Raw minutes for today.

[12:00] Simon Holdsworth: Audio conference: 

Meeting Number: * 913929 * (press * before and after the digits) 

Phone numbers: 

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[12:00] Simon Holdsworth: 1. Opening 

Introductions 
Roll call 
Scribe assignment 

Top 10 on the scribe list: 
Nimish Hathalia TIBCO Software Inc. 
Plamen Pavlov SAP AG 
Khanderao Kand Oracle Corporation 
Bryan Aupperle IBM 
Martin Chapman Oracle Corporation 
Simon Nash Individual 
Piotr Przybylski IBM 
Anish Karmarkar Oracle Corporation 
Eric Johnson TIBCO Software Inc. 
Ashok Malhotra Oracle Corporation 

Agenda bashing 

2. Approval of the minutes from 29th January 

http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/30992/SCA%20Bindings%20minutes%202009-01-29.doc 

3. Actions 

20080717-6 [Vladimir Savchenko] Send out a proposal for how WSDL bindings and portTypes relate to each other. Target: 14th August 
20080904-1 [Editors] update SOAP intent as per email http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200808/msg00072.html 
20081016-1 [Editors] Update JCA bindings spec to clarify there are no may provides or always provides intents 
20090108-1 [Editors] Produce cd02 with all resolved issues incorporated by January 29th 
20090122-1 [Simon Nash] Report back to bindings TC when JAVA-25 is resolved 
20090129-1 [Simon Holdsworth] Include time to discuss the underlying concern behind 20080717-6 at the virtual F2F 
20090129-2 [Simon Holdsworth] Update the proposed resolutions for 61, 62 and 63 to Incoroporate Anishs suggestion for conformance. 
20090129-3 [Bryan Aupperle] Come up with a new proposal for BINDINGS-55 to reflect the discussion. 

4. New Issues 

Please note, as per resolution on 9th October 2008, new issues received on the mailing list after Noon GMT 1st November can only be opened using the same voting rules as re-opening a closed issue (2/3 majority of a full TC vote) 

BINDINGS-67 
JMS URI vs. binding attributes/elements 
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-67 

5. CD draft status 

Current status of updates to the bindings specs with a view to accepting second CD. 

6. Open Issue Summary 

Discuss ownership/deferral of issues. 

Issues with proposed resolutions: 10 
Issues with identified owner, no resolution: 12 
Issues with no identified owner: 0 

7. Open Issue Discussion 

Open issues with proposed resolutions: 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-55 
WSDL 2.0 support 
Raiser: Bryan Aupperle, owner: Bryan Aupperle 
Status: Latest proposal: http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200902/msg00006.html 
Latest email: http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200902/msg00017.html 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-57 
Add a section documenting naming convention + be consistent on naming intents (binding.ws) 
Raiser: Anish Karmarkar, owner: Eric Johnson 
Status: Latest proposal at http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200902/msg00016.html 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-58 
Add a section documenting naming convention + be consistent on naming intents (binding.jca) 
Raiser: Anish Karmarkar, owner: Eric Johnson 
Status: Latest proposal at http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200902/msg00016.html 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-59 
Add a section documenting naming convention + be consistent on naming intents (binding.jms) 
Raiser: Anish Karmarkar, owner: Eric Johnson 
Status: Latest proposal at http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200902/msg00016.html 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-61 
Conformance statement numbering 
Raiser: Simon Holdsworth, owner: Simon Holdsworth 
Status: Latest proposal at http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200902/msg00010.html 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-62 
Conformance statement numbering 
Raiser: Simon Holdsworth, owner: Simon Holdsworth 
Status: Latest proposal at http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200902/msg00010.html 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-63 
Conformance statement numbering 
Raiser: Simon Holdsworth, owner: Simon Holdsworth 
Status: Latest proposal at http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200902/msg00010.html 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-64 
Remove conversation support from binding.ws 
Raiser: Simon Holdsworth, owner: Simon Holdsworth 
Status: Proposal in issue 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-65 
Remove references to SCA conversations from binding.jms 
Raiser: Simon Holdsworth, owner: Simon Holdsworth 
Status: Proposal in issue 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-66 
JMS message selector should not be specific to pub/sub 
Raiser: Simon Holdsworth, owner: Simon Holdsworth 
Status: Proposal in issue 

