Many TCs have active members, passive members, and silent observers. It is not always clear that all of them *want* to be on the comments list.
It can be much clearer to TC members that they should subscribe, particularly if they are in the "Active" group. It is not always clear how to make it clearer, given that subscribing to the comment list is already on the TC's Jira page.
I vote against making it automatic, except, perhaps for the Chair, Secretary , Editor. It might be better to make a discussion of this a part of the start-up of each TC.
tc
"We have now sunk to a depth at which restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men." - George Orwell
Toby Considine
Chair, OASIS oBIX Technical Committee
U.S. National Inst. of Standards and Tech. Smart Grid Architecture Committee
Facilities Technology Office
University of North Carolina
Chapel Hill, NC
Email: Toby.Considine@ unc.edu
Phone: (919)962-9073
http://www.oasis-open.org
blog:
www.NewDaedalus.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Chet Ensign [
mailto:chet.ensign@oasis-open.org]
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 1:52 PM
To: Martin Chapman
Cc: Robin Cover; Farrukh Najmi; chairs@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: Re: [chairs] Gentle reminder to all TCs regarding acknowledging comments during your feedback
Wasn't me ...
I checked and indeed -comment@ lists must be subscribed to explicitly.
I'll send a note with several observations to chairs@ this week including the suggestion that the chair either subscribe and follow or assign someone on the TC to subscribe and follow the comment list.
And I agree, getting a bounce back from the comment list is not the same thing as an acknowledgement.
/chet
On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 1:17 PM, Martin Chapman <MARTIN.CHAPMAN@oracle.com> wrote:
> The "problem" with subscribing ever TC member to the TC comment list would be the temptation to have email discussions on the comment list itself. That's what needs to be avoided, as per TC process. However, I could see the TC mail list being subscribed to
the comment list such that comments are auto-forwarded to the TC list - if that is possible.
>
> BTW not sure who that TC admin was ( :-) ) but getting a copy back from the list one sent to does not actually mean anyone read or logged the issues, so a reactive ack is not a bad thing IMHO.
>
> Martin.
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Robin Cover [
mailto:robin@oasis-open.org]
>> Sent: 29 March 2012 20:42
>> To: Farrukh Najmi
>> Cc: chairs@lists.oasis-open.org
>> Subject: Re: [chairs] Gentle reminder to all TCs regarding
>> acknowledging comments during your feedback
>>
>> > Also, I think it would be a good idea for all TC voting members to
>> > be automatically subscribed to the TC comment list. Is this
>> > possible Robin / Chet?
>>
>> Farrukh, thanks for your suggestion. I'll make sure the TC Admin
>> team takes this up (possibly with IT dept) to see whether the idea is
>> good from a policy and technology POV, in theory.
>> If from a technology POV, we might be able to offer the facility
>> ("voting members auto-subscribed to comment list") as an option for
>> TCs that wanted to activate the feature. All subject to rules
>> review, of course.
>>
>> - Robin
>>
>>
>> Robin Cover
>> OASIS, Director of Information Services Editor, Cover Pages and XML
>> Daily Newslink
>> Email: robin@oasis-open.org
>> Staff bio:
http://www.oasis-open.org/who/staff.php#cover
>> Cover Pages:
http://xml.coverpages.org/
>> Newsletter:
http://xml.coverpages.org/newsletterArchive.html
>> Tel: +1 972-296-1783
>>
>>
>> On Thu, 29 Mar 2012, Farrukh Najmi wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > Robert,
>> >
>> > I would like to get a copy of your python script. That sounds very useful.
>> >
>> > Also, I think it would be a good idea for all TC voting members to
>> > be
>> automatically subscribed to the TC comment list. Is
>> > this possible Robin / Chet?
>> >
>> > On 03/29/2012 03:14 PM, robert_weir@us.ibm.com wrote:
>> > Robin Cover <robin@oasis-open.org> wrote on 03/29/2012 08:04:55 AM:
>> > > Subject: Re: [chairs] Gentle reminder to all TCs regarding
>> > > acknowledging comments during your feedback
>> > >
>> > > > Lately I have received some complaints from people who
>> > > > took the time to provide comments during public reviews...
>> > >
>> > > Excellent reminder below about professional etiquette
>> > > in taking time to "thank those who take the time to send
>> > > you comments."
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> > It is good to have clarification on this. I recall hearing
>> > from a
>> TC Admin, several years ago, that since
>> > subscription to the comment list was required for someone to
>> > submit
>> a comment in the first place, they would
>> > receive a copy of their own comment, via the list, and this
>> > was
>> sufficient to "acknowledge the receipt".
>> >
>> > Also, from the "professional etiquette" standpoint, I don't
>> > think it
>> matters whether a comment came in strictly
>> > within the bounds of a public review. It is a good idea to
>> acknowledge all comments, whenever received.
>> >
>> >
>> > > This may be a good time also to remind TCs about the
>> > > professional courtesy in providing a published summary
>> > > of all comments and dispositions at the end of a public
>> > > review period. The following complaint has also been
>> > > heard, increasingly, from parties who simply want to
>> > > know what happened in a public review event:
>> > >
>> > > "I looked for the disposition log following the public
>> > review
>> > > of the specification, and could not find any
>> > document/record
>> > > summarizing the disposition of comments."
