OASIS Mailing List ArchivesView the OASIS mailing list archive below
or browse/search using MarkMail.

 


Help: OASIS Mailing Lists Help | MarkMail Help

xri message

[Date Prev] | [Thread Prev] | [Thread Next] | [Date Next] -- [Date Index] | [Thread Index] | [List Home]


Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return format


On that note, we should make sure that it is stated clearly in the spec
that while support for _xrd_r is optional, implementations MUST reject
the request with 212 NOT_IMPLEMENTED immediately if the flag is present
and the feature is not implemented. Otherwise, the the parameter was
simply ignored, there would be no way for a client to tell if the
returned XRDS contains only the selected Services or just raw XRDS.

Also, I did not get an answer to my other question:
> When these types of error occurs (where the query failed to resolve),
> should the XRD element have the entire QXRI in the <Query> content or
> just the first subsegment of the QXRI?


Thanks.
=wil (http://xri.net/=wil)
 
 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Tan, William [mailto:William.Tan@neustar.biz]
> Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2006 6:00 PM
> To: Drummond Reed; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return format
> 
> Agreed. NOT_IMPLEMENTED it is!
> 
> =wil (http://xri.net/=wil)
> 
> 
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Drummond Reed [mailto:drummond.reed@cordance.net]
> > Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2006 5:59 PM
> > To: xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return format
> >
> > Nope, I think you're right, generic is better. Given the HTTP
pattern,
> do
> > you prefer NOT_IMPLEMENTED over NOT_SUPPORTED?
> >
> > I like the semantics of the former a little better because the
latter
> may
> > sound like the feature is not supported by the *protocol*, while the
> > former
> > makes it clear that it is not implemented by the implementation.
> >
> > =Drummond
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Tan, William [mailto:William.Tan@neustar.biz]
> > Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006 10:55 PM
> > To: Drummond Reed; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return format
> >
> > I was thinking that it would be a generic "feature not
> > supported/implemented" code (similar to HTTP 501 Not Implemented),
> > though I'm not sure what other use cases there are for it.
> >
> > If you think that it is better to have a specific code for _xrd_r,
> > that's fine with me too.
> >
> > =wil (http://xri.net/=wil)
> >
> >
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Drummond Reed [mailto:drummond.reed@cordance.net]
> > > Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2006 5:24 PM
> > > To: xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return format
> > >
> > > Agreed. Should it be 212 RETURN_NOT_SUPPORTED?
> > >
> > > =Drummond
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Chasen, Les [mailto:les.chasen@neustar.biz]
> > > Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006 9:09 PM
> > > To: Tan, William; Drummond Reed; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return format
> > >
> > > This makes sense if we are going to have optional behavior in
> > resolvers.
> > >
> > >
> > > I-Name:  =les.chasen
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Tan, William
> > > Sent: Monday, February 27, 2006 11:35 PM
> > > To: Drummond Reed; Chasen, Les; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return format
> > >
> > > If the _xrd_r parameter is optional, I propose to add a separate
> error
> > > code for rejecting the request 212 NOT_SUPPORTED.
> > >
> > > When these types of error occurs (where the query failed to
> resolve),
> > > should the XRD element have the entire QXRI in the <Query> content
> or
> > > just the first subsegment of the QXRI?
> > >
> > > =wil (http://xri.net/=wil)
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Drummond Reed [mailto:drummond.reed@cordance.net]
> > > > Sent: Saturday, February 25, 2006 4:01 PM
> > > > To: Chasen, Les; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > > Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return
format
> > > >
> > > > Returning a "mini" or "stripped down" XRDS is certainly an
option.
> > If
> > > we
> > > > went that direction, though, returning just an XRD document
might
> be
> > > > preferable. That way we still get the advantage of nothing
