dita message
[Date Prev]
| [Thread Prev]
| [Thread Next]
| [Date Next]
--
[Date Index]
| [Thread Index]
| [List Home]
Subject: Groups - DITA TC Meeting Minutes 12 October 2021 uploaded
- From: Nancy Harrison<nharrison@infobridge-solutions.com>
- To: <dita@lists.oasis-open.org>
- Date: Fri, 15 Oct 2021 22:07:13 +0000 (UTC)
Submitter's message
ActionItems:
1. Eliot will try to generate LwD spec using stylesheets and FOP.
2. Kris will update DITA 2.0 proposal deadlines
=================================================
Minutes of the OASIS DITA TC
Tuesday, 12 October 2021
Recorded by Hancy Harrison
link to agenda for this meeting:
https://wiki.OASIS-open.org/dita/PreviousAgendas
Attendance:
Robert Anderson, Carsten Brennecke, Kris Eberlein, Nancy Harrison, Gershon Joseph, Eliot Kimber, Zoe Lawson, Eric Sirois, Frank Wegmann, Jim Tivy
Business
========
1. Roll call
Regrets: Dawn Stevens, Keith Schengili-Roberts, Scott Hudson, Carlos Evia
2. Approve minutes from previous business meeting:
28 September 2021
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00057.html (Harrison, 28 September 2021)
moved by Kris, 2nd Eliot, approved by TC
3. Announcements
Frank is re-joining as member as of today.
4. Action items
27 July 2021
Carlos: Generate PDF of LwDITA spec using OASIS stylesheets
- Kris; run into a hiccup; PDF can be generated using Antenna House, but fails with FOP, don't know what it is, a nasty glitch.
- Eliot; I could take a look
***ActionItem: Eliot will try to generate LwD spec using stylesheets and FOP.
- Robert; issue is that keys are not resolving, spectacular failure.
- Kris; this is beyond Carlos, but it overlaps with 7 Sept. action item, for building spec.
07 September 2021:
Carlos, Frank: Test procedure for building PDFs (TC generic, spec, committee note) with OASIS stylesheets
21 September 2021
Robert: Populate dita-specializations repo with main branch (DITA 1.3 Errata 02, but without XSDs COMPLETED
5. Review of DITA 2.0 proposal deadlines
https://wiki.oasis-open.org/dita/DeadlinesDITA2.0
***ActionItem: Kris will update this list
6. DITA 2.0 stage three proposals
[no updates]
7. DITA 2.0 Webinars: How do you think they went?
Links to PDFs and recordings
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202110/msg00012.html (Eberlein, 12 October 2021)
- Kris; any comments? I haven't gotten attendance lists from OASIS yet.
- Eliot; I thought it went pretty well, I found it informative.
- Robert; it's always hard to tell with webinars whether audience is engaged or not.
- Kris; I think we did a good job fielding questions.
- Robert; I was a bit concerned when we had gone thru all the slides after just 20 minutes, but then we got enough questions to fill the time.
- Kris; I'm not sure if we got any questions from vendors or implementores, seemed like they were mostly from users.
- Robert; Leigh White was one implementor who had questions.
- Kris; if we do this again, maybe we should split it into 2 parts, each with questions.
- Robert; not sure how that would work... people will automatically ask questions about the part we're not covering in the first section.
- Kris; also, it's hard to figure out how to split content. Also, do we think it would be good to do a webinar down the road when we have the spec work completed. targeted to users and IAs?
- Frank; that woud be good.
- Robert; I agree, it needs to wait till spec is more ready.
- Nancy; what about loosening @ specialization? Is that still in or out?
- Kris; it's still in; I'm working on it, it doesn't affect any grammar files. so it didn't interfere with providing 2.0 grammar files for this webinar. We're still including comments from Robert, Chris, and Eliot.
- Kris; we got asked for sample topics for 2.0. and I think we could provide those, from our proposal cycles.
- Eliot; I'm hesitant about that, samples would require maintenance and support.
- Robert; I agree with Eliot.
- Eliot; on the other hand, wrt the DITA demo content set, I could take an AI to produce a 2.0 sample set. DITA demo has a content set, contributed by me, under the DITA community.
- Kris; I think folks are just asking for things like e.g., a 2.0 task topic with nested steps, I don't know if that set would have that.
- Eliot; no, it doesn't, e.g., it predates troubleshooting.
- Kris; and probably doesnn't use a bookmap...
- Eliot; actually, it does...
- Kris; I probably have test files on my system that would serve for most things. I'll cobble those together and we can talk about whether we make a zip file for folks. It would have lots of caveats, e.g., not complete, not maintained.
- Robert; we have a Github repo of doctypes and files. we could put them there with a label 'test' that is available for testing. but people will always complain...
- Kris; the LwD OASIS repo has a 'test' directory.
- Robert; I'd would rather call it test.
- Frank; LwD files are 'samples'. I think we should draw line between test cases and samples. if we call them 'tests', people would expect a test suite, and it would have to be comprehensive.
- Robert; it would make sense to have some of both, 'test' to exercise grammar, and 'samples' to show how to use the features. OTOH, we can't really have samples yet that really show 2.0, since no processor is doing anything special with any 2.0 features.
- Kris; does anyone have sample files that they use to test things about 2.0?
- Robert; we need to make a distinction between tests and samples; I have test files but no sample files.
- Kris; I did some samples to verify grammar changes I was making, so let's continue this online. I do have some files; we can talk about what other files to include, where to put them, and what caveats we want to say. Also, Stan was maintaining some sample sets, some in Thunderbird, which might be useful.
