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Subject: Re: [amqp] Incorrect treatment of voting rights in AMQP TC - requires correction before any votes - CLOSE

Well Jakub was there, but for some reason you were not Bill...  I was sure I had updated your entry, but Kavi is sometimes a law unto itself.  I'll fix that.

For Ken/Lorenz I think it would be best if they requested to change their status from Observer to Member - I think there is generally some confusion about the role of "Observer", and people have been picking that role solely because they did not necessarily feel qualified to vote on things.

For Raph, I've just this minute sent you a separate mail regarding the role of Secretary.

-- Rob

On 19 May 2017 at 17:17, William Cox <wtcox@coxsoftwarearchitects.com> wrote:

Rob -

The shortcut (instead of making everyone voting, then changing those who have failed to attend both meetings) is correctly described but incorrectly executed.

The missing voting members are

  1. William Cox, Individual (not in your list, non-voting on web roster. is this what I get for pointing out the roster issues?! :-)
  2. Jakub Scholz, Deutsche Boerse (correct on web roster, omitted in your list below)

Each of this list shows attendance at one or two of the May 2017 meetings, so should be voting members.

Note also that two attending people show as observers; observers may not attend meetings but receive all group emails:

  • Kenneth Giusti of Red Hat shows attending but is an observer, so should not be a member. I suggest encouraging him to join the TC formally.
  • Likewise Lorenz Quack, JPMC is an observer but has attended. I suggest encouraging him to join the TC formally.

Also Raphael Cohn has not attended, and should not have voting rights except that Secretary implicitly has voting rights.




On 5/19/17 12:00 PM, Rob Godfrey wrote:
OK, so I believe the roster is now correct - the voting members (excluding myself, as chair) are currently as follows:

Jakub Scholz, Deutsche Boerse AG
Stefan Hagen, Individual
Steve Huston, Individual
Keith Wall, JPMorgan Chase Bank, N.A.
Ram Jeyaraman, Microsoft
Brian Raymor, Microsoft
Clemens Vasters, Microsoft
Robert Gemmell, Red Hat

(That is all members who have not missed *both* of the last two meetings)

If anyone believes they are incorrectly present/absent, please let me know.

-- Rob

On 19 May 2017 at 15:56, Rob Godfrey <rgodfrey@redhat.com> wrote:
Yep - I'll do that presently


On 19 May 2017 at 15:55, William Cox <wtcox@coxsoftwarearchitects.com> wrote:

Rob -

Thanks for the fast reply; I just noticed this late last night.

Deferring votes works with respect to votes, however the starting point is that ALL members (not observers) have voting rights.

And people often attend to retain voting rights - once attained, every other meeting suffices. So again, it's simpler and more proper to assign voting rights and then drop those who do not attend.




On 5/19/17 10:53 AM, Rob Godfrey wrote:
Thanks Bill,

I was unaware of that particular rule in the TC process, I admit I was simply going to wait until we had had 3 meetings this year before we held any votes so that the voting list would reflect current attendees

-- Rob

On 19 May 2017 at 15:26, William Cox <wtcox@coxsoftwarearchitects.com> wrote:

The voting rights list is incorrect. The previous meeting was October 2016, so the phrase in bold applies.

Action requested of the Chair:

Move all members to voting. Do not request or record any votes until the voting rights roster is corrected.

More detail:

See TC Process at 2.4 (https://www.oasis-open.org/policies-guidelines/tc-process#membership-regainVotingRights )

All members (except persistent non-voting members) have voting rights as of the May 5 meeting; the roster incorrectly shows voting rights only for some, and some of those show only the May 5 meeting - others who show both October and May are listed as non-voting.

(c) A TC Member who has lost his or her voting rights shall regain them for a TC that holds Meetings by attending two consecutive Meetings (as recorded in the minutes), thus regaining voting rights after the end of the second Meeting attended or, if less than two Meetings are called within 60 days after the loss of such rights, at the close of that 60th day. A Member of a TC that does not hold Meetings may regain voting rights by making a request to the chair(s) to regain them, effective at the close of the 60th day after the request.
Chairs should realize that the Kavi "automatic quorum and voting rights" behavior is known to be incorrect; this has been mentioned on the Chairs list many times.


bill cox

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