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Subject: RE: [xri] Names for XRI URIs and URNs


Those are mouthfuls. Three letters would be much preferrable. I liked Peter
Davis's xip & xir, but they don't really parse right to me (ie what do they
correspond to). 

How about XRI - "Extensible Reassignable Identifier" and XPI - "Extensible
Permanent Identifier". 

I think this addresses everyone's needs. "XRI" would no longer be the
general case then because we've said that XRI are only the reassignable ones
and XPIs are the "permanent" ones. Thats a nit, not a showstopper. 

	-Gabe

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marc LeMaitre [mailto:Marc.LeMaitre@onename.com]
> Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2003 8:47 AM
> To: 'xri@lists.oasis-open.org'
> Subject: RE: [xri] Names for XRI URIs and URNs
> 
> 
> Here is my .02c
> 
> "XRI" as an umbrella term for any form of an XRI is fine; it 
> fits in with
> the use of URI as an umbrella term for any form of a URI
> 
> "XRI name" as the short term for a reasignable XRI is 
> contrary to the use of
> "name" in URNs as a term to describe permanently assigned 
> URIs. It also
> confuses (me at least) because URNs are considered in 
> contemporary thinking
> to be (and are registered with IANA as) just one of many URI 
> schemes. One
> may argue that the term "name" is misused today to refer to permanent
> identifiers, regardless of this I feel it would be difficult 
> for the XRI TC
> at this time to and try to reverse its meaning (everyone 
> knows that URNs are
> permanent even if they disagree). I urge that we consider 
> including the term
> "reassignable" or its acronym in our specification of 
> identifiers that can
> be reassigned.
> 
> "XRID" as the short term for a permanent XRI seems on face value to be
> acceptable but it is not unambiguous to a casual reader that it is
> permanent.
> 
> My vote therefore goes to Nat and his XRIP and XRIR. They may 
> be a bit of a
> mouthful but I'd settle for that rather than ambiguity and 
> confusion any
> day.
> 
> Marc
> 
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Drummond Reed
> > Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2003 2:29 AM
> > To: Peter C Davis; Sakimura, Nat
> > Cc: 'xri@lists.oasis-open.org'
> > Subject: RE: [xri] Names for XRI URIs and URNs
> > 
> > I'm all for super-simple but my worry is that we may lose 
> track of the
> > root
> > acronym from which they flow. "URI" is very widely recognized in Web
> > architecture. For this reason "XRI" has worked very well 
> for us in the
> > last
> > few months as an easy way to talk about this new type of abstract,
> > extensible URI. So I think we should keep it as the 
> foundation acronym.
> > 
> > So we have two subclasses of XRIs that we'd like to be able 
> to easily
> > refer
> > to: permanent XRIs (ones that meet the URN requirements) 
> and reassignable
> > XRIs (ones that do not).
> > 
> > A very natural term for the latter - because I've been 
> using it daily for
> > weeks now - is an "XRI name". Just like a domain name, it's 
> reassignable
> > to
> > different target resources as required by its owner. I also 
> find that a
> > very
> > natural term for the former is an "XRI ID", which naturally 
> shortens to
> > "XRID".
> > 
> > So a proposal would be:
> > 
> > * "XRI" as the umbrella term for any form of an XRI.
> > * "XRI name" as the short term for a reassignable XRI.
> > * "XRID" as the short term for a permanent XRI.
> > 
> > =Drummond
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Peter C Davis [mailto:peter.davis@neustar.biz]
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 7:02 AM
> > To: Sakimura, Nat
> > Cc: 'xri@lists.oasis-open.org'
> > Subject: RE: [xri] Names for XRI URIs and URNs
> > 
> > Or perhaps even simpler, but along these lines:
> > 
> > - XIP ("zip") permanent
> > - XIR ("zir") reassignable
> > 
> > --- peterd
> > 
> > On Wed, 2003-03-12 at 02:07, Sakimura, Nat wrote:
> > > I like them. Another obvious twist are XRIP "eXtensible Resource
> > > Identifier Permanent" and XRIR " -- Reassignable" which might be
> > slightly
> > > easier to pronounce. ("eccsrip and eccsriar")
> > >
> > > Nat Sakimura
> > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Drummond Reed [mailto:Drummond.Reed@onename.com]
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 3:06 PM
