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Subject: Re: [chairs] Oasis document identifiers - conclusion!
I would prefer to stick with "-" rather than "_". When the filenames are presented on a web page as hyperlinks and are underlined, you can't distinguish the "_" from a space character. Not a big deal, I admit - just a "presentation" preference... Rob Philpott RSA Security Inc. The Most Trusted Name in e-Security Tel: 781-515-7115 Mobile: 617-510-0893 Fax: 781-515-7020 mailto:rphilpott@rsasecurity.com-----Original Message----- From: Eddie O'Brien [mailto:eddie@ringtailsolutions.com] Sent: Monday, January 13, 2003 10:23 AM To: chairs@lists.oasis-open.org Subject: RE: [chairs] Oasis document identifiers - conclusion! I've been following the conversation and my only preference would be a programmatic preference: oasis_####_odrxml_blah_1.0.html rather than.... oasis-####-odrxml-blah-1.0.html People who write code for living will understand the point, I also think its more visually legible, but I can live with either. Regards Eddie O'Brien -----Original Message----- From: jkeane [mailto:jik@jkeane.com] Sent: Monday, January 13, 2003 10:12 AM To: chairs@lists.oasis-open.org Subject: RE: [chairs] Oasis document identifiers - conclusion! Can any NOT live with this approach to document identifiers? James I. Keane OdrXML, LegalXML Steering Committee -----Original Message----- From: Daniel Greenwood [mailto:dang@mit.edu] Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2003 11:52 PM To: Philpott, Robert; chairs@lists.oasis-open.org Subject: RE: [chairs] Oasis document identifiers - conclusion! Ah, yes, that is right - I went too fast - thanks for catching that. Then would the final proposal be as follows: OASIS Standard stage: oasis-####-odrxml-blah-1.0.html oasis-####-odrxml-blah-1.0.pdf Committee Spec stage: odrxml-blah-1.0-cs.html odrxml-blah-1.0-cs.pdf odrxml-lala-1.0-cs.html odrxml-lala-1.0-cs.pdf Working Drafts stage: odrxml-blah-1.0-draft-03.html odrxml-blah-1.0-draft-03-diff.html odrxml-blah-1.0-draft-02.html odrxml-blah-1.0-draft-02-diff.html odrxml-blah-1.0-draft-01.html odrxml-lala-1.0-draft-03.html odrxml-lala-1.0-draft-03-diff.html odrxml-lala-1.0-draft-02.html odrxml-lala-1.0-draft-02-diff.html odrxml-lala-1.0-draft-01.html OASIS TC Formation stage: odrxml-charter-1.0.html Thanks, - Dan, eContracts TC ============================================== | Daniel J. Greenwood, Esq. | Director, E-Commerce Architecture Program | MIT School of Architecture and Planning | 77 Massachusetts Avenue, Room 7-231 | Cambridge, MA 02139 | http://ecitizen.mit.edu | or http://www.civics.com | dang@mit.edu ============================================== -----Original Message----- From: Philpott, Robert [mailto:rphilpott@rsasecurity.com] Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2003 11:33 PM To: 'dang@mit.edu'; 'chairs@lists.oasis-open.org' Subject: RE: [chairs] Oasis document identifiers - conclusion! Dan - I think you missed a nuance of Eve's recommendation. You also did not factor in the OASIS-approved document number in your examples. Was that intentional? which has been discussed on the list. Eve did not include a "-os" for oasis-approved standard. For those docs, the oasis-approved document ID gets prepended to the file name with an "oasis-" label.OASIS Standard stage: oasis-####-odrxml-charter-1.0.doc oasis-####-odrxml-charter-1.0.pdfI actually prefer this over the "-os" suggestion since it makes a clear distinction between draft or cs specs and final approved standards. Also, "os" and "cs" look a bit too much alike and may cause confusion. Rob Philpott RSA Security Inc. The Most Trusted Name in e-Security Tel: 781-515-7115 Mobile: 617-510-0893 Fax: 781-515-7020 mailto:rphilpott@rsasecurity.com-----Original Message----- From: Daniel Greenwood [mailto:dang@mit.edu] Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2003 11:24 PM To: Eve L. Maler; chairs@lists.oasis-open.org Subject: RE: [chairs] Oasis document identifiers - conclusion! I am also in complete agreement with Eve's proposal. Just to be sure we're all on the same page, and the proposal is complete, I have assumed that this naming scheme is intended to include final Oasis Standards (which I further assume should be denoted as "os"). I scratched