>> > >
>> > > The public review "disposition log" is not labeled with
>> > > that descriptor in the TC Process, which says in more
>> > > general terms that a final record (viz., "at the end")
>> > > is required:
>> > >
>> > > "The TC must acknowledge the receipt of each comment,
>> > > track the comments received, and post to its
>> > > primary e-mail list its disposition of each comment
>> > > at the end of the review period."
>> > >
>> > >
http://www.oasis-open.org/policies-guidelines/tc-
>> process#publicReview-comments
>> > >
>> >
>> > We've also sent a link to this report to the comment list itself.
>> I'm surprised that is not a required or at
>> > least a recommended practice.
>> >
>> >
>> > > Historically, it's become common practice for TCs
>> > > to present a final (rollup) summary using a spreadsheet
>> > > or similar publication which compiles (logs) the comments
>> > > from the two lists (TC Comment List, TC Discussion
>> > > List), removes duplicates, isolates discrete issues
>> > > from compound/aggregated statements, documents
>> > > the TC's disposition for each comment, and links to
>> > > the list archive sources for each atomic comment.
>> > > TCs sometimes also refer to issues in a JIRA
>> > > project (component), if triage of comments has been
>> > > done using the JIRA issue tracker facility.
>> > >
>> >
>> > We've processed 1,845 public comments in the ODF TC, over
>> > three
>> versions. Using JIRA to process them has been
>> > essential. We use a python script to scrape the comments
>> > from the
>> comment list, and turn them into URL/commands
>> > for import into JIRA, using their REST API. Then the TC
>> > resolves
>> via JIRA and at the end exports to a
>> > spreadsheet.
>> >
>> > Of course, not every TC will need to deal with that many
>> > comments,
>> but I'm happy to share my python script if
>> > anyone wants to implement a similar workflow for their TC.
>> >
>> > > Such summary presentation in a published disposition
>> > > log (also called a "Comment Resolution Log") makes it
>> > > easy for any member of the TC, OASIS, or external
>> > > party to examine the key facts about a public review.
>> > >
>> > > I have suggested to the TC Admin team that we
>> > > initiate a practice of including the disposition log
>> > > (summary) or a pointer to it in the OASIS Library
>> > > with each public review document/stage, so that
>> > > it may always be be found in a predictable location,
>> > > even if the summary is "no comments received".
>> > >
>> > > Further discussion about the role of a Disposition
>> > > Log (aka Comment Resolution Log) as a means of
>> > > providing the summary "at the end of the review period"
>> > > is presented in the TC Handbook (under "Feedback"):
>> > >
>> > >
http://docs.oasis-open.org/TChandbook/Reference/
>> > > PublicReviews.html#commentResolutionLog
>> > >
>> > > Cheers,
>> > >
>> > > - Robin
>> > >
>> > > Robin Cover
>> > > OASIS, Director of Information Services
>> > > Editor, Cover Pages and XML Daily Newslink
>> > > Email: robin@oasis-open.org
>> > > Staff bio:
>> >
http://www.oasis-open.org/people/staff/robin-cover
>> > > Cover Pages:
http://xml.coverpages.org/
>> > > Newsletter:
>> >
http://xml.coverpages.org/newsletterArchive.html
>> > > Tel: +1 972-296-1783
>> > >
>> > > ======
>> > >
>> > > On Wed, 28 Mar 2012, Chet Ensign wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > Chairs,
>> > > >
>> > > > Just a short etiquette reminder that I ask you to share
>> > with
>> members
>> > > > of your Technical Committees as appropriate.
>> > > >
>> > > > Lately I have received some complaints from people who
>> > took the
>> time
>> > > > to provide comments during public reviews only to have
>> > their
>> offerings
>> > > > seemingly disappear into the electronic void.
>> > > >
>> > > > The OASIS TC Process places only the most minimal of
>> > obligations
>> on
>> > > > TCs regarding the handling of comments however it does
>> > say in
>> section
>> > > > 3.2, Public Review of a Committee Draft that "The TC must
>> acknowledge
>> > > > the receipt of each comment..."
>> > > >
>> > > > Please, if you do nothing else, acknowledge and thank
>> > those who
>> take
>> > > > the time to send you comments. It may be easiest if one
>> > TC
>> member is
>> > > > tasked with the responsibility of processing comments
>> > back in to
>> the
>> > > > TC, including acknowledging receipt. But however you do
>> > it, if
>> someone
>> > > > makes the effort to provide you with feedback, it is just
>> > common
>> > > > courtesy to let them know that their comments have been
>> received.
>> > > >
>> > > > Thanks & best regards,
>> > > >
>> > > > /chet
>> > > > ----------------
>> > > > Chet Ensign
>> > > > Director of Standards Development and TC Administration
>> > > > OASIS: Advancing open standards for the information
>> > society
>> > > >
http://www.oasis-open.org
>> > > >
>> > > > Primary: +1 973-378-3472
>> > > > Mobile: +1 201-341-1393
>> > > >
>> > > > Follow OASIS on:
>> > > > LinkedIn:
http://linkd.in/OASISopen
>> > > > Twitter:
http://twitter.com/OASISopen
>> > > > Facebook:
http://facebook.com/oasis.open
>> > > >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Regards,
>> > Farrukh Najmi
>> >
>> > Web:
http://www.wellfleetsoftware.com
>> >
>> >
>> >
--
/chet
----------------
Chet Ensign
Director of Standards Development and TC Administration
OASIS: Advancing open standards for the information society
http://www.oasis-open.org
Primary: +1 973-378-3472
Mobile: +1 201-341-1393
Follow OASIS on:
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