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Subject: RE: [uddi-spec] Groups - uddi-spec-tc-prop023-keyedReferenceGroup-20040209.docuploaded


Yes, I believe I understood the intent, I just disagree that scenario 3 is a clear enough way to specify that. I do not feel that allowing a lowerEndpoint to be higher than an upperEndpoint make good sense. it's much more intuitive IMO to have lowerendpoint=10, upperEndpoint=20 and inversion=TRUE, which means: x is in the set of (x<10, x>20), which effectively creates two unibounded ranges. If we're still not on the same page please let me know.

Thanks,
Tom Bellwood Phone: (512) 838-9957 (external); TL: 678/9957 (internal)
IBM Digital Media Standards Project Office Lead
Co-Chair, OASIS UDDI Specification TC
STSM - Emerging Technologies
IBM Corporation

To: Tom Bellwood/Austin/IBM@IBMUS, "Matthew J. Dovey" <matthew.dovey@oucs.ox.ac.uk>
cc: <uddi-spec@lists.oasis-open.org>
Subject: RE: [uddi-spec] Groups - uddi-spec-tc-prop023-keyedReferenceGroup-20040209.doc uploaded




Tom,
 
scenario 3 has TWO ranges - one that runs up to 10 (no lower bound), and one that runs down to 20 (no upper bound), combined with OR.
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Bellwood [mailto:bellwood@us.ibm.com]
Sent: Mon 08-Mar-04 7:49
To: Matthew J. Dovey
Cc: uddi-spec@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: RE: [uddi-spec] Groups - uddi-spec-tc-prop023-keyedReferenceGroup-20040209.doc uploaded



Hi Matthew,

I agree that there is redundancy between the first two scenarios you list, but I'm not sure I like getting rid of it entirely if that means we leave things simpler to use. I can probably be convinced by strong opinions here though. Regarding scenario 3, ("Using a range with  upperEndpoint=10 and another range with lowerEndpoint=20 in a conjunctive  OR"), this doesn't make sense to me.  I define a lowerEndpoint to always  be <= upperEndpoint, at least that was the intention, hence the need to  allow inversion of the criteria (by some means), which would yield a criteria  outside these bounds.  Allowing the transposition of lower and upper  bounds does not seem intuitive behavior to me, so I would submit that this  scenario should be considered invalid.  Do you  agree?

Thanks,
Tom Bellwood Phone: (512) 838-9957 (external); TL: 678/9957 (internal)
IBM Digital Media Standards Project Office Lead
Co-Chair, OASIS UDDI Specification TC
STSM - Emerging Technologies
IBM Corporation

To: "Matthew J. Dovey" <matthew.dovey@oucs.ox.ac.uk>, Tom Bellwood/Austin/IBM@IBMUS
cc: <uddi-spec@lists.oasis-open.org>
Subject: RE: [uddi-spec] Groups - uddi-spec-tc-prop023-keyedReferenceGroup-20040209.doc uploaded



Its been pointed out that I didn't  elaborate the point behind my
question.

Whilst I don't see  any problem in alternative ways of expressing the
same thing, there isn't  any reason to add new ways unnecessarily. So
whilst it is fine to have the  latter two as alternates (since we use
NotOperands elsewhere), I can't see  the purpose of also having the first
one. i.e. unless I've missed some  subtlety, I can't see the need for the
inverted  attribute.

Matthew

> -----Original  Message-----
> From: Matthew J. Dovey
> [mailto:matthew.dovey@computing-services.oxford.ac.uk]
>  Sent: 26 February 2004 09:51
> To: Tom Bellwood
> Cc:  uddi-spec@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: RE: [uddi-spec] Groups  -
> uddi-spec-tc-prop023-keyedReferenceGroup-20040209.doc  uploaded
>
> Reviewing this, can you clarify what the difference  is between
>
> Using a range of lowerEndpoint=10 and  upperEndpoint=20 with
> the inverted attribute=true
>
>  Using a range of lowerEndpoint=10
> and upperEndpoint=20 with the  inverted attribute=false using
> find_tModelNotOperands
>
>  Using a range with upperEndpoint=10
> and another range with  lowerEndpoint=20 in a conjunctive OR
>
> (Of course the  inclusive/exclusive attribute would need to be set
>  accordingly)
>
> Matthew
>
> > -----Original  Message-----
> > From: Tom Bellwood [mailto:bellwood@us.ibm.com]
> >  Sent: 11 February 2004 18:57
> > To: Matthew J. Dovey
> >  Cc: uddi-spec@lists.oasis-open.org
> > Subject: RE: [uddi-spec]  Groups -
> > uddi-spec-tc-prop023-keyedReferenceGroup-20040209.doc  uploaded
> >
> > Hi Matthew,
> >
> > We've  adopted your suggestion during today's FTF discussion.
> > The next  version posted will have that update.
> >
> >
> >  Thanks,
> > Tom Bellwood Phone: (512) 838-9957 (external); TL:  678/9957
> > (internal) IBM Digital Media Standards Project Office  Lead
> Co-Chair,
> > OASIS UDDI Specification TC STSM -  Emerging Technologies IBM
> > Corporation
> >
>  >
> > To: Tom Bellwood/Austin/IBM@IBMUS
> > cc:  <uddi-spec@lists.oasis-open.org>
> > Subject: RE: [uddi-spec]  Groups -
> > uddi-spec-tc-prop023-keyedReferenceGroup-20040209.doc  uploaded
> >
> >
> >
> > Tom,
>  >
> > Thanks for picking this up - I'm afraid my attention  has
> been diverted
> > at present!
> >
> >  "Note that a rangeMatch element must include either an
>  upperEndpoint,
> > lowerEndpoint, or both" - do we need to say this.  A range with no
> > endpoints would match everything (an inverted  range with no
> endpoints
> > would match nothing).
>  >
> > Rather than have an upperEndpointOperator (and
>  lowerEndpointOperator),
> > how about a boolean inclusive=true/false  (or exclusive=true/false).
> > That way we can have the same type  (endpoint) for both
> upper and lower
> > endpoints.
>  >
> > Matthew
> >
> >
> >
> >  > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: bellwood@us.ibm.com  [mailto:bellwood@us.ibm.com]
>  > > Sent: 10 February 2004 15:22
> > > To:  uddi-spec@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > Subject: [uddi-spec] Groups  -
> > > uddi-spec-tc-prop023-keyedReferenceGroup-20040209.doc  uploaded
> > >
> > > The document
> > >  uddi-spec-tc-prop023-keyedReferenceGroup-20040209.doc has been
> >  > submitted by Tom Bellwood (bellwood@us.ibm.com) to the OASIS UDDI
>  > > Specification TC document repository.
> > >
> >  > Document Description:
> > > I've been trying to post this doc  for a couple days w/o success.
> > > Sorry.  It's a first  crack at solving Req 23.
> > > Comments please.
> >  >
> > > Download Document:
> > > http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/uddi-spec/downloa
>  > d.php/5395/uddi-spec-tc-prop023-keyedReferenceGroup-20040209.doc
>  > >
> > > View Document Details:
> > >  http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/uddi-spec/documen
>  > t.php?document_id=5395
> > >
> > >
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