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Subject: ebRIM - Registry Information Model for Code Lists

Fellow Code List Representation TC members,

This is a discussion item we can bring up in our first meeting, so 
this is the background.

With so many members lined up for our committee, we need to identify 
those who may have ebRIM experience with which to assess some 
discussion that has come to our attention regarding an existing 
expression of code lists.

Below is an email thread.  I am swayed by Tony Coates's arguments 
that ebRIM is not a sufficiently neutral expression of coded values 
in and of themselves, thus allowing us to focus on genericode as the 
basis upon which we build our first set of committee 
deliverables.  The first post is as I've received it from Farrukh, 
followed by two analytical responses from Tony.  I am interested in 
the analysis of others.

If other members of our committee are familiar with the ebRIM work, 
perhaps they can offer their feedback on the suitability of the 
proposal and the comments from Tony.

Thanks!  And thank you to Farrukh for bringing this to the 
committee's attention for our consideration.

. . . . . . . . . . . Ken

>Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2006 10:22:29 -0400
>From: Farrukh Najmi <Farrukh.Najmi@sun.com>
>Subject: Re: [members] OASIS TC Call for Participation: OASIS Code List
>  Representation TC
>Sender: Farrukh.Najmi@sun.com
>To: jon.bosak@sun.com
>Cc: Eduardo.Gutentag@sun.com, Monica.Martin@sun.com,
>         gkholman@CraneSoftwrights.com
>jon.bosak@sun.com wrote:
>>| As you may be aware ebXML Registry and Repository standard 
>>includes | definition, management, governance, discovery and reuse 
>>of code lists. | It also defines an XML Schema for code lists. Do 
>>you have any | suggestions on whether and how we should seed this 
>>new TC with ebXML | Registry code list offerings?
>>I was not aware that there was any kind of ebXML RR schema for
>>code lists.  I'm copying Ken Holman, the chair of the new TC,
>>for possible follow-up.
>Thanks Jon.
>Ken, I would be glad to discuss this in more detail if there is interest.
>Let me know ho you wish to proceed. Thanks.
>Attached is a draft proposal I had sent to Lisa Seaburg of the UBL 
>TC in May 13, 2003 under the subject "First draft of UBL code list 
>in ebRIM writeup"
>The text in the email was as follows:
>Hi Lisa,
>Attached is the first draft of the writeup on using ebRIM
>ClassificationSchemes fro UBL code lists. There is much that I am not
>clear in the "Code List Rules" version 0.4 document and therefor 
>there may be errors in the mapping. Note that I kept the sample 
>minimal to ease understanding. It is missing several Slots to 
>represent the CCTS attributes many of which I do not fully comprehend yet.
>BTW the more I think about this I am becoming convinced that the 
>right approach is for:
>1. CCTS to define a seralization format based upon a binding to 
>ebRIM (ebXML Registry Information Model). This work is already in 
>progress in registry TC sub-team on CCTS with CCTS team involvement.
>2. UBL TC to consider using out of the box the seralization format 
>that CCTS defines for code lists.
>The above 2 steps would ensure that we build a cohesive stack and 
>not have different ways of doing the same things in different parts 
>of teh stack.
>Of course this is a loaded suggestion and requires careful deliberation.
>Let me know if you would like to meet sometime to discuss this. Thanks.

>Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2006 19:55:39 +0100
>To: "G. Ken Holman" <gkholman@cranesoftwrights.com>
>Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: [members] OASIS TC Call for Participation: 
>OASIS Code List Representation TC
>Reply-To: abcoates@mileywatts.com
>From: "Anthony B. Coates (Miley Watts)" <abcoates@mileywatts.com>
>Organization: Miley Watts LLP
>Hi Ken.  I am aware of this stuff, and it's an interesting discussion
>point.  I have some issues with the way the ebRIM stuff works for code
>lists.  As I understand it, they don't really have a format for code lists
>as much as they have a format for ebRIM data that happens to represent a
>code list, which isn't quite the same thing.  It's an interesting
>discussion point, and it could easily be the biggest single point of
>debate in discussing whether genericode will be the base of the TC's
>work.  However, I think that will also depend on whether any of the ebRIM
>folks get involved.
>Cheers, Tony.

>Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2006 22:02:09 +0100
>To: "G. Ken Holman" <gkholman@cranesoftwrights.com>
>Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: [members] OASIS TC Call for Participation: 
>OASIS Code List Representation TC
>Reply-To: abcoates@mileywatts.com
>From: "Anthony B. Coates (Miley Watts)" <abcoates@mileywatts.com>
>Organization: Miley Watts LLP
>Hi Ken.  Let me expand on my previous reply.  I don't consider the ebRIM
>code list representation to be a neutral representation of a code list.
>It's a representation of how code lists are stored in an ebRIM repository
>(as I understand it).  In the same way that Schemas aren't appropriate as
>a neutral representation of a code list, neither is the ebRIM XML.
>However, I would like to have interoperability with ebRIM.  The sticking
>point there is that ebRIM defines a hierarchical code list structure which
>only allows for single parents in the hierarchy.  I have tried to avoid
>hierarchy in the code lists, but if we have to have it, it would have to
>accommodate multiple parents, because single-parent hierarchies only work
>80% of the time.
>Cheers, Tony.


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