RE: [xri] URI/IRI/XRI - what should extend what?

["Gabe Wachob" <gabe.wachob@amsoft.net>]

What I hear is this:

You want to be able to say:

1) If you are just doing us-ascii, then you can ignore implementing any IRI
stuff at all

2) If you are doing XRI with more characters, then use something like IRI on
top of XRI - something we'd have to define since XRI syntax (in XRI normal
form) is a superset of URI - that is a legal us-ascii XRI in XRI normal form
may not be a legal URI. 

What we can say today is:

1) If you all you are doing today is us-ascii XRIs, then you can ignore
implementing any IRI stuff at all (but this is only "partial implementation"
of the XRI spec - since we don't define "us-ascii-only XRIs")

2) If you are doing anything other than us-ascii XRIs, then you have to do
IRI processing after XRI normalization. 

I don't see that what you are saying is actually all that more attractive
over what we can say today. The only change we might want to add is a note
saying that you can ignore all the IRI stuff if you don't care about working
with anything but us-ascii characters...  (we'd have to actually confirm
that in detail, but I'm fairly sure). 

Would that satisfy your need/interest/want/desire? 

    -Gabe

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Schleiff, Marty [mailto:marty.schleiff@boeing.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 4:17 PM
> To: Gabe Wachob; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: RE: [xri] URI/IRI/XRI - what should extend what?
> 
> Hi Gabe (& All),
> 
> I'll try again.
> 
> If we say XRI is a URI scheme, then we can focus on ASCII-only. I think
> we can (almost) ignore IRI and its issues, just like I think http is
> oblivious to IRI.
> 
> So the folks who aren't English-speakers can use IRI to represent their
> XRIs just like they use IRI to represent their http URIs.
> 
> Marty.Schleiff@boeing.com; CISSP
> Associate Technical Fellow - Cyber Identity Specialist
> Computing Security Infrastructure
> (206) 679-5933
> 
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Gabe Wachob [mailto:gabe.wachob@amsoft.net]
> > Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 12:02 PM
> > To: Schleiff, Marty; xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > Subject: RE: [xri] URI/IRI/XRI - what should extend what?
> >
> > Marty-
> > 	I think you may have a misconception about all these things.
> >
> > 	First, URI's are defined with US-ASCII only. If you
> > don't do US-ASCII, you don't do URI's.
> > 	So the folks who aren't Engish-speakers decided they
> > wanted to play in the URI world and so they defined IRI. IRI
> > is basically just the way of encoding the full range of UTF-8
> > characters into URI-legal strings.
> >
> > 	So if we don't leverage IRI, we just have to rewrite
> > IRI. I don't see any point in that.
> >
> > 	If you want to support XRI, you have to support the
> > full set of internationalized characters, and the easiest way
> > to do that is to use IRI libraries which are pretty
> > ubiquitous now. There are a lot of Unicode corner cases and
> > I'm fairly certain not everyone handles all of Unicode correctly.
> > But this is one of those areas where 99.99% of the cases are
> > handled correctly and we should be happy with that.
> >
> > 	So, I'm not sure its really a big deal for a vendor to
> > support URI and not IRI. And if they don't want to support
> > IRI, then they *really* won't want to support XRI.
> >
> > 	-Gabe
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Schleiff, Marty [mailto:marty.schleiff@boeing.com]
> > > Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 9:28 AM
> > > To: xri@lists.oasis-open.org
> > > Subject: [xri] URI/IRI/XRI - what should extend what?
> > >
> > > Hi All,
> > >
> > > The XRI Syntax spec describes IRI as extending the character set of
> > > URI, and then describes XRI as extending the syntactic
> > elements (but
> > > not the character set) of IRI. If I were a product vendor, it would
> > > sound to me like in order to support XRI, my products would
> > first (or
> > > also) have to support IRI. I might think IRI support sounds complex
> > > with lots of implications to my install base, so if I decide not to
> > > support IRI it also means I wouldn't be supporting XRI.
> > > To me it seems like IRI adds lots of complexity to XRI. I'd rather
> > > just say XRI is a URI scheme, restricted to UTF-8 like any
> > other URI.
> > > In XRI let's not even worry about other encodings. When
> > international
> > > characters are needed in an XRI, then the IRI spec deals
> > with how to
> > > do it. Let's leave the complexity in the IRI spec. Of
> > course we could
> > > include a section in the XRI Syntax spec that gives
> > examples of how to
> > > convert a URI with a scheme of xri:// into an IRI according to the
> > > steps described in RFC 3987.
> > > I put this idea on the wiki (item #3.11 under XRI Syntax).
> > >
> > > Marty.Schleiff@boeing.com; CISSP
> > > Associate Technical Fellow - Cyber Identity Specialist Computing
> > > Security Infrastructure
> > > (206) 679-5933
> >
> >