RE: [soa-rm] Identity (Was RE: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing an XML Data Model In Your SOA - Best Practices")

["Chiusano Joseph" <chiusano_joseph@bah.com>]

+1 on everything you wrote Matt.

Joe

Joseph Chiusano
Booz Allen Hamilton
Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com
 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Matthew MacKenzie [mailto:mattm@adobe.com] 
> Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 9:29 PM
> To: SOA-RM
> Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Identity (Was RE: [soa-rm] Good Recent 
> SOA Piece: "Managing an XML Data Model In Your SOA - Best Practices")
> 
> Joe,
> 
> The expedia example is a great one.  System architectures 
> deal with this kind of issue by having a default 
> pseudo-principal that is passed around or assumed in the 
> absence of a  "real" principle.  As important as identity is 
> to most of the enterprise architectures that I encounter on a 
> daily basis, I really am not convinced that the concept 
> belongs in the RM as a core concept.  I wouldn't cry into my 
> beer if it was mentioned in passing...just not up there in 
> lights with "Services" and "Policy".
> 
> -Matt
> 
> On 9-May-05, at 9:24 PM, Chiusano Joseph wrote:
> 
> > Matt,
> >
> > Interesting thoughts. My first inclination was to say that we could 
> > consider requiring identity as a component of our RM - i.e. 
> in order 
> > to be in conformance with our RM, identity has to be 
> present in a SOA 
> > "operation" (whatever term we use).
> >
> > But what about cases in which a user makes a request 
> anonymously, such 
> > as is done with Web sites? For example, browsing for 
> flights/hotels to 
> > Paris on Expedia.com (like I did today).
> >
> > Joe
> >
> > Joseph Chiusano
> > Booz Allen Hamilton
> > Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com
> >
> >
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Matthew MacKenzie [mailto:mattm@adobe.com]
> >> Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 8:51 PM
> >> To: Chiusano Joseph
> >> Cc: SOA-RM
> >> Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Identity (Was RE: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA 
> >> Piece: "Managing an XML Data Model In Your SOA - Best Practices")
> >>
> >> Is it true that all future s-o architectures will require identity?
> >> Can we make that statement?  Do we want to make that statement?
> >>
> >> -Matt
> >> On 9-May-05, at 8:48 PM, Chiusano Joseph wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>> Just wanted to voice my support for incorporating the
> >>>
> >> abstract concept
> >>
> >>> of identity in our RM. I also note that this abstract
> >>>
> >> concept can be
> >>
> >>> mapped to multiple concrete concepts, such as Liberty Federated 
> >>> Identity, SAML tokens, etc. (getting the hang of this RM stuff!)
> >>>
> >>> Joe
> >>>
> >>> Joseph Chiusano
> >>> Booz Allen Hamilton
> >>> Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>> From: Duane Nickull [mailto:dnickull@adobe.com]
> >>>> Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 11:36 AM
> >>>> Cc: soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org
> >>>> Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing 
> an XML Data 
> >>>> Model In Your SOA - Best Practices"
> >>>>
> >>>> Sally:
> >>>>
> >>>> Good catch.  Ajay is a voting member of this group and I
> >>>>
> >> am sure he
> >>
> >>>> can submit them to the member submissions area.
> >>>>
> >>>> While we didn't take on the gist of the work due to the
> >>>>
> >> fact it was
> >>
> >>>> very concrete, the abstract concept of identity is
> >>>>
> >> probably at least
> >>
> >>>> worth a discussion at some point.  Assuming that SOA is a set of 
> >>>> patterns implementable across multiple, unknown
> >>>>
> >> environments, there
> >>
> >>>> is probably a section in the service description that
> >>>>
> >> should be able
> >>
> >>>> to make some sort of identity declaration and/or present
> >>>>
> >> credentials.
> >>
> >>>>
> >>>> If anyone wants to get into this now, perhaps we should 
> rename the 
> >>>> thread to "Identity".
> >>>>
> >>>> Duane
> >>>>
> >>>> Sally St. Amand wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> Having just read this blog I need to ask if the "identity"
> >>>>> presentation (made at the F2F) you spoke of on Wed's call
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>> related to
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> this same point? I was not at the F2F. Did the presenter
> >>>>>
> >> provide a
> >>
> >>>>> copy of the slides?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> John Harby <jharby@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>     This is an excellent blog entry from Phil:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>     http://www.looselycoupled.com/blog/lc00aa00096.html
> >>>>>
> >>>>>     On 5/6/05, Chiusano Joseph wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Forwarding a good recent SOA piece[1] for those interested in
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>     reading it.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Covers the notion of an integrated data model as a
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>> foundational
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>     concept;
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> also presents a 6-layer approach to SOA (about mid-article).
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Joe
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> [1] http://www.tdan.com/i032ht02.htm
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Joseph Chiusano
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Booz Allen Hamilton
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> ***********
> >>>> Senior Standards Strategist - Adobe Systems, Inc. - 
> >>>> http://www.adobe.com Chair - OASIS Service Oriented Architecture 
> >>>> Reference Model Technical Committee - 
> >>>> http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/tc_home.php?wg_abbrev=soa-rm
> >>>> Vice Chair - UN/CEFACT Bureau Plenary -
> >>>>
> >> http://www.unece.org/cefact/
> >>
> >>>> Adobe Enterprise Developer Resources  - 
> >>>> http://www.adobe.com/enterprise/developer/main.html
> >>>> ***********
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> 
>