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Subject: RE: [xri] Piling on


I thought the point of these query parameters was that they should be
includable in a HTTP URI that can be (for example) stuck in a web page. 

Preferred media type (afaik) cannot be attached to a HTTP URI (via a <A>
HTML tag, for example). 

The use of the media type options doesn't do away with the need for
query parameters, does it? At least for HXRIs? Or am I missing
something?

	-Gabe

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Drummond Reed [mailto:drummond.reed@cordance.net] 
> Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 10:47 PM
> To: xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: [xri] Piling on
> 
> As I finish the completely revised Inputs and Outputs section 
> of Working
> Draft 10 Editor's Draft 08, using this new media type 
> parameter architecture
> (Gabe has no idea what he's set off here), I of course 
> realized that the
> NoFollowRefs parameter also fell perfectly into the bucket of 
> resolution
> controls that should be specified by media type parameters 
> and thus not
> require a separate proxy resolution query parameter.
> 
> So I've revised 
> http://wiki.oasis-open.org/xri/Xri2Cd02/ResolutionExampleApi
> again (for the sixth time today -- great use of a wiki) to 
> update it for
> this addition.
> 
> That means that authority resolution is down to two parameters:
> 
> * QXRI
> * Resolution Media Type (_xrd_r)
> 
> And service endpoint selection adds just two more parameters:
> 
> * Service Type (_xrd_t)
> * Service Media Type (_xrd_m)
> 
> This is going in exactly the right direction: simpler, more 
> flexible, and
> easier to understand.
> 
> Look to see it all in print in Editor's Draft 08 tomorrow 
> (which we will
> review on Thursday's TC call at 4PM Pacific.)
> 
> =Drummond 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Drummond Reed [mailto:drummond.reed@cordance.net] 
> Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 9:30 PM
> To: xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: [xri] Make https a value of trust media type parameter?
> 
> All,
> 
> After Gabe made this breakthrough suggestion about using media type
> parameters (where was he a week ago when this could have 
> saved us a good man
> day of work!! ;-), it then prompted Steve to mention that 
> Peter Davis has
> has a very compelling use case for requiring XRI authority 
> resolution and
> SEP selection that uses all https service endpoints.
> 
> So Steve suggests that we add the value of "https" to the 
> "trust" media type
> parameter on application/xrds+xml and application/xrd+xml.
> 
> This of course would mean adding one subsection to the 
> Authority Resolution
> section of the spec that simply specifies that if the value 
> of the "trust"
> attribute is "https", then all auth res requests must use https (and a
> corresponding error message).
> 
> This is a very cheap and lightweight way to get a "poor man's 
> trusted res"
> in Working Draft 10.
> 
> What does everyone think?
> 
> =Drummond 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Drummond Reed [mailto:drummond.reed@cordance.net] 
> Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 6:31 PM
> To: 'Wachob, Gabe'; 'Tan, William'; 'Steven Churchill';
> xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: RE: [xri] XRI Res ED 08 decision - need feedback
> 
> Gabe, you are a lifesaver. I totally forgot about this 
> option. Media type
> parameters are exactly what we need.
> 
> I just completely updated the proxy resolver mapping proposal at:
> 
> 	http://wiki.oasis-open.org/xri/Xri2Cd02/ResolutionExampleApi
> 
> See the final section. In short, there are now just three 
> defined media
> types:
> 
> application/xrds+xml
> application/xrd+xml
> text/uri-list
> 
> The first two accept the "sep" parameter whose values are 
> boolean "true" and
> "false". All three accept the "trust" parameter whose values 
> are "none" and
> "saml".
> 
> Examples:
> 
> application/xrds+xml;trust=saml
> application/xrds+xml;sep=true;trust=saml
> application/xrd+xml;sep=true
> text/uri-list;trust=saml
> 
> Gabe, are you comfortable with us adding the "trust" parameter to
> text/uri-list, given that it's not our spec? I'm fine with it 
> because: a) it
> doesn't conflict w/any other parameters (there are none that 
> I saw), and b)
> we are the only ones consuming this parameter.
> 
> =Drummond 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Wachob, Gabe [mailto:gwachob@visa.com] 
> Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 5:10 PM
> To: Drummond Reed; Tan, William; Steven Churchill; 
> xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: RE: [xri] XRI Res ED 08 decision - need feedback
> 
> I'd prefer to keep the SAML extension for the reasons provided.
> 
> I think the trust mechanism is likely to be the first place where
> extensions (private or public) are likely to occur. I don't want to
> suggest there is only one trust mechanism possible.
> 
> In addition, I don't know that we really want to mess with 
> text/uri-list
> by creating a derivate text/uri-list-trusted (or -saml). It feels like
> we'd be stepping on someone else's specification.
> 
> Have we considered using MIME parameters instead of a 
> plethora of media
> types? 
> 
> Something like:
> application/xrds+xml; trusted=saml
> application/xrds+xml; trusted=none
> application/xrd+xml; filtered=sep
> 
> Just seems to be more in line with the intent of RFC 2045. Here's the
> language: 
> 
>   "Parameters are modifiers of the media subtype, and as such do not
>    fundamentally affect the nature of the content.  The set of
>    meaningful parameters depends on the media type and subtype.  Most
>    parameters are associated with a single specific subtype.  
> However, a
>    given top-level media type may define parameters which are 
> applicable
>    to any subtype of that type.  Parameters may be required by their
