Re: [wsbpel] The sad tail of obtaining licenses for BPEL4WS 1.1mailto:eduardo.gutentag@oasis-open.org

["Martin Ader" <ader@wngs.com>]

I did posted a request on the Microsoft site (some four months ago) , and
never had an answer.
My goal was to judge the readiness of the openness of the specification, and
check the licensing conditions.
This is a key point when assisting my large customers in selecting
"standards" specifications.
The issue is still open! Thank you to report it.

Martin Ader
Workflow & Groupware Stratégies (W&GS)
37, rue Bouret ,                          www.wngs.com, ader@wngs.com,
75019, PARIS, FRANCE       +33 1 42 38 08 15, Fax +33 1 42 38 08 02
Workflow & BPM Comparative Study , 2003 EDITION AVAILABLE


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Derick Townsend [Openstorm]" <dt@openstorm.com>
To: "Steve Ross-Talbot" <steve@enigmatec.net>; "ws bpel tc"
<wsbpel@lists.oasis-open.org>
Cc: <eduardo.gutentag@oasis-open.org>; <jeff.mischkinsky@oracle.com>;
<patrick.gannon@oasis-open.org>
Sent: Monday, December 01, 2003 6:30 PM
Subject: RE: [wsbpel] The sad tail of obtaining licenses for BPEL4WS
1.1mailto:eduardo.gutentag@oasis-open.org


| I have had similar problems. I thought I was making good progress with
IBM, having reached the Program Director for Intellectual Property and
Licensing. She stated that a new RF license was being developed. However,
after numerous email and phone conversations that contact went dark about a
month ago. Here is the contact info if someone else wants to try. Please
share the URL or doc for the license assuming you find it.
|
| Marcia Courtemanche
| Program Director
| Intellectual Property and Licensing
| NOTES:  mcourtem@us.ibm.com
| OFFICE:  914-765-4341, TL 251-4341, FAX extension 4420
|
| I have not had any luck with Siebel.
|
| DT
|
|
|
|
| -----Original Message-----
| From: Steve Ross-Talbot [mailto:steve@enigmatec.net]
| Sent: Monday, December 01, 2003 10:13 AM
| To: ws bpel tc
| Cc: eduardo.gutentag@oasis-open.org; jeff.mischkinsky@oracle.com;
| patrick.gannon@oasis-open.org
| Subject: [wsbpel] The sad tail of obtaining licenses for BPEL4WS
| 1.1mailto:eduardo.gutentag@oasis-open.org
|
|
| Dear all,
|
| A sad tail about the of licensing BPEL4WS1.1.
|
| As some of you may remember  the issues of licensing and license
| mechanisms were raised at the start of the TC. We were all assured
| that even though there are 5 authors of the BPEL4WS1.1 specification -
| the base for the TC -  we should not worry. It would all be fine and
| the authors would figure out a way to ensure that those who are
| interested would be able to obtain licenses without any real
| hinderance.
|
| So mid Sept2003 I embarked on license discovery. A little known process
| to obtain the 5 license agreements from the 5 authors of the BPEL4WS1.1
| specification.
|
| On the web I managed to get licenses from Microsoft (thanks) and BEA
| (thanks). And within a month from SAP (thanks to them also) too.
|
| IBM and Siebel had no web available licensing (as far as I could tell).
| I sent in a request to IBM late October, having waited passively for
| some information about the licenses from the TC, and (several people
| and emails later) I am still waiting for a license from IBM. The latest
| news, despite the fact that I have an outstanding email into IBM, is
| that a license agreement from them is on the Oasis website (dated June
| 2003!). Why was this not pointed out in October you may ask? A case of
| the X-files and standards you may think.
|
| With Siebel the plot thickens. Finally I got to someone (19th November)
| who seemed to know about the license issues. But ... and I know this
| sounds like I made it up .... I finally get a response that says:
|
| "I should have pointed you to Oasis rather than Diane Jordan at IBM."
|
| Which brings me all the way back to the original email I sent to Diane
| late in October. Now I feel like Bill Murray in "Ground Hog Day".
|
| It is a sad tail of how licenses and standards do not mix.
|
| I am now at a loss as to how to proceed. Seems like we now have a
| deadlock. The TC chairs thinking it is the authors responsibility and
| at least one of the authors thinking it is Oasis's responsibility.
|
| If anyone our there has actually succeeded in getting all 5 license
| agreements could they share the secret of their success with the group
| so that we may all contribute on an equal footing.
|
| As to what I think should be done as a minimum ... it is simple. Oasis
| should own the contact points for such license agreements and the
| authors should sign-up to ensuring that this sort of information is
| sorted out *before* they start a TC so that we can play on a level
| playing field.
|
| Best regards
|
|
| Steve Ross-Talbot
| Chief Scientist Enigmatec Corp.
|
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