Open issues with identified resolution owner: 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-2 
How should SCA callback semantics be carried over Web Services? 
Raiser: Simon Nash, owner: Anish Karmarkar 
Status: Proposed resolution: http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200812/msg00043.html 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-21 
Support for callback and conversation ID-s in bindings 
Raiser: Peter Peshev, owner: Simon Nash 
Status: Awaiting resolution of JAVA-25 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-22 
Bindings specifications should provide exemplary Implementations for Callbacks and Conversations 
Raiser: Mike Edwards, owner: Piotr Przybylski 
Status: No proposed resolution 
Notes: JCA specific, remove mention of conversations 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-23 
@wsdlElement definition needs clarification on "equivalent" and use of WSDL 2.0 constructs 
Raiser: Eric Johnson, owner: Simon Nash 
Status: Specific resolution text required 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-25 
Is it required that every implementation of binding.ws support the soap intent? 
Raiser: Anish Karmarkar, owner: Anish Karmarkar 
Status: No current proposal. Latest email: http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200807/msg00006.html 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-29 
Properties on Bindings 
Raiser: Piotr Przybylski, owner: Piotr Przybylski 
Status: No current proposal 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-39 
JMS callback specification does not cater for callbacks using other bindings 
Raiser: Simon Holdsworth, owner Simon Holdsworth 
Status: Complete resolution proposal required 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-43 
Update binding.ws spec for wireFormat/operationSelection elements 
Raiser: Simon Holdsworth, owner: Anish Karmarkar 
Status: Specific resolution text required. 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-45 
Update binding.jca spec for wireFormat/operationSelection elements 
Raiser: Simon Holdsworth, owner: Piotr Przybylski 
Status: Specific resolution text required. 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-48 
How are mayProvide intents on bindings satisfied 
Raiser: Ashok Malhotra, owner: Simon Holdsworth 
Status: No current proposal; latest email: http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200810/msg00041.html 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-54 
Endpoint URI algorithm is unclear 
Raiser: Eric Johnson, owner: Eric Johnson 
Status: Initial proposal in JIRA. 

http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/BINDINGS-60 
JMS Default wire format insufficient to cover real world usage 
Raiser: Simon Holdsworth, owner: Simon Holdsworth 
Status: No proposal 

7. AOB

[12:03] Bryan Aupperle: Scribe: Bryan Aupperle

[12:08] Bryan Aupperle: Meeting is quorate at 76%

[12:09] Bryan Aupperle: Topic: Approval of the minutes from 29th January

[12:09] Bryan Aupperle: Minutes approved w/o

[12:09] Bryan Aupperle: Topic: Action Items

[12:09] Bryan Aupperle: 20080717-6 [Vladimir Savchenko] Send out a proposal for how WSDL bindings and portTypes relate to each other. Target: 14th August - Pending

[12:09] Bryan Aupperle: 20080904-1 [Editors] update SOAP intent as per email http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-bindings/200808/msg00072.html - Pending

[12:10] Bryan Aupperle: 20081016-1 [Editors] Update JCA bindings spec to clarify there are no may provides or always provides intents - Done

[12:10] Bryan Aupperle: 20090108-1 [Editors] Produce cd02 with all resolved issues incorporated by January 29th - Later in call

[12:10] Bryan Aupperle: 20090122-1 [Simon Nash] Report back to bindings TC when JAVA-25 is resolved - Pending

[12:10] Bryan Aupperle: 20090129-1 [Simon Holdsworth] Include time to discuss the underlying concern behind 20080717-6 at the virtual F2F - Pending

[12:10] Bryan Aupperle: 20090129-2 [Simon Holdsworth] Update the proposed resolutions for 61, 62 and 63 to Incoroporate Anishs suggestion for conformance. - Done

