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Subject: Proposal [Disc05] (was: RE: [wsdm] Proposal on [Disc04])



Hi Igor,

I agree with you. The "relationship" approach only works if the person
we are talking to has knowledge of the other manageability
endpoints/representations. And you give a very good example of a case
where there are two manageability endpoints/representations that are
likely to not know about one another. All WSDM is about at the end is
defining interfaces. If the person you talk to doesn't have the
information you are asking for, no amount of clever interface design
will make them give you the info.

This relationship mechanism to discover other manageability endpoints is
useful but is in no way guaranteed to give you the whole list.

After this step, as you describe, we are left to using other mechanisms
to try to find even more manageability endpoints. This is where the
correlatable name mechanism might come in handy, but at that point we
are transitioning to [Disc05].

So I think we are on agreement on [Disc04] (let me know if we're not)
and I am renaming this thread to [Disc05] as you are proposing a way to
solve this issue.

You proposal to [Disc05] looks reasonable to me.

Regards,

William

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sedukhin, Igor S [mailto:Igor.Sedukhin@ca.com] 
> Sent: Tuesday, June 01, 2004 8:06 AM
> To: Vambenepe, William N; wsdm@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: RE: [wsdm] Proposal on [Disc04]
> 
> 
> William,
> 
> This will require manageability providers to know of other 
> manageability providers for the same resource. I do not think 
> it is always reasonable.
> 
> If I implemented a co-located manageability provider that 
> offers resource state capability for a warehouse Web service, 
> and then someone else implemented a proxy manageability 
> provider offering metrics capability for the same service, 
> they are not necessarily aware of each other. Morevover, they 
> could be developed and instrantiated completely independently 
> of each other.
> 
> So, my point is
>  1) relationship may be defined for the cases where providers 
> are aware of each other
>  2) for the general case, in the spec, we just say a) fetch 
> ResourceID, b) discover all manageability endpoints with a 
> given ResourceID c) there could be more (with different 
> ResourceIDs), so use "correlatable properoperties" capability (TBD).
> 
> The idea behind c) is that
> 	- fetch all properties marked "correlatable"
> 	- use generalized discovery to find all manageable 
> resources with matching "correlatable property" values
> 
> For example, a SCSI HDD could mark the following properies as 
> "correlatable": host DNS name/IP, Bus#, Channel#, SCSI#, LUN#.
> 
> To be even more concrete I suggest to define "Correlatable 
> Properties" capability as follows :)
> 	1) a property muws-xs:CorrelatableProperties
> 	2) value of which follows the example below
> 
> 	<muws-xs:CorrelatableProperties>
> 		<muws-xs:MatchAny>
> 			<muws-xs:Match>scsi:HostName</muws-xs:Match>
> 			<muws-xs:Match>scsi:HostIP</muws-xs:Match>
> 		<muws-xs:MatchAny>
> 		<muws-xs:Match>scsi:BusID</muws-xs:Match>
> 		<muws-xs:Match>scsi:ChannelID</muws-xs:Match>
> 		<muws-xs:Match>scsi:ID</muws-xs:Match>
> 		<muws-xs:Match>scsi:LUN</muws-xs:Match>
> 	</muws-xs:CorrelatableProperties>
> 
> 	3) no events or operations are necessary
> 
> -- Igor Sedukhin .. (igor.sedukhin@ca.com)
> -- (631) 342-4325 .. 1 CA Plaza, Islandia, NY 11788
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vambenepe, William N [mailto:vbp@hp.com] 
> Sent: Friday, May 28, 2004 6:21 PM
> To: wsdm@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: [wsdm] Proposal on [Disc04]
> 
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> As promised, here is a proposal for [Disc04].
> 
> > [Disc04]
> > From one manageability endpoint to other manageability endpoints of 
> > the same resource (to discover all the manageability capabilities 
> > offered), including endpoints from the same and different 
> > manageability Providers.
> > We discussed that one 2 weeks ago but didn't talk about any way to 
> > address it yet.
> 
> This proposal too rests on using relationships. It is simply 
> to create a special relationship type, called something like 
> "sameResource" or "alternateManageabilityRepresentation". A 
> Ws-Resource representing resource foo will advertise this 
> relationship between itself and the other known WS-Resources 
> that also represent foo.
> 
> Simple and clean, don't you think?
> 
> Therefore I propose we also hibernate this issue with the 
> assumption that relationships will provide the right 
> mechanism (of course, to be validated once we actually have 
> relationships).
> 
> William
> 
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