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Subject: RE: [cgmopen-members] Fwd: Re: CGM Interested parties



I agree Frank. It was my hope that the goodness exercise in the ATA
meetings would promote the understanding and progress in the resolution of
these business issues to the vendors. Ideally I  would like to see an ATA
exchange goodness conformancy metrics.




DULUC Franck <Franck.DULUC@airbus.aeromatra.com> on 10/18/2001 09:48:06 AM

To:   "'martin.jackson@notes.canadair.ca'"
      <martin.jackson@notes.canadair.ca>
cc:   cgmopen-members@lists.oasis-open.org, SARTRE Thierry
      <Thierry.SARTRE@airbus.aeromatra.com>,
      gary_cunningham@mail.northgrum.com, BONET Laurent
      <Laurent.BONET@airbus.aeromatra.com>
Subject:  RE: [cgmopen-members] Fwd: Re: CGM Interested parties


Martin,

     I agree with you about the role of Style guide for avoiding use of
hazardous primitives (depending on tools (as raster patterns). We are
currently defining guides to deal with "cgm risks". This is, I think a part
of the work. The other part I think we should ask for is the
interoperability of tools at a maximum rate.

Regards,

Franck DULUC
AIRBUS FRANCE
SDN7 - D0611
316, route de Bayonne - 31060 TOULOUSE Cedex
FRANCE
&(33) 5.61.18.19.16   * (33) 5.61.93.59.44
*franck.duluc@airbus.aeromatra.com


-----Message d'origine-----
De: martin.jackson@notes.canadair.ca
[mailto:martin.jackson@notes.canadair.ca]
Date: jeudi 18 octobre 2001 15:25
: DULUC Franck
Cc: cgmopen-members@lists.oasis-open.org; SARTRE Thierry;
gary_cunningham@mail.northgrum.com; idijwo@total.net
Objet: RE: [cgmopen-members] Fwd: Re: CGM Interested parties




I believe the key to solving these issues is to separate the exchange of
CGM between businesses from the Web CGM publishing and to concentrate on
building a consistent CGM master data set. If one adopts business processes
that require the exchange of CGM between businesses to conform to ATA GREX
with the further requirement to conform to a style guide things work quite
well. The ATA Graphic style guide and GREX was designed for this purpose.
The intent is to build a cgm master data set that can then be converted
reliably for publishing (viewing , printing , Web CGM). Ofcourse ATA
standards do not need to be adopted just some standard that controls
deviations. It is absolutely critical to both the exchange process and the
publishing process to have consistent and reliable data in the graphic
master data set otherwise unpredictable results may occur at publishing.
This exchange business process does not ofcourse support exchanging
intelligent  v4 graphics this is designed to be performed prior to
publishing with the conversion to Web CGM - which becomes the publishing
master. It may also be neccesary to perform both automated and manual
checks on the data.

The style guide needs to control some of the variance encountered by the
diferent ways software deals with different elements: for example line
styles, text origin, curves via BSplines, beziers, ploylines, etc. These
are inherently goodness issues that really need to be resolved with ATA but
for now we try to limit via style guide controls. Another critical issue we
are working on is the exchange and publishing of consistent color. This is
problematic in a number of areas: some software does not support CGM in
RGB, mapping RGB to reliable print metrics, web safe colors, but perhaps
the biggest issue is a lack of understanding by businesses of the need to
conform to a consistent color standard.

Despite these issues we have increased the reliablity of our CGM exchange
process from a miserable 50% acceptance rate in 1996 to a quite acceptable
95% currently.

Any comments or questions welcome.














DULUC Franck <Franck.DULUC@airbus.aeromatra.com> on 10/18/2001 03:40:17 AM

To:   cgmopen-members@lists.oasis-open.org
cc:   BONET Laurent <Laurent.BONET@airbus.aeromatra.com>, ANDRIEU Noel
      <Noel.ANDRIEU@airbus.aeromatra.com>, SARTRE Thierry
      <Thierry.SARTRE@airbus.aeromatra.com>
Subject:  RE: [cgmopen-members] Fwd: Re: CGM Interested parties


Lofton and memebers,

     Not talking about only WebCGM but in general.

