[Date Prev] | [Thread Prev] | [Thread Next] | [Date Next] -- [Date Index] | [Thread Index] | [List Home]
Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Re: Autonomous Services?
+1 In fact, I am hard put to understand how you can *store* semantics. You can only store data. The best that you can do is store a description of the semantics; but that is not the same thing. On that theme, IBM and others at the U of Georgia recently released a paper on semantic annotations of Web services. Have not yet had the time to digest this properly, but could be interesting... if IBM makes a play in the standards space with this. The link to the paper is: http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/g/g.nsf/img/semanticsdocs/$file/ wssemantic_annotation.pdf Frank On May 2, 2005, at 9:30 AM, Duane Nickull wrote: > John > (aka "Meggan". Hey - how you dress in private is none of our > business ;-) > > Just joking!! > > This is a good question. > > The registry is one way that one could store semantics however > semantics are not required to be explicit and there are other > models for sharing information beside registry. At the abstract > level it represents a facet of the model where the information > available is meaningful. Therefore, a registry will not be in the > reference model as a normative, core element. > > We decided to add a non normative section to explain some of these > manifestations. How one goes from "Data Model" to Messages, > Availability to Registry, Policy to on the wire security etc. > > It would be great if you could hook up with the person with this > section and offer proof reading services. Value your input. > > Duane > > > > > meggan hardin wrote: > > >> My assumptions (so far) about the central metadata concepts have >> been that the reg/rep holds this data. Are we delving to the level >> of defining specific types of resources / components that should >> be included in a major component such as the reg/rep? I think that >> the concept of storing semantic metadata as an independent >> integration reference point is important enough to be included in >> the RM. >> >> FWIW - Contivo terms the semantic metadata repository the >> "enterprise vocabulary"... >> >> john >> >> Smith, Martin wrote: >> >> >>> Violent agreement. >>> martin >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> From: Schuldt, Ron L [mailto:ron.l.schuldt@lmco.com] >>> Sent: Fri 4/29/2005 6:39 PM >>> To: Smith, Martin; Sharma, Sameer; Duane Nickull; >>> john@crossconnections.ws >>> Cc: ebSOA OASIS TC; soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org >>> Subject: RE: [soa-rm] Re: Autonomous Services? >>> >>> >>> >>> Sameer will correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that his >>> intent was >>> to include the notion of central metadata within a "Reference >>> Architecture" not the Reference Model. Appendix B is the place where >>> example use cases would be defined. I suspect that Sameer might be >>> willing to submit an example use case. >>> >>> Ron Schuldt >>> Senior Staff Systems Architect >>> Lockheed Martin Enterprise Information Systems >>> 11757 W. Ken Caryl Ave. >>> #F521 Mail Point DC5694 >>> Littleton, CO 80127 >>> 303-977-1414 >>> ron.l.schuldt@lmco.com >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Smith, Martin [mailto:Martin.Smith@DHS.GOV] >>> Sent: Friday, April 29, 2005 4:19 PM >>> To: Sharma, Sameer; Duane Nickull; john@crossconnections.ws >>> Cc: ebSOA OASIS TC; soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org >>> Subject: RE: [soa-rm] Re: Autonomous Services? >>> >>> >>> Sameer - - >>> >>> Let me practice being Matt <g>: >>> >>> The term " 'central' metadata" presumes a specific implementation >>> strategy and should not be in the RM. Perhaps "metadata >>> associated with >>> the service should be available in the environment." Now in my >>> example >>> SOA for Appendix B, I'll probably show a UDDI services directory, or >>> maybe a combo registry/repository that can in fact store all the >>> description metadata. >>> >>> Martin >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Sharma, Sameer [mailto:sameer.sharma@lmco.com] >>> Sent: Friday, April 29, 2005 2:16 PM >>> To: Smith, Martin; Duane Nickull; john@crossconnections.ws >>> Cc: ebSOA OASIS TC; soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org >>> Subject: RE: [soa-rm] Re: Autonomous Services? >>> >>> >>> My feeling is that some of what you are alluding to might be >>> covered by >>> UDDI, >>> however as is happening in an instance of SOA deployment that I am >>> involved >>> in - UDDI by itself is not going to be sufficient to express all the >>> metadata >>> that is needed for a client to successfully and contextually >>> interpret >>> all >>> that a Web Service does. >>> >>> My attempted solution is to capture this additional metadata by >>> leveraging >>> central metadata services of my enterprise. I guess what I am >>> saying is >>> that >>> the concept of "central metadata" might be a valid candidate as a >>> component of >>> the Reference Architecture we are considering. >>> >>> Since I was unable to participate in the F2F, (due to some last >>> minute >>> commitments that I got called into), if this topic was discussed, >>> please >>> accept my apologies for bringing it up again. >>> >>> Thanks! >>> >>> >>> >>> L >>> Sameer Sharma >>> Principal Applications Architect >>> Lockheed Martin Corporation >>> Chief Technology Office (CTO) >>> 12506 Lake Underhill Road - MP 166 >>> Orlando, FL-32825 >>> Tel: (407) 306 5640 >>> Fax:(407) 306 1392 >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Smith, Martin [mailto:Martin.Smith@DHS.GOV] >>> Sent: Friday, April 29, 2005 1:38 PM >>> To: Duane Nickull; john@crossconnections.ws >>> Cc: ebSOA OASIS TC; soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org >>> Subject: RE: [soa-rm] Re: Autonomous Services? >>> >>> Folks - - >>> >>> On my way home from N'awlins Wed night, I had a thought on this >>> discussion. >>> >>> I think we expect services in an SOA to be independent of the >>> kind of >>> shared contextual knowledge we usually presume within a local >>> computing >>> environment. We expect that the requesting service will be able to >>> obtain all the info it needs to use the responding service >>> successfully >>> by processing the responding service's description metadata. I >>> do think >>> this is a core characteristic of SOA services. >>> >>> I'm not suggesting we reinstate the use of the word "autonomous" >>> as a >>> handle for this concept since it demonstrably caused confusion at >>> the >>> f2f. If we need a handle, perhaps "self-sufficient" or >>> "self-documenting" or "introspective" (naaah - forget that one.) >>> >>> Martin >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Duane Nickull [mailto:dnickull@adobe.com] >>> Sent: Friday, April 29, 2005 12:43 PM >>> To: john@crossconnections.ws >>> Cc: ebSOA OASIS TC; soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org >>> Subject: [soa-rm] Re: Autonomous Services? >>> >>> We discussed and the submitter withdrew the submission pending >>> clarification on exactly what is meant by Autonomous nature WRT >>> services. It may be re-submitted and probably will however we do >>> not >>> have consensus on it at present. >>> >>> Duane >>> >>> john c hardin wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> Duane and SOA-RM group - >>>> Can someone enlighten the members of the eb-soa group regarding a >>>> description of Autonomous Services? Any resulting conversations >>>> from >>>> the meetings this week, on the subject of Autonomous Services >>>> would be >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> good also. >>>> >>>> thanks >>>> john >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> *********** >>> Senior Standards Strategist - Adobe Systems, Inc. - http:// >>> www.adobe.com >>> Vice Chair - UN/CEFACT Bureau Plenary - http://www.unece.org/cefact/ >>> Adobe Enterprise Developer Resources - >>> http://www.adobe.com/enterprise/developer/main.html >>> *********** >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> > > -- > *********** > Senior Standards Strategist - Adobe Systems, Inc. - http:// > www.adobe.com > Vice Chair - UN/CEFACT Bureau Plenary - http://www.unece.org/cefact/ > Adobe Enterprise Developer Resources - http://www.adobe.com/ > enterprise/developer/main.html > *********** > >
[Date Prev] | [Thread Prev] | [Thread Next] | [Date Next] -- [Date Index] | [Thread Index] | [List Home]