>    defining content type or subtype or they may be optional. MIME
>    implementations must ignore any parameters whose names they do not
>    recognize."
> 
> 
>    -Gabe
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Drummond Reed [mailto:drummond.reed@cordance.net] 
> > Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 4:40 PM
> > To: 'Tan, William'; 'Steven Churchill'; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > Subject: RE: [xri] XRI Res ED 08 decision - need feedback
> > 
> > Wil, I was thinking about that too. However as I understand 
> > it, one of the
> > reasons Gabe and Dave originally chose to put "-saml" in the 
> > media type was
> > because over time there could be other trusted resolution 
> > protocols using
> > other trust assertion formats.
> > 
> > Thus "-saml" does more than specify you want SAML-based 
> assertions, it
> > specifies the type of resolution protocol you want used.
> > 
> > So we have a choice. We can either adopt "-trusted" 
> > throughout and say that
> > this means the resolver's choice of trusted resolution 
> protocol (with
> > originally there are only one), or we can use "-saml" 
> > throughout to mean the
> > resolver should use the SAML-based XRI trusted resolution protocol.
> > 
> > What do folks think?
> > 
> > =Drummond 
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Tan, William [mailto:William.Tan@neustar.biz] 
> > Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 3:52 PM
> > To: Steven Churchill; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > Subject: RE: [xri] XRI Res ED 08 decision - need feedback
> > 
> > That's fine with me. 
> > 
> > I'd prefer to use "-trusted" rather than "-saml" in the following
> > (non-XRDS) _xrd_r values since they do not actually contain SAML
> > signatures:
> > 
> > application/xrd-trusted+xml
> > application/xrds-trusted-sep+xml
> > application/xrd-trusted-sep+xml
> > text/uri-list-trusted
> > 
> > 
> > =wil (http://xri.net/=wil)
> >  
> >  
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Steven Churchill [mailto:steven.churchill@xdi.org]
> > > Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 9:21 AM
> > > To: xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > Subject: RE: [xri] XRI Res ED 08 decision - need feedback
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Here is an observation for readers of this proposal. It is 
> > an attempt
> > to
> > > add
> > > lucidity (but may very well accomplish the opposite.) :-)
> > > 
> > > Here goes: In Proposal #3 at the end, for the last row in 
> the table
> > > (text/uri-list-saml), the (logical) mapping to function #5 would
> > involve
> > > authMediaType taking on the value of application/xrds-saml+xml.
> > > 
> > > ~ Steve
> > > 
> > > 
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Drummond Reed [mailto:drummond.reed@cordance.net]
> > > > Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 1:31 PM
> > > > To: xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > > Subject: [xri] XRI Res ED 08 decision - need feedback
> > > >
> > > > XRI Resolution Editors (and any other TC member interested):
> > > >
> > > > Thanks to Steve, we now have an example local resolver API which
> > will
> > > > become
> > > > non-normative Appendix C in Editor's Draft 08 of 
> Working Draft 10
> > (the
> > > > last
> > > > of these "Editor's Drafts"). This API is document on the 
> > TC wiki at:
> > > >
> > > > 	
> http://wiki.oasis-open.org/xri/Xri2Cd02/ResolutionExampleApi
> > > >
> > > > Once we finished this example local API, it brought up several
> > options
> > > for
> > > > how it could be mapped more efficiently to the proxy 
> resolver API
> > that
> > > we
> > > > do
> > > > normatively specify. Steve and I batted around the 
> > options over the
> > > > weekend,
> > > > and we ended out with three proposals that are listed at 
> > the bottom
> > of
> > > the
> > > > page above.
> > > >
> > > > The one Steve and I are leaning towards is #3, which 
> collapses all
> > the
> > > > choices about resolution type and return type and 
> service endpoint
> > > > selection
> > > > into one list of media types. Besides reducing three 
> > potential proxy
> > > > resolver parameters (_xrd_a, _xrd_r, and a possible 
> > _xrd_s) to just
> > one
> > > > (_xrd_r), it also has the advantage of allowing XRI 
> communities to
> > > > advertise
> > > > the precise capabilities of their XRI proxy resolvers.
> > > >
> > > > Under this proposal the list of media types that could be 
> > offered by
> > an
> > > > XRI
> > > > proxy resolver would be:
> > > >
> > > > application/xrds+xml
> > > > application/xrds-saml+xml
> > > > application/xrd+xml
> > > > application/xrd-saml+xml
> > > > application/xrds-sep+xml
> > > > application/xrds-saml-sep+xml
> > > > application/xrd-sep+xml
> > > > application/xrd-saml-sep+xml
> > > > text/uri-list
> > > > text/uri-list-saml
> > > >
> > > > Note that only the first two of these are the media types 
> > for an XRI
> > > > authority server. The other 8 are all for proxy resolvers only.
> > > >
> > > > Since I'm writing this into the spec this afternoon, I'd 
> > love to get
> > > > feedback. Do folks agree that expanding the list of 
> media types to
> > cover
> > > > all
> > > > these options is the cleanest way to specify the proxy resolver
> > > interface?
> > > > If so, these would become the values of the _xrd_r 
> parameter. The
> > only
> > > > other
> > > > parameters (besides the QXRI) would be:
> > > >
> > > > _xrd_t	Service Type
> > > > _xrd_m	Media Type
> > > > _xrd_n	No-Follow-Refs Flag
> > > >
> > > > Thanks for any feedback -- I'm aiming to publish 
> Editor's Draft 08
> > > > tomorrow,
> > > > hold final review on Thursday's TC call, and publish the final
> > Working
> > > > Draft
> > > > 10 on Friday.
> > > >
> > > > =Drummond
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > 
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