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Subject: Groups - DITA TC Meeting Minutes 27 March 2018 uploaded
- From: Tom Magliery<tom.magliery@justsystems.com>
- To: dita@lists.oasis-open.org
- Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2018 12:07:21 -0700 (PDT)
Submitter's message
=================================================
Minutes of the OASIS DITA TC
Tuesday, 27 March 2018
Recorded by Nancy Harrison and Tom Magliery
link to agenda for this meeting:
https://wiki.oasis-open.org/dita/Agenda-27-March-2018
Attendance:
Robert Anderson, Deb Bissantz, Carsten Brennecke, Bill Burns, Stan Doherty, Kris Eberlein, Maria Essig, Richard Hamilton, Nancy Harrison, Alan Hauser, Scott Hudson, Eliot Kimber, Tom Magliery, Keith Schenglie-Roberts, Eric Sirois, Jim Tivy
Business
========
1. Roll call
Regrets: Carlos Evia, Chris Nitchie, Dawn Stevens, Bob Thomas
2. Approve minutes from previous business meeting:
20 March 2018:
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/201803/msg00061.html (Harrison, Wed, 21 Mar 2018)
Moved by Kris, 2nded by Tom, approved by TC
3. Announcements:
New TC members: None
4. 6 September 2016
Kris: Revise subject scheme example topic pulled from errata 01
19 September 2017:
Kris and Robert: Draft response to Radu's blog post and e-mail to dita-comment
13 February 2018
Kris and Bob: Fix style sheets to produce OASIS-requested formatting changes (IN PROGRESS)
20 March 2018
Robert: Check spec about language and use of otherprops as a special-purpose attribute; include requirement for that language in stage 3 proposal for issue #18
Robert; I edited the stage 2 propasal to make sure the necessary language gets in
5. CMS/DITA NA 2018 conference
Meeting on 24 April 2018 cancelled
Who will be there?
Kris, Nancy, Scott, Maria, Robert, Stan, Alan, Keith, Tom, Deb, Eliot, Bill?
Shall we have a dinner? Volunteer to organize?
[discussion on dinner night - conflict with vendor dinners on Tuesday and/or Monday casino night, requiring vendors presence...]
Scott volunteered to organize/investigate, Deb will help.
***ActionItem; Kris will let Scott/Deb know who'll be at the DITA/NA conference to plan a dinner or lunch.
6. Update from DITA Adoption TC
Kris; long time since we've had a report from Adoption TC; wrt the recent mail on a new forum site, there wasn't clear connection to dita.xml.org. So I propose that we have a report from Adoption TC on the last TC mtg of each month.
Stan; yes, that will work.
Keith; chief item of news is that we have things ready for revamped dita.xml.org (DXL). Congility offered server facilities; we had hoped to have it in time for DITA/NA 2017, but that was not possible, but it will be ready before 2018 DITA/NA. We have a working UI for Congility server to host features from previous old version, also we're updating content from the old site to the new. We moved over a chunk of blog posts, but not everything; a lot of historical archival material is on it, though not all,
Kris; is there a URL?
Keith; there is, but I don't have it; I'll circulate it after meeting
***ActionItem; Keith will circulate URL for DXL.
Keith; also, had a request for a forum added to DITA adoption, we hadn't thought of that, but we've done it and we'll try to keep it up.
Nancy; how does it play in with dita-users and others?
Keith; I don't know; we thought it would be good to have an alternative on the DXL website for discussion, but it may be that current yahoo and linkedin sites are too well-entrenched; we'll have to see. Switchover is just about ready. some more work on initial front matter material. The old version of DXL website will be ported to a sub-domain, as an 'archive', when we switch over officially to Congility server to dita.xml.org domain. The switchover will be on April 19, just before DITA/NA.
Kris; the original site had a forum section, with an editorial board; we decided to de-activate it because it had a lot of spam and not much participation by experts, most discussion happens on yahoo group. any comments?
Robert; for the same reasons, I wish luck to the new moderator...
Keith; I hear you; that will be an ongoing project...
Kris; will there be a moderator?
Keith; that's the plan.
Robert; current version of writeup on DITA-OT implies a much closer connection between DITA and DITA-OT than actually exists; i'm a bit nervous about this. We wanted to pull the DITA-OT out of the yahoo forum, but failed at that; I'm concerned about the suggestion that they're the same.
Keith; things are still highly mutable; a lot of massaging will be done.
Robert; I'll chat with Greg, since he's the one updating it.
7. "LwDITA: An Introduction" committee note
New package: https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/dita/document.php?document_id=62491&referring_url=%2Fkws
Progress?
Public review requested on 14 February 2018
15-day public review announced on 23 February 2018: https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/201802/msg00069.html
Public review closed 12 March 2018
Comment resolution log from 2nd public review posted:
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/201803/msg00074.html (Evia, Mon, 26 Mar 2018)
Kris; SC has posted comment resolution log from second review; expect to see resolutions, so we can vote to release it next week; if no new package, no vote.
8. DITA 1.3 Errata 02
Wiki page for DITA 1.3 Errata 02
Update:
TC admin provided list of cover page corrections on 06 February 2018
Source changes implemented:
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/201802/msg00036.html (Eberlein, 09 Feb 2018)
Style sheet changes needed:
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/201802/msg00040.html (Eberlein, 13 Feb 2018)
Progress?
Updated package from Bob Thomas:
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/201803/msg00059.html (Tue, 20 Mar 2018)
Volunteer to check against OASIS requirements?
Schedule
https://wiki.oasis-open.org/dita/DITA-1.3-errata-02-schedule
Kris; Bob has posted an update package; we need a volunteer to look at the package and check against OASIS reqs.
