > > -- > Patrick Durusau > patrick@durusau.net > Chair, V1 - US TAG to JTC 1/SC 34 > Convener, JTC 1/SC 34/WG 3 (Topic Maps) > Editor, OpenDocument Format TC (OASIS), Project Editor ISO/IEC 26300 > Co-Editor, ISO/IEC 13250-1, 13250-5 (Topic Maps) > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC that > generates this mail. Follow this link to all your TCs in OASIS at: > https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php > > > > -- > ********************************************************************** > Senior Technical Evangelist - Adobe Systems, Inc. > Duane's World TV Show - http://www.duanesworldtv.org/ > Blog - http://technoracle.blogspot.com > Community Music - http://www.mix2r.com > My Band - http://www.myspace.com/22ndcentury > Adobe MAX 2008 - http://technoracle.blogspot.com/2007/08/adobe-max-2008.html > ********************************************************************** -- Michael Brauer, Technical Architect Software Engineering StarOffice/OpenOffice.org Sun Microsystems GmbH Nagelsweg 55 D-20097 Hamburg, Germany michael.brauer@sun.com http://sun.com/staroffice +49 40 23646 500 http://blogs.sun.com/GullFOSS Sitz der Gesellschaft: Sun Microsystems GmbH, Sonnenallee 1, D-85551 Kirchheim-Heimstetten Amtsgericht Muenchen: HRB 161028 Geschaeftsfuehrer: Thomas Schroeder, Wolfgang Engels, Dr. Roland Boemer Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrates: Martin Haering
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