needing
> > to
> > > > change
> > > > in the schema, and CanonicalID staying where it is, but the
client
> > > > receiving
> > > > just the final XRD and just the selected service endpoint.
> > > >
> > > > URIs would still be "fully exploded" per my earlier message.
> > > >
> > > > Example:
> > > >
> > > > <XRD xlmns="xri://$xrd*($v*2.0)">
> > > > 	<CanonicalID>xri://=!A1B2.C3D4</CanonicalID>
> > > > 	<Service >
> > > > 		<ProviderID>xri://!!1000!1234.5678</ProviderID>
> > > > 		<Type
select="true">xri://+contact*($v*1.0)</Type>
> > > > 		<Path match="null" />
> > > > 		<URI
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
priority="10">http://example.com/contact/=!A1B2.C3D4?id=xri://@foo</URI>
> > > > 		<URI
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
priority="15">http://alt.example.com/contact/=!A1B2.C3D4?id=xri://@foo</
> > > UR
> > > > I>
> > > >
> > > > <URI>https://example.com/contact/=!A1B2.C3D4?id=xri://@foo</URI>
> > > > 	</Service>
> > > > </XRD>
> > > >
> > > > What does everyone think?
> > > >
> > > > =Drummond
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Chasen, Les [mailto:les.chasen@neustar.biz]
> > > > Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 7:05 PM
> > > > To: Drummond Reed; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > > Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return
format
> > > >
> > > > It sounds confusing because some times I see it outside a
service
> > > block
> > > > and sometimes I see it inside.  BTW, if a client can parse a
> service
> > > > block why can't it just parse the xrds?  How about we return an
> XRDS
> > > > document that simply includes the data points you want?  In this
> > case
> > > > the XRDS would not include the many XRDs or SEPs that were
> returned
> > in
> > > > authority resolution.  It would just return the CanonicalIds and
> > > service
> > > > block.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I-Name:  =les.chasen
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Drummond Reed [mailto:drummond.reed@cordance.net]
> > > > Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 9:43 PM
> > > > To: Chasen, Les; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > > Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return
format
> > > >
> > > > Les,
> > > >
> > > > Since Steve is out today I spoke with Andy Dale to better
> understand
> > > the
> > > > use
> > > > case.
> > > >
> > > > It turns out that ooTao does not have a strong use case for
> > increasing
> > > > CanonicalID granularity, i.e., provisioning a CanonicalID
directly
> > > with
> > > > a
> > > > service endpoint vs. the entire XRD. However Andy agreed that
> > > > CanonicalID
> > > > would be a very useful child element of Service in a service
> > endpoint
> > > > output
> > > > document because it allows all the information relevant to a
> > selected
> > > > service endpoint to be packaged and returned in a single Service
> > > > element.
> > > >
> > > > This then would be consistent across both a native client
resolver
> > API
> > > > and a
> > > > proxy resolver interface.
> > > >
> > > > So the rule would be simply to return CanonicalID(s) as a child
> > > element
> > > > of
> > > > Service when return of a service endpoint is requested vs.
return
> of
> > > the
> > > > entire XRD.
> > > >
> > > > How does that sound?
> > > >
> > > > =Drummond
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Chasen, Les [mailto:les.chasen@neustar.biz]
> > > > Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 6:10 PM
> > > > To: Drummond Reed; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > > Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return
format
> > > >
> > > > On number 1 I am neutral (not in favor of but not against) as
long
> > as
> > > it
> > > > is optional.
> > > >
> > > > On number 3 ... wow that sounds like a totally new
> > requirement/usecase
> > > > that has nothing to do with a proxy server having a more robust
> > > > interface.  Why do we need a canonicalid with finer granularity?
> > What
> > > > does override mean?
> > > >
> > > > I see the following two possible test cases.
> > > >
> > > > 1. If I have the following XRDS
> > > >
> > > > <XRDS>
> > > > ....
> > > > <CanoncialId> foo </canonicalid>
> > > > <service>
> > > > ...
> > > > </service>
> > > > </xrds>
> > > >
> > > > Then the proxy server would return
> > > > <service>
> > > > <CanoncialId> foo </canonicalid>