> > > > To: Sakimura, Nat
> > > > Subject: RE: [xri] Names for XRI URIs and URNs
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Interesting angle. We could even make it easier by just
> > > > saying "Permanent
> > > > XRI" and "Reassignable XRI". Or shorten them to acronyms like
> > > > "PXRI" and
> > > > "RXRI".
> > > >
> > > > =Drummond
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Sakimura, Nat [mailto:n-sakimura@nri.co.jp]
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2003 7:14 PM
> > > > To: Drummond Reed
> > > > Subject: RE: [xri] Names for XRI URIs and URNs
> > > >
> > > > Putting the marketing bit aside, I have a feeling that 
> it might be
> > > > clearer to most audience to explicitly state "permanent" and
> > > > "reassignable". Thus, something like XRPID and XRRID (how
> > > > awful!) or something like that.
> > > >
> > > > Nat Sakimura
> > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: Drummond Reed [mailto:Drummond.Reed@onename.com]
> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 11:23 AM
> > > > > To: 'xri@lists.oasis-open.org'
> > > > > Subject: RE: [xri] Names for XRI URIs and URNs
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Gabe,
> > > > >
> > > > > Great point. I absolutely agree we need clear, short names
> > > > > for a) URIs that
> > > > > conform to the XRI syntax for URIs and b) URNs that conform
> > > > to the XRI
> > > > > syntax for URNs.
> > > > >
> > > > > One suggestion that has been made is to avoid making the same
> > > > > terminology
> > > > > mistake that "URN" originally made by calling a permanent
> > > > identifier a
> > > > > "name" (when in fact "name" is the term probably most
> > > > > commonly associated
> > > > > with a reassignable identifier).
> > > > >
> > > > > Since the term most commonly associated with a permanent
> > > > > identifier is "ID",
> > > > > I suggest the term "XRID" instead of "XRN".
> > > > >
> > > > > So you'd have:
> > > > >
> > > > > a) "XRI" for URIs that conform to the XRI syntax for URIs
> > > > >
> > > > > b) "XRID" for URNs that conform to the XRI syntax for URNs
> > > > >
> > > > > The only downside is that it may not be quite as intuitive
> > > > to the very
> > > > > technical crowd that an "XRID" is the XRI equivalent of a
> > > > URN. But the
> > > > > upside is that "XRID" will likely be much more intuitive to a
> > > > > much wider
> > > > > audience in the long term as the "permanent" version 
> of an XRI.
> > > > >
> > > > > Others on the list, what do you think?
> > > > >
> > > > > =Drummond
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: Wachob, Gabe [mailto:gwachob@visa.com]
> > > > > Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003 3:20 PM
> > > > > To: 'xri@lists.oasis-open.org'
> > > > > Subject: [xri] Names for XRI URIs and URNs
> > > > >
> > > > > Working on the requirements document, its becoming awkward to
> > > > > say "XRI URIs
> > > > > and XRI URNs".
> > > > >
> > > > > I'd like to adopt a nomenclature for these two sets 
> of identifiers:
> > > > >
> > > > > a) URIs that conform to the XRI syntax for URIs
> > > > >
> > > > > b) URNs that conform to the XRI syntax for URNs
> > > > >
> > > > > One might simply say "XRIs and XRNs" for a) and b) 
> respectively.
> > > > >
> > > > > Some have argued using these terms (with the "I" intepreted
> > > > > as "identifier"
> > > > > and "N" interpreted as "Name" as per URI and URN) are
> > > > > confusing. URI's are
> > > > > more like non-persistent "Names" and URNs are more like
> > > > > persistent "IDs".
> > > > >
> > > > > Thats a reasonable argument, but then again, it maybe
> > > > > inviting an uphill
> > > > > push to try to use new terminology that ISN'T derived from
> > > > the URN/URI
> > > > > terminology. XRN (as far as I know) is only commonly used to
> > > > > refer to the
> > > > > XWindows newsreader (which is not so popular these days). XRI
> > > > > & XRN would
> > > > > work nicely in emphasizing their relationship to the URI and
> > > > > URN dichotomy.
> > > > >
> > > > > Other suggestions/pushback? If not, I'd like to start 
> using this
> > > > > terminology.
> > > > >
> > > > >         -Gabe
> > > > >
> > > >
> > --
> > --- peterd              smtp: peter.davis@neustar.biz
> >                         jabber: peter.davis@checkov.neustarlab.biz
> > Neustar, Inc.
> 




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