RE: [ubl] Minutes of Atlantic UBL TC call 2 November 2005

["Stephen Green" <stephen_green@bristol-city.gov.uk>]

Mmm.. namespaces including or not including the minor
version number didn't figure as part of the study - it was
a given, at the time, that the namespaces would include
a minor version number. (That could be the subject of 
further study, but see below.)

*******************************************
This raises a further important point - it seems to me
that the decisions for questions 1 (for minor versions just
do a delta) and 2 (not include the minor version number 
in the namespace) are also contradictory.
*******************************************

I don't see how, with UBL's highly nested schemas, you can
do a delta without use of derivation and substitution groups;
and to do this you have to import a previous schema/set of
schemas which must therefore have a different namespace.

To me what we had with the 1.0 NDR came as a package,
apart from the need to allow substitution groups (as I think I
previously proved). I don't see how you can change any of
it, other than as recommended by the work team to allow
the substitution groups, without it breaking. If the TC is asking
for deltas in minor version schemas then we need minor 
version numbers in namespaces and substitution groups. If
substitution groups and namespaces with minor version 
numbers are not to used (or just one or the other of these)
then I don't see how we can have the deltas - unless someone
can demonstrate this adequately to the SSC.

All the best

Steve



>>> Grimley Michael J NPRI <GrimleyMJ@Npt.NUWC.Navy.Mil> 04/11/05 13:51:57 >>>
Steve,

Was this with the assumption that the namespace would change? If everything is still in the namespace, is this still true?
 
Thanks,
Mike


-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Green [mailto:stephen_green@bristol-city.gov.uk] 
Sent: Friday, 04 November 2005 0651
To: stephen_green@bristol-city.gov.uk; ubl@lists.oasis-open.org 
Subject: Re: [ubl] Minutes of Atlantic UBL TC call 2 November 2005

Sorry, I quoted the wrong question for one of these, I meant Questions 1 and 4 rather than questions 3 and 4

>>> "Stephen Green" <stephen_green@bristol-city.gov.uk> 04/11/05 
>>> 11:45:46 >>>
Please forgive my possible niaivety: I think these two decisions are contradictory (I'll be pleasantly surprised if someone proves me wrong).

I thought with the versioning team we had proved that you cannot publish deltas for highly nested schemas like UBL without using substitution groups.

All the best

Steve


The minutes read:

Question 3: What, specifically, determines whether a new version of the schema is actually a 'minor' or 'major' release? (If the schema only includes the deltas, and utilizes xsd:derivation concepts, the answer should be simpler than if the versioning is strictly model-based.)

   Discussion: We have already adopted the definitions given by
   Eduardo Gutentag in his message of 18 October 2005, but we note
   that his definition of backward compatibility transposes X and
   Y:

      c) backwards compatibility -- a schema X is said to be
      backwards compatible with a schema Y if documents that
      validate against schema X also validate against schema Y,
      and schema X follows (in time, or in version) schema Y.

      In other words, if all documents that validate against
      MySchema v1.0 also validate against MySchema v1.1, then
      MySchema v1.1 is said to be backwards compatible; but there
      is no expectation that any document that validates against
      MySchema v1.1 must also by necessity validate against
      MySchema v1.0

   The example shows that the definition should read "and schema Y
   follows (in time, or in version) schema X."

Question 4: Is (are?) Substitution Groups still on the table?

   AGREED: We will not use substitution groups for minor
   versioning.




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