> > > > ...
> > > > </service>
> > > >
> > > > IMHO this is confusing.
> > > >
> > > > 2. If I have the following XRDS
> > > >
> > > > <XRDS>
> > > > ...
> > > > <canonicalId> foo </canonicalid>
> > > > <service>
> > > > <canonicalid> bar </caonnonicalid>
> > > > ...
> > > > </service>
> > > >
> > > > What does this mean?
> > > >
> > > > I think we need to understand the requirement here.  Can someone
> > > please
> > > > explain the usecase?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I-Name:  =les.chasen
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Drummond Reed [mailto:drummond.reed@cordance.net]
> > > > Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 6:35 PM
> > > > To: Chasen, Les; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > > Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return
format
> > > >
> > > > Les, see replies inline marked ###.
> > > >
> > > > =Drummond
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Chasen, Les [mailto:les.chasen@neustar.biz]
> > > > Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 2:12 PM
> > > > To: Drummond Reed; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > > Subject: RE: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return
format
> > > >
> > > > I have a few comments.
> > > >
> > > > 1. I am not in favor of adding this capability to the spec for
> http
> > > > proxy resolution servers.  I feel that the capabilities already
> > > provided
> > > > for in the spec allow implementers to build edge resolution
> services
> > > > that support this type of functionality.  I think implementers
who
> > > need
> > > > this type of functionality should be encouraged to write to
> > > programmatic
> > > > interfaces not http proxy resolution servers.
> > > >
> > > > ### Ironically, this is a programmatic interface. It's a web
> service
> > > (in
> > > > the
> > > > broad definition of XML-over-HTTP.) But you're right that it's
one
> > > > that's
> > > > better suited to the edges of the network than the core. ###
> > > >
> > > > 2. If you guys want to add this then this has to be optional
> > behavior.
> > > > We discussed this on the call but I don't see it documented.
> > > >
> > > > ### My fault for not noting it -- this was just meant to be the
> > > > technical
> > > > proposal, not the full text going in the spec. It will be
> documented
> > > as
> > > > optional. ###
> > > >
> > > > 3. This proposal is adding CanonicalId to the service block.  Is
> > this
> > > > only used in the service block under these circumstances?  If so
> is
> > > that
> > > > going to add confusion?  I think it might because sometimes I
will
> > see
> > > > the canonical id in a service block sometimes I will see it
> outside
> > > the
> > > > service block depending on what I ask for.
> > > >
> > > > ### No, it's not just for this proposal. It solves another
> problem,
> > > > which is
> > > > how you can specify a CanonicalID at a lower level of
granularity
> -
> > > the
> > > > service level instead of the XRD level. The CanonicalID at the
XRD
> > > level
> > > > is
> > > > very useful but this gives you a way to override it at the
Service
> > > level
> > > > if
> > > > needed. ###
> > > >
> > > > ### END ###
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Drummond Reed [mailto:drummond.reed@cordance.net]
> > > > Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 4:33 PM
> > > > To: xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > > Subject: [xri] Proposal for _xrd_r parameter and return format
> > > >
> > > > Per my second action item from yesterday's TC call minutes, this
> is
> > a
> > > > proposal to add an _xrd_r (Return) input parameter to XRI
> Resolution
> > > 2.0
> > > > Working Draft 10.
> > > >
> > > > Background: this originated in the decision that the standard
> output
> > > of
> > > > XRI
> > > > resolution when service endpoint selection is requested should
be
> > not
> > > > just a
> > > > prioritized list of URIs, but also a prioritized list of
> > CanonicalIDs,
> > > > so
> > > > that XRD authors have the ability to tell consuming applications
> the
> > > > identifier(s) they should use for a resource at a specific
service
> > > > endpoint.
> > > >
> > > > It's easy to see how such a return value can be returned via a
> local
> > > XRI
> > > > resolver API, and that's out of scope for the spec. But it
raised
> > the
> > > > question of how such a result could be returned via an XRI proxy