[12:11] Bryan Aupperle: 20090129-3 [Bryan Aupperle] Come up with a new proposal for BINDINGS-55 to reflect the discussion. - Done

[12:11] Bryan Aupperle: Topic: BINDINGS-67

[12:12] Bryan Aupperle: Simon H. reviews the issue

[12:16] Bryan Aupperle: Motion: Mike, second Piotr - Open issue 67

[12:16] Bryan Aupperle: Resolution: Motion passes w/o

[12:17] Bryan Aupperle: Topic: CD draft status

[12:18] Bryan Aupperle: AI open against editors to produce potential drafts for CD02.  Updates have been sent for JMS and JCA.

[12:19] anish i think martin meant 33 'resolved' issues not 33 'applied' issues

[12:19] Bryan Aupperle: Question is it appropriate to push forward to a second set of CDs?

[12:19] anish never mind, got my status confused

[12:20] Bryan Aupperle: Martin notes there are 33 applied issues across the 3 specs.

[12:22] Bryan Aupperle: Bryan: Would it be possible to have this as first item on F2F agenda?

[12:23] Bryan Aupperle: Simon H. will prepare a WS draft.

[12:24] Bryan Aupperle: Topic: Issue 55

[12:29] Bryan Aupperle: Simon N. notes that "(WSDL 1.1)" on line 87 can be removed.

[12:31] Bryan Aupperle: Anish: There should be a global MUST statement about WSDL 1.1.

[12:33] Bryan Aupperle: Simon N. There should be a global statement that all references to WSDL are references to WSDL 1.1.

[12:34] Bryan Aupperle: Simon N. A MUST statement that prohibits WSDL 2.0 seems a bit drastic.

[12:36] Bryan Aupperle: Anish SCA extensibility allows people to define new bindings types for things like WSDL 2.0, WADL, etc.  So it is appropriate to restrict binding.ws

[12:38] Bryan Aupperle: Mike binding.ws itself provides extensibility, so it is reasonable that adds elements/attributs that could accept a WSDL 2.0 document.

[12:43] Bryan Aupperle: Simon N. The degree of overlap guides the appropriate extension approach.

[12:45] Bryan Aupperle: Eric: Proposal says /@wsdli:wsdlLocation MUST point to WSDL 1.1.  But a non-conforming implementation could point to a 2.0 document.

[12:45] Bryan Aupperle: Anish Why is wsdlElement not restricted?

[12:46] Bryan Aupperle: Simon H. Add MUST restrictions to each option of wsdlElement.

[12:47] Mike Edwards: one thing to point out is that the form of expression in the fragments like:
#wsdl.port(foo) is actually formally a WSDL 2.0 form

[12:47] Mike Edwards: there is an equivalent form defined for WSDL 1.1, but it is something like:
#wsdl11.port(foo)  !!

[12:48] Mike Edwards: so it seems odd to use the current expression forms for WSDL 1.1 documents....

[12:51] Bryan Aupperle: Anish Reviews why we chose to restrict SCA 1.1 to WSDL 1.1 and relates this to proper extensibility choice.

[12:53] Martin C: extensions cannot contradict the normative MUSTS and MUST NOTS

[12:55] Mike Edwards: I have no idea how you could ever enforce that

[12:55] Mike Edwards: exactly

[12:58] Bryan Aupperle: Discussion about global restriction vs specific restrictions.

[13:00] anish: mike, the WSDL 2.0 component URI are ported to apply to WSDL 1.1 as well, just as wsdlLocation is

[13:02] Eric Johnson: Motion text: I move that the TC assert a direction for the resolution of issue-55, by add normative statements to the @wsdlElement and other attributes as appropriate such that they can only point to WSDL 1.1 constructs.

[13:03] Bryan Aupperle: Simon N. seconds

[13:04] Bryan Aupperle: Anish advocates adding a normative statement to the binding element itself.

[13:05] Bryan Aupperle: Eric moves to table the motions (Dave seconds).

[13:05] Bryan Aupperle: Topic: AOB

[13:05] Bryan Aupperle: Straggler role.

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