8. Setting up an OASIS publishing environment
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00013.html (Eberlein, 07 September 2021)
Feedback from Carlos and Frank?
- Kris; Frank, have you had a chance to do any testing?
- Frank; not yet
- Kris; Eliot, you volunteered to test LwD spec. Is anyone else interested in this? The reason for this is I don't want to be the sole person capable of publishing OASIS style output. I did it for 1.2 and 1.3, but I don't want to for 2.0.
- Frank; I'd be willing to put some energy into this as soon as I hav e a bit of time.
9. Straw man charter
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00018.html (Stevens, 10 September 2021)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00019.html (Bissantz, 10 September 2021)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00020.html (Chet Ensign, 10 September 2021)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00022.html (Joseph, 12 September 2021)
Updated straw man, which addresses points raised by Chet Ensign and Gershon Joseph
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00026.html (Eberlein, 13 September 2021)
Query out to Chet:
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00029.html (Eberlein, 14 September 2021)
NEW Feedback from Chet:
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00058.html (Chet Ensign, 28 September 2021)
NEW Lastest revised strawman
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202110/msg00013.html (Eberlein, 12 October 2021)
- Kris; everyone, please look at my last version.
- Eliot; under 'scope of work', we need to change 'compliance' to 'conformance.'
- Nancy; and in same section, first sentence is missing 'TC' before DITA.
- Kris; we could approve this with Nancy and Eliot's changes or hold off one week and have everyone compare it with our original and see if there's anything in the charter that this is missing that we really want.
- Eliot; I woulndn't mind one more week.
- Frank; I'd like to vote on it, so one more week would be good.
- Kris; we'll hold off one more week. Can anyone whose not at all involved look at it and see if it's missing anything?
- Nancy; most folks on the call today have had some hand in it already.
- Kris; we'll have a vote next week.
10. Using DITA 2.0 Troubleshooting committee note
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202108/msg00034.html (Eberlein, 31 August 2021)
Most recent draft PDF: https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00024.html (Eberlein, 13 September 2021)
Title for committee note
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00015.html (Eberlein, 07 September 2021)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00016.html (Hudson, 07 September 2021)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00017.html (Harrison, 07 September 2021)
NEW Query to OASIS and their response:
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00048.html (Eberlein, 22 September 2021)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00051.html (Paul Knight, 22 September 2021)
- Kris; I heard back from Chet; his answer to our last question was 'yes, you absolutely have to have both release and verion numbers in the title.'
11. Feedback from Stan Doherty about troubleshooting committee note draft
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202109/msg00056.html (Stan Doherty, 27 September 2021)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202110/msg00002.html (Eberlein, 11 October 2021)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202110/msg00009.html (Stan Doherty, 12 October 2021)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202110/msg00011.html (Eberlein, 12 October 2021)
- Kris; anyone have thoughts?
[Nancy and Gershon]
- Kris; I responded to Stan, some of his points are good, but the goal of CN isn't to address some of his point; our CNs need to be more tightly tied to the DITA standard.
- Gershon; I agree with your point; if the ACM thing works out, that would be the place for some of his concerns.
- Kris; I just can't imagine doing a document of the kind he wants in the TC.
- Gershon; that kind of document was even beyond the adoption TC.
- Kris; right, the part about about developing content across an enterprise, and using troubleshooting as a way to drive that...
- Gershon; that seems way beyond scope of our work.
- Kris; any comments/agreements? I'm interested in seeing how we can weave any of this into the committee note, but think it's just too much. I don't know how many people are actually using troubleshooting topic, but most are not focused on customer-facing info, they're mostly using it for for internal use. most companies find too many barriers to implementation.
- Zoe; our troubleshooting content wasn't mature enough to use it.
- Kris; what do you mean?
- Zoe; the places I've worked were still new to DITA, and what troubleshooting info we had was directly out of a knowledge base maintained by others, or not structured with other content. so it wasn't ready to fit into a troushooting standard.
- Kris; was it in DITA, or not in DITA?
- Zoe; much of it was in valid DITA files, but not in DITA
- Kris; so product of conversion of legacy content.?
- Zoe; lot of stuff, real troubleshooting info buried in stepinfo. so not even structured in t-s format
- Kris; so it wasn't really identified as troubleshooting info in the docs.
- Eliot; at ServiceNow, there's a huge body of info, but no troubleshooting info in product docs, only in the knowledge base or customer-facing help, so it's not in docs.
- Kris; but there is troubleshooting info for customers, just coming from somewhere else.
- Eliot; I've heard it's not appropriate to bake troubleshooting info into the docs, it's a platform that people use, not software that has to be fixed...
- Kris; I had an interesting client recently, large telecomm, part of their rationale for moving to DITA was reducing time their customer support reps spent talking to customers. I used a troubleshooting topic to show reps and engineers what they could do; they loved it, but the company wouldn't implement because it would cost to much to do it. If they had looked at long-term goals, it would have had a big payoff, but they had to calculate things from the short term.
- Nancy; you need someone high up to back that kind of thing.
- Kris; and the high-up person would have to have enough understanding of the issues, or be working with consultants who could get them onto a realistic timeline...
12 noon ET close
-- Ms. Nancy Harrison
[Date Prev]
| [Thread Prev]
| [Thread Next]
| [Date Next]
--
[Date Index]
| [Thread Index]
| [List Home]