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Subject: RE: [dita] indexing question


Well, we may need to discuss it, but here's a position statement.
 
------------
 
As Chris Wong wrote, index entries are point-like by default.
 
Here's a potential accomodation.
Chris wrote: > We can leave open the possibility that a processor may elect to treat an indexterm in a topic prolog as a page range: for example, if that topic is deeply nested.
This one is a tempting accomodation, but I'll try an argument that justifies not making this accomodation.
 
------------
 
Suppose that we are looking at a topic with no nested sub-topics.
 
When indexing the first reference to an item, the entry should generate a point reference to the initial point where that item enters the discussion. If the item is a prominent item within that scope, a reference to the initial point is sufficient, because the reader is likely to be interested in a large fraction of the scope without being prompted by an index entry.
 
If the item is a subsidiary item in the scope and only occurs once, a reference to the initial point is sufficient, because the item only occurs once.
 
If the item is a subsidiary item that occurs multiple times, or if the occurrences span multiple adjacent scopes, than a page range is appropriate.
 
--------------
 
Now applying these guidelines to topic-level index entries ...
 
A topic-level index entry is an assertion that the item is a prominent item within that scope. The reference is to the topic as a whole, and a reference to the initial point is sufficient.
 
A start-of-range assertion at the topic level is not well defined. How do you know in a single topic that there will be other subsequent topics that will address the same item? Ranges are inherently appropriate for spans across contents of a topic or contents of a grouping of topics.
 
In a map, a start-of-range assertion does make sense.
 
Best wishes,
 
Bruce
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Wong [mailto:cwong@idiominc.com]
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 6:05 PM
To: Erik Hennum; Grosso, Paul
Cc: dita@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: RE: [dita] indexing question

One question that comes to mind is: why would you want a page range that spans one and only one topic? For example, I pulled out my old "XML in a Nutshell" and looked up "Arabic Unicode block". This table spans 2 pages, but is only indexed with a page number pointing to the start of the topic. That is because the topic is so obviously self-enclosed that a single page reference is sufficient.
 
What I'd say is that an indexterm in a topic prolog points to the topic. Page range markers in a topic prolog has no meaning, since the indexterm is out of the content flow. So index-range-start/index-range-end should be ignored. This will allow an author to generate an index reference to a single topic by entering an indexterm in the topic prolog.
 
We can leave open the possibility that a processor may elect to treat an indexterm in a topic prolog as a page range: for example, if that topic is deeply nested.
 
Chris
 

From: Erik Hennum [mailto:ehennum@us.ibm.com]
Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 3:08 PM
To: Grosso, Paul
Cc: dita@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: RE: [dita] indexing question

Hi, Paul (Grosso) and Indexing Enthusiasts:

To follow up on the index range question, we had a fair bit of discussion about ranges last Fall. The consensus at the time was that ranges should be set explicitly. A sample from the thread:


I guess my perspective remains that an indexterm in the prolog could be treated as a special case of a general rule: that an indexterm covers the content of its container and that processing emits a page range if the indexed container extends to more than 2 pages.

Even so, I don't want to undo the progress we've made:

Can we isolate any anomalies in the current indexing proposal and fix those quickly without changing the fundamental approach?

Paul, are you aware of other hiccups besides the requirement to index an entire topic from start of the title through the end of the related links or the end of the nested topics?

Chris (Wong), as the lead on the indexing proposal, do you have any suggestions?


Hoping that's useful,


Erik Hennum
ehennum@us.ibm.com

Inactive hide details for "Grosso, Paul" <pgrosso@ptc.com>"Grosso, Paul" <pgrosso@ptc.com>


          "Grosso, Paul" <pgrosso@ptc.com>

          06/29/2006 05:05 PM


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RE: [dita] indexing question



From: Erik Hennum [mailto:ehennum@us.ibm.com]
Sent:
Thursday, 2006 June 29 18:13
To:
JoAnn Hackos
Cc:
dita@lists.oasis-open.org; Grosso, Paul
Subject:
RE: [dita] indexing question

That said, we still need a way to generate a range over the whole topic.

Huh? I would have thought what you just said in the first paragraph means that an indexterm within the prolog generates a range over the whole topic. Now I'm really confused.



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