> > > > resolver
> > > > which has only an HTTP interface, and which is in scope of the
> spec.
> > > >
> > > > The proposed solution is two parts:
> > > >
> > > > PART ONE: _XRD_R PARAMETER
> > > >
> > > > Like _xrd_n, the _xrd_r (Return) parameter would be a Boolean
> flag.
> > > The
> > > > default if it is omitted or its value is null is the implied
value
> > of
> > > > "false", which means the return type is be governed by the
_xrd_m
> > > > (MediaType) attribute.
> > > >
> > > > If _xrd_r="true", then the resolver MUST return an XML document
> > > > consisting
> > > > of only the selected service endpoint (part two).
> > > >
> > > > PART TWO: SERVICE ENDPOINT DESCRIPTOR
> > > >
> > > > 2) To keep it as simple as possible, the proposed return format
if
> > > > _xrd_r="true is an XML document that reuses the
> xri://$xrd*($v*2.0)
> > > XML
> > > > namespace and just contains the selected Service element.
> Following
> > is
> > > a
> > > > example:
> > > >
> > > > <Service xlmns="xri://$xrd*($v*2.0)" >
> > > > 	<ProviderID>xri://!!1000!1234.5678</ProviderID>
> > > > 	<CanonicalID>xri://=!A1B2.C3D4</CanonicalID>
> > > > 	<Type select="true">xri://+contact*($v*1.0)</Type>
> > > > 	<Path match="null" />
> > > > 	<URI
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
priority="10">http://example.com/contact/=!A1B2.C3D4?id=xri://@foo</URI>
> > > > 	<URI
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
priority="15">http://alt.example.com/contact/=!A1B2.C3D4?id=xri://@foo</
> > > > URI>
> > > >
> 	<URI>https://example.com/contact/=!A1B2.C3D4?id=xri://@foo</URI>
> > > > </Service>
> > > >
> > > > To support this return format would require that we add
> CanonicalID
> > as
> > > > an
> > > > optional child of the XRD Service element. This means
CanonicalID
> > > could
> > > > appear at both the XRD level and the Service level exactly the
way
> > > > ProviderID can currently appear at both levels. This has the
> > > additional
> > > > benefit of allowing CanonicalID to be expressed on a more
granular
> > > > service
> > > > level rather than just at the XRD level.
> > > >
> > > > The rule would be that CanonicalID would be used directly if
> present
> > > in
> > > > the
> > > > selected Service, or it would be "inherited" from the XRD level
if
> > it
> > > > was
> > > > not present for the selected Service. In other words,
CanonicalID
> at
> > > the
> > > > XRD
> > > > level is the default for every Service unless the Service
> overrides
> > it
> > > > by
> > > > including 1+ CanonicalID elements.
> > > >
> > > > In addition, in a Service document the values of the URI element
> > would
> > > > be
> > > > "fully constructed", i.e., they will have had the "append"
> algorithm
> > > > executed to produce the final URI.
> > > >
> > > > ******
> > > >
> > > > Again, the plan is to incorporate this into ED 07 to close this
> > issue,
> > > > so
> > > > please send feedback on this proposal as soon as you can.
> > > >
> > > > =Drummond
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC
> that
> > > > generates this mail.  You may a link to this group and all your
> TCs
> > in
> > > > OASIS
> > > > at:
> > > >
> >
https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC
> that
> > > > generates this mail.  You may a link to this group and all your
> TCs
> > in
> > > > OASIS
> > > > at:
> > > >
> >
https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC
> that
> > > > generates this mail.  You may a link to this group and all your
> TCs
> > in
> > > > OASIS
> > > > at:
> > > >
> >
https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC
> that
> > > > generates this mail.  You may a link to this group and all your
> TCs
> > in
> > > > OASIS
> > > > at:
> > > >
> >
https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC
that
> > > generates this mail.  You may a link to this group and all your
TCs
> in
> > > OASIS
> > > at:
> > >
> https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC that
> > generates this mail.  You may a link to this group and all your TCs
in
> > OASIS
> > at:
> >
https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php
> 
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC that
> generates this mail.  You may a link to this group and all your TCs in
> OASIS
> at:
> https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php



[Date Prev] | [Thread Prev] | [Thread Next] | [Date Next] -- [Date Index] | [Thread Index] | [List Home]