out a fuller example below (primarily to illustrate to my own satisfaction how this would actually play out), which I share to see if it is correct. I have further assumed that there would be no "-diff" designationsforofficial Oasis Standards or Technical Committee Specifications - because they are in fact "final" stand alone documents. But I have applied the "-diff" suffix to draft documents (including draft spec/standards), different where versions of the same document mustbedealt with, and a "red-lined" version to show changes is helpful. Along the same lines, I don't understand the need for any additional trailing version information after a "cs" or "os" document, as those designations mean the document has already been voted upon by OASISoragreed upon by the TC and is final in THAT form. A later final official version of an earlier final official standard or specification would be, I presume, "2.0" rather than "1.0". So, I have removed the additional versioning information from the "os" and "cs" documents. Is this not correct? I've played out the naming scheme with two official documents:"blah"and "lala". Blah goes on "all the way" to become an OASIS Standard (os), while the "lala" document plateaus as a Technical Committee Specification (cs). There are drafts of both "blah" and "lala". Since there is, technically, no TC before a final charter exists, I have not bothered to apply a version chain to earlier drafts of a charter document (though individuals forming a TC certainly may wish to use the same convention) and I have called that phase the "TC Formation stage" rather than "standard stage" to be clearer aboutwhathas actually happened. After the TC is formed, then the standards creation work begins during the "wording drafts" phase. OASIS Standard stage: odrxml-blah-1.0-os.html odrxml-blah-1.0-os.pdf Committee Spec stage: odrxml-blah-1.0-cs.html odrxml-blah-1.0-cs.pdf odrxml-lala-1.0-cs.html odrxml-lala-1.0-cs.pdf Working drafts: odrxml-blah-1.0-draft-03.html odrxml-blah-1.0-draft-03-diff.html odrxml-blah-1.0-draft-02.html odrxml-blah-1.0-draft-02-diff.html odrxml-blah-1.0-draft-01.html odrxml-lala-1.0-draft-03.html odrxml-lala-1.0-draft-03-diff.html odrxml-lala-1.0-draft-02.html odrxml-lala-1.0-draft-02-diff.html odrxml-lala-1.0-draft-01.html OASIS TC formation stage: odrxml-charter-1.0.html A final note - I believe it is very important that any finalagreementon semantic naming schemes include the "cs" phase as a separate designation, and not simply the "draft" or "os" phases. I wonder: is the above "blah" and "lala" example a correct (or at least acceptable) extrapolation of how the proposal would beapplied?Thanks, - Dan Greenwood, Chair of the eContracts TC ============================================== | Daniel J. Greenwood, Esq. | Director, E-Commerce Architecture Program | MIT School of Architecture and Planning | 77 Massachusetts Avenue, Room 7-231 | Cambridge, MA 02139 | http://ecitizen.mit.edu | or http://www.civics.com | dang@mit.edu ============================================== -----Original Message----- From: Eve L. Maler [mailto:eve.maler@sun.com] Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2003 10:34 PM To: chairs@lists.oasis-open.org Subject: Re: [chairs] Oasis document identifiers - conclusion? I'm sure the Kavi system will be wonderful and I agree that having proper metadata is the right thing to do, but it very much appealstome to have a filenaming convention that works even when all you have is text editors, file directories, and browsers, with no cool registry/repository in the middle. The web earned its success by working even in "roughing-it" circumstances, and I think we'llbenefitby continuing to account for them. jkeane wrote:1) Have a meaningful name - no acronyms or abbreviations forcontents.Short TC names do makes sense. I keep an archive of workproducts,pruningout unnecessary documents and most drafts after the project islongover.When you are browsing an older directory the Alzheimer effectkicksin aftersix months.Certainly it makes sense to avoid being cryptic. However, I notice that the current OASIS web server seems to truncate long filenames when doing a directory display, losing critical information unless you hoveroverthe link and observe the full link name in the