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Subject: Groups - DITA TC Meeting Minutes 7 June 2022 uploaded
- From: Nancy Harrison<nharrison@infobridge-solutions.com>
- To: <dita@lists.oasis-open.org>
- Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2022 07:02:17 +0000 (UTC)
Submitter's message
Action Items:
***AI: Kris will respond to Github issue about elements requiring subelements along lines TC discussed.
***AI: Kris will get draft re: recruitment for dita-users note to TC so we can discuss next week.
=================================================
Minutes of the OASIS DITA TC
Tuesday, 7 June 2022
Recorded by Hancy Harrison
link to agenda for this meeting:
https://wiki.OASIS-open.org/dita/PreviousAgendas
Attendance:
===========
Robert Anderson, Kris Eberlein, Nancy Harrison, Scott Hudson, Gershon Joseph, Eliot Kimber, Zoe Lawson, Keith Schengili-Roberts, Dawn Stevens, Frank Wegmann, Jim Tivy
Business
========
1. Roll call
Regrets: Carsten Brennecke, Eric Sirois, Stan Doherty
2. Approve minutes from previous business meeting:
31 May 2022
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202206/msg00007.html (Harrison, 0706 June 2022)
(Corrections) https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202206/msg00013.html (Eberlein, 07 June 2022)
moved by Kris, 2nd Gershon, approved by TC
3. Announcements - none
4. Action items
23 November 2021:
Scott: Pursue possibilities of using Syncrosoft tooling for reviews IN PROGRESS
15 February 2022:
Eliot: Develop example for using object element for an iFrame
24 May 2022
Kris: Contact Mike Iantosca re Avalara participation in DITA TC COMPLETED
31 May 2022:
Stan: Populate Wiki pages with content about "OASIS membership inventory" COMPLETED
Kris: Follow-up with Bob Johnson about OASIS membership for Tahzoo COMPLETED
Kris: Send e-mail to list, asking "Who do you know who would be an asset if we could coax them to join the TC?" COMPLETED
Scott: Comb through dita-users and dita-comment lists for names of people who might be good fits for the TC
Robert: Add changes to @scale for fig, lines, pre, and specializations of pre to list of "clean-up items"
- Kris; Robert, do you need early feedback on this, and can it be ready by 6/10?
- Robert; 6/10 should be doable.
- Kris; and do you need early feedback?
- Robert; on a name, yes.
- Kris; I thought so.
5. Review of DITA 2.0 proposal deadlines
https://wiki.oasis-open.org/dita/DeadlinesDITA2.0
- Kris; Eliot when will you have your review of proposal complete?
- Eliot; by Friday
- Kris; just fyi, we're using contentFusion for this review to get data points on it.
6. GitHub issues opened by non-OASIS members
Elements requiring sub elements
https://github.com/oasis-tcs/dita/issues/357 (Philip R Brennan, 20 April 2020)
- Kris; this is an old issue.
- Robert; right, it was a request to address an annoying issue; required children, so if you use conref/conkeyref on those elements, you still have to put in req children. The question was 'can we just make all elements optional?' My response is 'probably not, the benefits of doing so do not at all outweigh what we'd lose. Those elements have req'd children for a reason, like list items for a list... Making those children optional would make bad content easier to create, and many tools would now break. So the trade-off wouldn't be worth it.
- Dawn; I agree with Robert's analysis, my clients would all need constraints for these.
- Scott; if we wanted that, we could just use HTML.
- Kris; any objections to going ahead with Robert's response?
[none]
***ActionItem: Kris will respond to this along lines discussed.
-- Kris; I'll try to do a better job of bringing Github issues to TC like I do with issues from dita-comment.
7. Volunteer tasks
https://wiki.oasis-open.org/dita/volunteerTasks
- Kris; for now, just look at admin
- Nancy; I can take the first 2 admin tasks, but I can't actually work on them till the end of June.
[see updated page for volunteers.
spec - 1. Eliot, 2. frank, 3. scott, 4.
8. scale attribute on table and simpletable elements
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202206/msg00009.html (Joseph, 07 June 2022)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202206/msg00011.html (Eberlein, 07 June 2022)
Recruiting companies and people to the DITA TC
Update about Avalara, HPE, and Tahzoo (Eberlein)
- Gershon; I had a brief search to see if @scale was in OASIS table model; Robert didn't feel it was enough to say it wasn't used. if @scale is part of OASIS table, we leave it in, otherwise, we want to bring it back to TC to decide how to treat it. We could treat it with table-specific options, or like the rest of the spec.
- Kris; I responded that I think to the best of my knowledge, it's not part of it. My sense is that based on last week's discussion, the reason for having a limited set of values for table was to accomodate tools set up to handle tables.
- Robert; I agree
- Kris; I don't know how much of a hit there would be if @scale on tables was changed; it's much more complex that other items scale is on.
- Gershon; I'm ok with that, we just need to mention that it's only on table/simpletable.
- Kris; will that work for your clients? did they ask for changes to @scale on tables?
- Gershon; my clients had no need for it; in my implementations, we don't honor @scale in tables.
- Dawn; we don't have authors that use @scale.
- Kris; and for PDF, we use the stylesheets.
- Gershon; some clients did use it originally, but we got them out of the habit; with modern publishing technology, you don't need it.
- Kris; any objections to preset values on table/simpletable, hopefully no one is using them anyway?
[no objections]
9. New Wiki page: Companies with and without DITA TC membership
Update about Avalara, HPE, and Tahzoo (Eberlein)
New Wiki page: Companies with and without DITA TC membership
Tasks for everyone:
Review "Group D: Companies with DITA implementations, but no OASIS membership" and add to it
Review "Group E: Group E: Vendors or consultants without OASIS membership" and add to it
Who do you know who would be an asset to the TC?
