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Subject: RE: [soa-rm] [For Issue #525] RE: [soa-rm] Groups - Proposed SOA-RM Relationship Names (SOA-RM Relationships Names.xls) uploaded
Meant to send DRM 2.0 link: http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/egov/documents/DRM_2_0_Final.pdf (see document pages 21, 41, and 59 for concept maps with relationship names) Joe Joseph Chiusano Associate Booz Allen Hamilton 700 13th St. NW, Suite 1100 Washington, DC 20005 O: 202-508-6514 C: 202-251-0731 Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com -----Original Message----- From: Chiusano Joseph [mailto:chiusano_joseph@bah.com] Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 1:36 PM To: soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org Subject: RE: [soa-rm] [For Issue #525] RE: [soa-rm] Groups - Proposed SOA-RM Relationship Names (SOA-RM Relationships Names.xls) uploaded Hi Duane, Do you see value in providing relationship names for the purpose of clarity of understanding, apart from any particular technology? FWIW, we included relationship names in the DRM (just as one example out there). Would be interested in your take on this, as well as others. Joe Joseph Chiusano Associate Booz Allen Hamilton 700 13th St. NW, Suite 1100 Washington, DC 20005 O: 202-508-6514 C: 202-251-0731 Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com -----Original Message----- From: Duane Nickull [mailto:dnickull@adobe.com] Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 1:33 PM To: Rex Brooks; Chiusano Joseph; soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org Subject: RE: [soa-rm] [For Issue #525] RE: [soa-rm] Groups - Proposed SOA-RM Relationship Names (SOA-RM Relationships Names.xls) uploaded Guys: If you are going to do this, I would suggest that you define or use some form of FOL before trying to map this. I also suggest that this be done in a sub TC so we don't clutter up the main list for those who have no interest in mapping the concepts to an ontology. Perhaps one of you can propose this but you also have to consider the original charter does not state we are going to deliver this. I think it would be okay but we would have to check. Some of the concepts I see the names for are very concrete. How can you have a "thing" consisting of another thing in the abstract? Without first defining the FOL, this is not meaningful to me. Rex is correct - the exact version of OWL must also be specified. The abstract relationship types are much more complex than they first appear. I usually borrow from SUMO and use the defined FOL binary associations. The supported types are very thoroughly documented. An example of FOL is the definition of binary predicate: (instance instance BinaryPredicate) (domain instance 1 Entity) (domain instance 2 SetOrClass) (documentation instance "An object is an &%instance of a &%SetOrClass if it is included in that &%SetOrClass. An individual may be an instance of many classes, some of which may be subclasses of others. Thus, there is no assumption in the meaning of &%instance about specificity or uniqueness.") This appears to only be applicable to concrete classes and not abstract classes however. (instance inverse BinaryPredicate) (instance inverse IrreflexiveRelation) (instance inverse IntransitiveRelation) (instance inverse SymmetricRelation) (domain inverse 1 BinaryRelation) (domain inverse 2 BinaryRelation) (documentation inverse "The inverse of a &%BinaryRelation is a relation in which all the tuples of the original relation are reversed. In other words, one &%BinaryRelation is the inverse of another if they are equivalent when their arguments are swapped.") (=> (inverse ?REL1 ?REL2) (forall (?INST1 ?INST2) (<=> (holds ?REL1 ?INST1 ?INST2) (holds ?REL2 ?INST2 ?INST1)))) Notwithstanding the foregoing, the task at hand is to ask the question "what types of relationships are you trying to label?". An intransitive binary relationship has completely different properties that reflexsives do. The simple story is down to "if A means X to B, what does B mean to X?". Can B even be aware of X? Is the relationship symmetrical or asymmetrical. Without these items defined, the conversation is a non starter. There is lots of work to do on this. Duane ******************************* Adobe Systems, Inc. - http://www.adobe.com Vice Chair - UN/CEFACT http://www.uncefact.org/ Chair - OASIS SOA Reference Model Technical Committee Personal Blog - http://technoracle.blogspot.com/ ******************************* -----Original Message----- From: Rex Brooks [mailto:rexb@starbourne.com] Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 10:03 AM To: Chiusano Joseph; soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org Subject: Re: [soa-rm] [For Issue #525] RE: [soa-rm] Groups - Proposed SOA-RM Relationship Names (SOA-RM Relationships Names.xls) uploaded Yup, If we are going to provide relationship names to accommodate OWL, we need to be specific about which version of OWL we want to support or CAN support, given the abstract nature of the Reference Model. I would be happy with OWL DL, less happy with OWL Lite, and opposed to OWL Full. Going into the reasons is something we should take up in the f2f, because it is too lengthy for an email. However, I would prefer to put this on hold for a v2.0 which I suspect is almost unavoidable, though one hoped it would not be given sufficient abstraction. That said, I would select relationship names directly from the realm of RDF in general and RDF Schema in particular and, for me, OWL DL and not make up any new ones and I would start with extremely basic, very abstract, relationships and not use any terms that are open to interpretation. In other words, I would try to start with compliance with first-order logic. Going beyond basic classes and properties to subClassOf and subPropertyOf is about as far as I would go. Otherwise we open the door to a purely endless exercise in futility. It would take a lot of work and I don't think we have time for it in this version. This is probably not a good idea. I would prefer to see it be a separate specification, with its own set of requirements starting with mereology from general to specific, where you define things in the isPartOf relationship not the consistsOf relationship. The difference is that there are some accepted rules for mereology, and it works with formal logic. If we are going to accommodate OWL now we need to make sure we are not setting ourselves up for a bunch of logical contradictions by going full steam ahead before looking at the landscape and figuring out what kind of roadmap we need. I think the spreadsheet is a good way to get concepts out where you can look at them and pick away at them. I just don't think this is likely to get well baked enough to include in this round, and perhaps ought to be its own specification, a SOA ontology based on the RM. That would give us plenty of time to noodle and boil this down to workability. Regards, Rex At 11:05 AM -0400 5/1/06, Chiusano Joseph wrote: >I've updated the subject for this thread to reflect the Issue #. Any >thoughts on the proposed relationship names? > >Joe > >Joseph Chiusano >Associate >Booz Allen Hamilton > >700 13th St. NW, Suite 1100 >Washington, DC 20005 >O: 202-508-6514 >C: 202-251-0731 >Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com > >-----Original Message----- >From: chiusano_joseph@bah.com [mailto:chiusano_joseph@bah.com] >Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2006 8:52 PM >To: soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org >Subject: [soa-rm] Groups - Proposed SOA-RM Relationship Names (SOA-RM >Relationships Names.xls) uploaded > >The document named Proposed SOA-RM Relationship Names (SOA-RM >Relationships >Names.xls) has been submitted by Mr. Joseph Chiusano to the OASIS SOA >Reference Model TC document repository. > >Document Description: >This is related to issue #525, which described "the potential creation >of an OWL ontology for SOA-RM to be considered as an upper ontology for >different architectures guided by SOA-RM, in order to provide semantic >interoperability between these architectures and their implementations >(instances), once they are SOA-RM based.". The submitter expressed how >the lack of relationship names in our spec inhibited this. > >I have worked with the submitter and Ken Laskey to create this >spreadsheet of proposed relationship names for all figures that contain >directed relationships. Please review and comment; you may wish to use >the spreadsheet row # when referring to specific relationships. We have >provided 2 sets of proposed names for each relationship (except the >final >one) - one primary, and one alternate. > >Please also keep in mind that some of the proposed relationship names >may bring with them minor alterations in the relationships themselves. > >Thanks, >Joe > >View Document Details: >http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/soa-rm/document.php?docume n >t_id=17877 > >Download Document: >http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/soa-rm/download.php/17877/ S >OA-RM%20Relationships%20Names.xls > > >PLEASE NOTE: If the above links do not work for you, your email >application may be breaking the link into two pieces. You may be able >to copy and paste the entire link address into the address field of your >web browser. > >-OASIS Open Administration -- Rex Brooks President, CEO Starbourne Communications Design GeoAddress: 1361-A Addison Berkeley, CA 94702 Tel: 510-849-2309
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