browser footer bar. Can this truncation be fixed?2) We store related documents in project sub-directories. Thismakes itunnecessary to include extensive generic info in every file name.If youstore all the docs in a single directory, it would make more senseto havethe prime sort by TC name.I was thinking that all the filenames of all the TC outputs shouldbedistinguishable and unique even if they were put into one big pile. Thus, the TC ID should always appear in the filename because itservesas a "namespace" that disambiguates otherwise-similar filenames from different groups. Project subdirectories are great if called for,butI'd think it would still be desirable to reflect those categories in their filenames.3) Include the date (as proposed, but in a sortable format) Filedateschange (i.e. moving all files from computer A to computer B formaintenance. Yikes, I really hate putting publication dates in filenames. W3Cdoesthat, and it's a really unwieldy and hard-to-mentally-sort device.Inthe SAML group, we've just been using the trick of publishing 00,01,02, 03, etc. drafts, and I've been advocating it here because it has worked incredibly well. That way, implementors can say "Our latest download conforms to draft 31, but we're prepared to change it to reflect the draft-34 changes by next Wednesday." And in a meetingyoucan say "I move to accept draft 07 of this document as a Committee Spec." The constantly increasing draft number gives moreinformationat a glance than does the (frankly random) date on which publication occurred, and is way shorter.4) Include version sequence in sortable format. This will avoidconfusionabout which drafts are on the table.Agree. Though so far we've been discussing allowing the{description}field to be anything the TC wants, so one way to go is to make recommendations (SHOULDs) about this, and another is to make fast rules (MUSTs) about it.5) Add any relevant trailing info about status or specialfeatures.Sure.Here is an example of what we used in drafting the Online DisputeResolutionCharter. This approach has enabled me to work with ad hoc teamsovermanyprojects over many years and not have too much confusion orspendingtime indiscussions (which we needed do here) like this. OdrXML Charter 1.0 DRAFT 2002.09.26.doc OdrXML Charter 1.1 DRAFT 2002.10.07.doc OdrXML Charter 1.2 DRAFT FINAL 2002.10.18.doc OdrXML Charter 1.2 DRAFT FINAL REDLINE 2002.10.18.doc OdrXML Charter 1.2a DRAFT FINAL 2002.10.19.doc OdrXML Charter FINAL 2002.11.11.docExposing my weirdnesses once again, I have an allergy to spaces in filenames. Most systems and software handle them now, but a few old ones don't handle them so well. I do agree with your ordering of the fields, though. My preferences (including lowercase spelling :-) mapped onto your ordering would look (very) approximately like this: Working drafts: odrxml-charter-1.0-draft-01.doc odrxml-charter-1.0-draft-02.doc odrxml-charter-1.0-draft-03.doc Committee Spec stage: odrxml-charter-1.0-cs-01.doc odrxml-charter-1.0-cs-01-diff.doc odrxml-charter-1.0-cs-01.pdf OASIS Standard stage: oasis-####-odrxml-charter-1.0.doc oasis-####-odrxml-charter-1.0.pdf I would like to come to closure on this matter really soon because I don't have a lot more cycles to spend on it, but the problem is that we don't have a clearly defined decision-making authority responsibleforthis -- unless it's Karl?... Eve -- Eve Maler +1 781 442 3190 Sun Microsystems cell +1 781 354 9441 Web Technologies and Standards eve.maler @ sun.com ---------------------------------------------------------------- To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl> ---------------------------------------------------------------- To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl>---------------------------------------------------------------- To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl> ---------------------------------------------------------------- To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl> ---------------------------------------------------------------- To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl>---------------------------------------------------------------- To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl>
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