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202206/msg00003.html (Eberlein, 03 June 2022)
Tasks for everyone:
Review "Group D: Companies with DITA implementations, but no OASIS membership" and add to it
Review "Group E: Group E: Vendors or consultants without OASIS membership" and add to it
Who do you know who would be an asset to the TC?
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202206/msg00003.html (Eberlein, 03 June 2022)
- Kris; I talked to Bob Johnson at Tazoo, he'll be talking to his mgmt.. also talked to Mike Iantosca at Avalera; Mike would like to have an OASIS membership, but currently no funds in his dept; hopes it can come from marketing (thru Michael Priestley). I also talked to Bill Burns; he put me in touch with Stacey Meggs at HP, she'll look nto it.
- Scott; looked thru dita-users list, already had suggestion of Chris P. others were Grant Hogarth, Mona Ross at eEucian, and Julio Vasquez. They seemed the best candidates.
- Zoe; shall I reach out to Chris, since we tecnnically work at the same company?
- Kris; does Synopsys have a full membership, or an associate one, that just covers you?
- Zoe; I think just associate.
- Kris; a good model was ServiceNow, they started with just and associate membership and Scott, then went to a full membership which covered Eliot.
- Zoe; that may take a bit of time.
- Scott; and a bit of cost increase as well. Should we make a general call to the list and also talk to those individual members as well?
***ActionItem: Kris will get draft re: recruitment for dita-users note, out to TC so we can discuss next week.
- Scott; Potential TC members from dita-users:
Chris Papademetrious
Grant Hogarth.
Mona Ross, Ellucian
Julio J Vazquez
- Kris; I'm looking for someone to add this group to the wiki page.
- Gershon; this is for group B?
- Kris; right. For group C, it's a bit more labor intensive; checking names of companies in table against spreadsheet, verifying names, and checking to see if we've missed any. The list of companies that vote on OASIS standards and who their reps are. Any volunteers? I think it's a max 30 minutes effort.
- Gershon; if we get the lead, how does that help us? It may not be much of a help.
- Kris; that list is probably useless for us; once we're looking, we have to look at our contacts; here, we're just looking to see which companies follow this group; we just want to validate the companies. The spreadsheet gives list of companies; we need to make the call on which companies have DITA implementations. We may need 2 passes; I'll volunteer for first pass, if someone will do the 2nd. Let's not spin our wheels today.
- Keith; I was going to volunteer for group D, but you probably especially want large companies; I'll tackle group D, and sort it by large size, aso they'd be more likely.
- Kris; the size of the company isn't as important as the size of their DITA implementation and quality of it; we need to know they think DITA is meaningful and adds value, and that they have concern for continued existaence of the standard.
- Keith; will do a first pass; conditions less easy to define, but I'll do it.
- Kris; we need a good list of companies, but the final ask may not be 'join OASIS'; it may be to support a foundation rather than joining OASIS. Anyone for group E to get a more robust list? These are companies that make money off DITA.
- Keith; I can do that as well, I have a listing for that
- Kris; I think vendors are mixed in with companies with DITA implementations, I separated them, since there are different ways to target them. Any comments, questions thoughts about this new wiki page?
- Eliot; it's a useful effort.
- Nancy; what about legal issues?
- Kris; that's a good point, but we shouldn't worry about it right now. OASIS benefits from our being healthy.
- Robert; also, a foundation wouldn't own IP behind the standard, so it wouldn't really be a problem for OASIS.
- Kris; please think about this and add names who would value to TC e.g., Shane Taylor and Ebsco's Scott Farrar??? We should ask Ebsco to join OASIS. They could afford it; they have folks doing smart things with metadata; but pls also think about folks that would be assets to the TC. If you're at a company that has a contributor membership, are there other people who would be assets?
- Eliot; we could do that at ServiceNow.
- Kris; maybe wait till after next week's call, so we have templates for what we're saying about this.
10. Chair Honorarium
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202206/msg00001.html (Tivy, 02 June 2022)
https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dita/202206/msg00002.html (Eberlein, 03 June 2022)
- Kris; Jim, can you do an intro on your thoughts?
- Jim; well, I sent email suggesting a chair honorarium because I've seen this work in other not-for-profit orgs. But we would still need funding, either thru a foundation or gofundme or ???
- Kris; I hadn't thoght of gofundme...
- Eliot; the problem with gofundme is that it's hard to take that to purchasing. We have a need for a channel for which corp entities can provide money, a practical challenge.
- Kris; will have more discussion on foundation; i have some experience in setting up non-profits and setting up foundations, but if we move into looking more seriously at a foundation, then companies that have DITA implementations could help.
- Jim; the other thing is that for sustainability, for next chair, there could be a standing consideration of how people could be persuaded to sign up.
- Kris; also for sec'y
- Jim; problem is; who to give money to?.
- Kris; I personally don't find need for honorarium as chair, I'm going to keep better track of how I spend my time, to come up with job desc. of what does chair actually do. For me, real problem is spec editing, takes up a huge amount more time than being chair. I will be keeping spec work to 4 hr/wk, which means that we're pushing 2.0 sched out significantly. Robert and I are trying to wrap up a bit of work on accessibility, hope can open that review next week or one after.
- Robert; would like to get that out next week; not a lot to do. we should, as spec editors, not be trying to make things perfect before going for review.
- Kris; we're also asking members to dig deeper on review; also if you have other folks in your company who could do review, please get them involved.
12 noon ET close
-- Ms. Nancy Harrison
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