     We have experienced some troubles with different tools for handling
CGM, especially whan passing from one to the other. Generally, files are
opened but displayed is not exactly what is expected. This a very important
point to be solved and quickly, because it is, as I experienced it, a major
drawback for CGM technology. Each time, I talk about using CGM, I am asked
to be sure that viewers and editors will be able to share completely CGM
files (in order to ensure customers satisfaction), which is not the case
for
all profiles. The following statements are made to me "using CGM for
exchange allows reauthoring that is the theory, but what if the files are
not exchangeable at 100%".
     Indeed, the use of CGM is of no added value if you have to be linked
to a vendor for a correct usage of the standard and files provided. Besides
our customers are not ready to accept that.

     I know I am a bit provocative.

     Comments or different opinions?


Best regards,

Franck DULUC
AIRBUS FRANCE
SDN7 - D0611
316, route de Bayonne - 31060 TOULOUSE Cedex
FRANCE
&(33) 5.61.18.19.16   * (33) 5.61.93.59.44
*franck.duluc@airbus.aeromatra.com


-----Message d'origine-----
De: Lofton Henderson [mailto:lofton@rockynet.com]
Date: jeudi 18 octobre 2001 00:01
: cgmopen-members@lists.oasis-open.org
Cc: Scott McGrath
Objet: [cgmopen-members] Fwd: Re: CGM Interested parties


CGM Open Members --

If you have any suggestions about Mr. Cunningham's quandry, I'd be happy to
hear.  Or, you could contact him directly (I'd also be interested to know
any suggestions, if you don't mind Cc'ing or otherwise informing me).  The
problem, I think, is that Micrografx has not implemented WebCGM (assuming
that his frustration is with WebCGM files, and not just generic CGM
instances).

Does anyone know of a WebCGM-to-ActiveCGM (and vice-versa) filter?

-Lofton.

>Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2001 14:08:50 -0600
>To: "Scott McGrath" <scott.mcgrath@oasis-open.org>
>From: Lofton Henderson <lofton@rockynet.com>
>Subject: Re: CGM Interested parties
>Bcc: lofton Henderson <lofton@rockynet.com>
>
>Scott,
>
>Thanks for this.  I'll try to follow up in the next day or so.
>
>Do you see any reason that I shouldn't forward your message to
>cgmopen-members?  Probably get more traffic about workarounds and
>solutions from the active technology vendors and users (I could also
>forward to my contact at Micrografx, who is now being acquired by Corel).
>
>-Lofton.
>
>
>At 05:27 PM 10/16/01 -0400, you wrote:
>>Lofton,
>>
>>Obviously, you saw the message from Caterpillar, but I have a few
>>other interested parties...
>>
>>Gary Cunningham, Northrop Grumman, 408-735-3822
>>gary_cunningham@mail.northgrum.com
>>I met Gary at the XML One expo 2 weeks ago.  He reports how much
>>he enjoys CGM, but he is frustrated, because he believes his
>>micrografx viewers will not open ITEDO files.  He is interested in
>>whatever workarounds you may have and also in joining the cgm
>>community.
>>
>>I am also following up with another lead, XML Cities who is
>>interested in OASIS and CGM., I will copy you on the message.
>>They have a cool tool that converts pdf files to Word docs etc,
>>but they need CGM for vector files.  I will get the intro out
>>tonight and let you follow-up.
>>
>>Stay in touch...
>>
>>Scott McGrath
>>Member Services Manager
>>
>>+1 978 667 5115  (US & Int'l Voice)
>>+1 978 667 5114  (US and Int'l Fax)
>>scott.mcgrath@oasis-open.org
>>http://www.oasis-open.org
>>
>>OASIS
>>PO Box 455
>>Billerica, MA  01821


*******************
Lofton Henderson
1919 Fourteenth St., #604
Boulder, CO   80302

Phone:  303-449-8728
Email:  lofton@rockynet.com
*******************


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