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Subject: RE: [ubl-dev] UUID
My feeling on this is that 1) as a technical feature a UUID concept suggests uniqueness even between different copies of a document BUT 2) as a business semantics feature it is required that the same UUID be used for separate copies of the same document As such the UUID in UBL is a semantic feature and is there for business and legal purposes in the legal documents such as the Invoice However I'm a little concerned that the suggested use for ID/IDREF overlaps a little with the requirement for a technical feature so if there is a temptation to place technical (1) requirements over semantics (2) then this temptation should be resisted and something designed for the technical added instead (e.g. actual XML ID/IDREF). As an example to help demonstrate the importance of preserving the semantic business function consider an invoice number: One wouldn't expect a copy invoice to have a different invoice number to the original. As an example of the separate nature (separate 'layer' nature) of the technical requirements consider that a copy in the case of UBL is different from the original anyway by virtue of its having CopyIndicator set to true. Thus it is tempting to give such a document a different UUID if only the technical matter is considered and if the UUID BBIE is used for that there is obviously a breach of the semantic requirements. All the best Stephen Green Quoting Martin Forsberg <martin.forsberg@amnis.se>: > Hi Juha, > > When the xml-file is generated the UUID is created, but the > transmission and re-transmissions might happen in a later step. It > is still the same xml-file instance that is re-transmitted. The UUID > is changed first when the document issuer is re-creating the xml > instance. This means that it might be up to the implementor and the > issuing system if the UUID is the same or changed when transmitting. > > In a scenario where conversions (between different document > standards) are involved the UUID might be lost and re created on the > path to the receiver. This is also something to consider when using > UUID on a larger scale. (i.e. UBL -> EDIFACT -> UBL). > > One other thing to consider is the definition of a document copy > (using the copy indicator). If the UUID is changed when the issuer > issues a copy, is the copy then really a copy? (the UUID is not > copied) > > Regards, > Martin Forsberg > Single Face To Industry, Sweden > > > -----Original Message----- > From: David RR Webber (XML) [mailto:david@drrw.info] > Sent: den 2 september 2006 18:14 > To: Juha Ikä,valko > Cc: UBL-Dev > Subject: RE: [ubl-dev] UUID > > Juha, > > If you are using ebXML messaging and reliable messaging then the > delivery is controlled to the ebXML messaging specification (ebMS). > > Retrying will occur to the level of tries specified in the CPA > between partners. > > Failure recovery is then determined by the BPSS work flow. > > If a subsequent re-send is permitted - then yes - it will be an > entirely new exchange - but the business information of course can > be the same. > > It is the job and purpose of the ebMS to avoid duplicate messages - > and again that is also part of the specification. > > Tools like Hermes V1 from http://www.freebxml.org implement a > significant portion of this reliable interchange system. > > UUID algorithm is an open public specification and computes a unique > 32 byte string based on date/time and IP location. > > DW > > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: [ubl-dev] UUID > From: Juha Ikävalko <juha.ikavalko@tieke.fi> > Date: Tue, August 22, 2006 8:29 am > To: "UBL-Dev" <ubl-dev@lists.oasis-open.org> > > Hi Developers, > > > > I got a question what is the purpose of UUID in UBL documents? > Definition says "A computer-generated universally unique identifier > (UUID) for the Order instance". My conclusion: ID identifies the > order on the business level and UUID identifies an order message > instance on the technical level. Thus, if a seller is not able to > receive the order message at the first attempt, a buyer sends a new > order message with same ID but different UUID. Is this the right > conclusion? > > > > Regards, > > > > Juha Ikävalko > > TIEKE Tietoyhteiskunnan kehittämiskeskus ry TIEKE Finnish > Information Society Development Centre Salomonkatu 17 A, 10th floor > FI-00100 Helsinki Tel +358 9 4763 0410 Fax +358 9 4763 0399 > juha.ikavalko@tieke.fi http://www.tieke.fi <http://www.tieke.fi> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: ubl-dev-unsubscribe@lists.oasis-open.org > For additional commands, e-mail: ubl-dev-help@lists.oasis-open.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: ubl-dev-unsubscribe@lists.oasis-open.org > For additional commands, e-mail: ubl-dev-help@lists.oasis-open.org > >
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