Nancy, Tom volunteered
Tom; so this review is with the goal of checking against OASIS reqs.
Nancy; what do we have to check them against?
Kris; I can help with information and background details.
Tom; both PDF and HTML versions?
Kris; yes, but mostly cover pages.
9. DITA 2.0 stage three proposals
Vote
None
Initial discussion
None
10. DITA 2.0 stage two proposals
Votes to move proposals to stage 3
a. Issue # 18: Make audience, platform, product, and otherprops attributes into specializations
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/201802/msg00104.html
Robert moved, Bill seconded
Result:
yes votes: Robert Anderson, Deb Bissantz, Carsten Brennecke, Bill Burns, Stan Doherty, Kris Eberlein, Maria Essig, Richard Hamilton, Nancy Harrison, Alan Hauser, Scott Hudson, Eliot Kimber, Tom Magliery, Keith Schenglie-Roberts, Eric Sirois
no votes: 0
b. Issue # 106: Allow steps to nest
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/201803/msg00054.html
Robert moved, Scott 2nded
Result:
yes votes: Robert Anderson, Deb Bissantz, Carsten Brennecke, Bill Burns, Stan Doherty, Kris Eberlein, Maria Essig, Richard Hamilton, Nancy Harrison, Alan Hauser, Scott Hudson, Eliot Kimber, Tom Magliery, Keith Schenglie-Roberts, Eric Sirois
no votes: 0
Continuing discussion
Issue #29: Update bookmap
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/201803/msg00083.html (Sirois, Tue, 27 Mar 2018)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/201803/msg00084.html (Kimber, Tue, 27 Mar 2018)
Eric; stage 2 reviewers are Amber and Robert, and Robert and Eliot have both already reviewed it. I've made minor tweaks since my last discussion with them, we had long discussions on changing initial design to remove placeholder and replace it with container called mapresources; I've addressed the earlier point of allowing keydef to be defined in frontmatter. I've also added ditavalref as direct child of bookmap. I've been cleaning up terminology and examples to make it inline with changes.
Kris; questions? comments
Robert; mapresources should be * (0 to any number) rather than options (?).
Eric; that's been fixed.
Robert; what do you do if you pull something that's not 'resource-only' into a mapresources?
Eric; I haven't added the statement about processing impact; we said everything will be resource-only; we didn't mention what processors need to do if they encounter something that's not resouorce only,
Eliot; this situation exists today; either we need to continue to be silent, or address it as general thing.
Robert; resource-only cascades, but you can turn it off. We don't today have an element that allows nesting that is there to be resource-only, so it's different.
Eliot; I see it as something, a convenience, but not doing anything you couldn't do before.
Robert; we've never had an element defined to be resource-only. so we address cascading, but not this in particular.
Kris; so we need to be clear about edge cases. maybe as simple as saying it should be ignored.
Eliot; the behavior has to be consistent; now. processing implications are unknown.
Robert: This element is explicitly a way to say everything in here is treated as resource-only
Eliot: To be clear: the intent of the mapresources element is that it contains resource-only things.
Robert: that's the entire purpose of this element.
Eliot topicgroup is the only precedent for this
Robert: I was about to use that example
Eliot: that's a very strong thing to do, it privileges this one element type
Robert: In my mind that's the purpose of the element - to privilege it that way
Eliot: So we would be saying that for this element type processors should at a minimum report any nested topicref that sets processing role to normal as a warning.
Robert: All I'm saying is that we need to address it
Eliot: I'm saying the way we need to address it is to say in general in bookmap you would not want any normal-role topicrefs to precede frontmatter
Robert: The very first case where we're using this is a very important case
Eliot: I agree that having this semantic is a reasonable thing to want, I just want to be sure we define it in the most general way
Kris: This proposal is very clear about having mapresources as a domain element, so this domain can be used in other maps besides bookmap with the same semantic
Eliot: I'm wondering if this mapresources element should be in the mapgroup domain. My thinking is we have one map-specific domain which is where all the special stuff has been put so far.
Kris: I like that idea
Robert: Everything in mapgroup is a convenience element for map structures.
Eric: Does bookmap include the mapgroup domain now?
Robert: Yes, every map includes it
Tom: Does this element going into mapgroup need to be a separate proposal?
Robert: No, it's sufficient to do it in the same proposal
Robert: Another issue: the proposal says that there's no technical impact of putting in ditavalref because it's a known element. I think because bookmap is so different, there's going to be a noticeable impact on processing. If you have two ditavals at the beginning of a map, that's going to be a problem. Situations like that are covered in use cases under ditavalref but this is the first case where implementation will explicitly have to deal with that and change code.
Eliot: The easiest way to do that is to generate two maps and process each one as if you only started with one
Robert: Logically that's the best way but I would imagine some people will want all their stuff in one book for filter A and then another for filter B and in some cases that will work for ridiculous ordering. Something like this came up with ditavalref before. Really just noting NOT that we need to change the proposal, but that it's something that needs to be noted in the technical section that it will have an impact.
Kris: Any other questions/comments/thoughts?
Kris: Eric, appreciate your work on this
Initial discussion
Issue #105: Redesign chunking
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/201803/msg00071.html (Anderson, Mon, 26 Mar 2018)
Robert: (gave overview of proposal)
Eliot: I'm happy with the proposal as presented.
Stan: Me too
Eliot: I would like to hear Chris Nitchie's opinions
Eliot: This really simplifies the chunking ideas and reduces the complexity of the edge cases.
Kris: I appreciate the understandable token names
Robert: I don't want to vote next week because I want to hear from Chris too
Kris: I would also like time to read through the proposal more thoroughly
12 noon ET close
-- Mr. Tom Magliery
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