Raw Minutes Chat for meeting #202 on 2018-01-29

["Mr. Stefan Hagen" <stefan@hagen.link>]

[18:05] Room information was updated by: Stefan Hagen
1. Welcome by the chair (Stefan Hagen)

2. Minutes taker
All write into the chat, Stefan assembles and uploads into document area.

3. Roll call

4. Approval of the agenda

5. Approval of minutes from previous calls
5.1 Minutes from call #201 on 2018-01-08:
URL = https://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/62274/chat_trace_kavi.txt

6. Roadmap for 2018
Discuss the roadmap outline from mailing list discussion

7. Core v2.0 issues discussion
7.1 Split of core schema in gateway/server and only-server

7.2 Editorial topics
7.2.1 Drop of xs:any in the DSS-X specs for good or keep it as an option for XML syntax?
Discuss progress so far.
7.2.2 How to handle included schemes that not align with a multi-syntax approach (e.g. XMLDSig using xs:any, mixes content and XPath elements). Andreas' proposal is to provide rewritten schemes in distinct namespaces.
Continue discussion as postponed in previous meeting.
7.2.3 How to organize the specifications: One big document including normative parts and e.g. best practice hints or distinct document (one spec and a set of non-normative docs)?
Continue discussion as postponed in previous meeting.

8. Profiles

9. Next meeting
Suggested to meet again on 2018-FEB-05 (to sustain over-all bi-weekly schedule)

10. AOB
[18:06] Stefan Hagen: H4Q::Voting Members: 2 of 4 (50%) (used for quorum calculation)  - still one missing for quorum
[18:08] Stefan Hagen: H4Q::Voting Members: 3 of 4 (75%) (used for quorum calculation)
[18:08] Stefan Hagen: 1. Welcome by the chair (Stefan Hagen)
[18:08] Stefan Hagen: 2. Minutes taker
All write into the chat, Stefan assembles and uploads into document area.
[18:09] Stefan Hagen: 3. Roll call
[18:09] Stefan Hagen: AK, DH, SH, and another one still in need to activate the voice loop
[18:09] Stefan Hagen: Quorum achieved
[18:10] Stefan Hagen: 4. Approval of the agenda
[18:10] Stefan Hagen: Agenda approved unchanged as published
[18:10] Stefan Hagen: 5. Approval of minutes from previous calls
5.1 Minutes from call #201 on 2018-01-08:
URL = https://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/62274/chat_trace_kavi.txt
[18:11] Stefan Hagen: Minutes are approved unchanged as published
[18:11] Stefan Hagen: 6. Roadmap for 2018
Discuss the roadmap outline from mailing list discussion
[18:12] Stefan Hagen: Shifted to next meeting
[18:12] Stefan Hagen: 7. Core v2.0 issues discussion
7.1 Split of core schema in gateway/server and only-server
[18:13] Stefan Hagen: Nothing new seems consensus for now the way we cut it
[18:13] Stefan Hagen: 7. Core v2.0 issues discussion
7.1 Split of core schema in gateway/server and only-server
[18:13] Stefan Hagen: 7.2 Editorial topics
7.2.1 Drop of xs:any in the DSS-X specs for good or keep it as an option for XML syntax?
[18:15] Stefan Hagen: AK still thinks it should go, Frank Cornelis brought up  some issues
[18:16] Stefan Hagen: DH: thinks any in base maybe ok, but in implementation the coder has to replace by something specific, and thus has to call out in detail what.
[18:17] Stefan Hagen: DH: So the problem would be always solvable
[18:18] Stefan Hagen: All discuss
[18:21] Andreas: type OptionalInputs (base schema)

        - ServicePolicy
        - Language
        - Other
[18:23] Andreas: type OptionalInputsBase (core schema), derived from OptionalInputs

        - ClaimedIdentity
        - Schemas
        - AddTimestamp
[18:23] Stefan Hagen: All discuss shortly about Language (n Base)
[18:26] Stefan Hagen: DH: Why do we define this derivation in the first place? Don't we offer more a library with the core, that offers stuff, that may be used to assemble a specific service(profile)
[18:26] Stefan Hagen: AK: This one can always do (putting only requested parts in a WSDL or ...)
[18:28] Stefan Hagen: AK: Does not see the need for any in this separation / presentation anymore
[18:30] Stefan Hagen: Al welcome further input from Frank hopefully next meeting and via the mailinglist
[18:31] Stefan Hagen: 7.2.2 How to handle included schemes that not align with a multi-syntax approach (e.g. XMLDSig using xs:any, mixes content and XPath elements). Andreas' proposal is to provide rewritten schemes in distinct namespaces.
Continue discussion as postponed in previous meeting.
[18:32] Stefan Hagen: AK: One proposal is been presented and we have not any alternate proposal currently
[18:32] Stefan Hagen: DH: Standard or tue own namespace?
[18:32] Stefan Hagen: AK: Does not think it would be good to offer a namespace inside a namespace for that purpose
[18:32] Stefan Hagen: DH: Where does this problem come from?
[18:33] Stefan Hagen: AK: 1) any (does not work in JSON) 2) mixed content makes no sense in our area 3) implicit namespace declaration for the XPAth re-usage does no make sense in JSON
[18:35] Stefan Hagen: All discuss the proposal
[18:39] Stefan Hagen: AK: Offers to inspect how many occurrences of nested namespaces are really in AdES profile - so we can better judge, if a proxy object or delegating is the best way to go
[18:39] Stefan Hagen: 7.2.3 How to organize the specifications: One big document including normative parts and e.g. best practice hints or distinct document (one spec and a set of non-normative docs)?
Continue discussion as postponed in previous meeting.
[18:40] Stefan Hagen: AK: Proposal:
[18:40] Stefan Hagen: I thought about the structure of the core document, its length and it's goal. The current version has deterrent 150 pages. So I would like to rearrange the content into different files and leave the normative in the core. This will not really cut down the number of pages as the major part is generated stuff but a set of smaller documents with friendly names may lower the threshold for interested users. So I would see three normative documents
- core 2.0

- core 2.0 xml schema

- core 2.0 json schema


and a set of non-normative, easy-reading documents:

- primer

- multi-profile usage guide

- multi-syntax approach
- migrating from DSS v 1.0 to DSS-X v 2.0
[18:40] Stefan Hagen: end of proposal
[18:44] Stefan Hagen: All discuss
[18:59] Stefan Hagen: 8. Profiles
Skipped
[18:59] Stefan Hagen: 9. Next meeting
Suggested to meet again on 2018-FEB-05 (to sustain over-all bi-weekly schedule)
[19:01] Stefan Hagen: DH and AK will look into better grouping (more readable) of option inputs in core document. Optimize separation of function calls and optional xputs
[19:01] Stefan Hagen: Agreed
[19:01] Stefan Hagen: 10. AOB
[19:02] Stefan Hagen: AK: Feedback for ETSI from review of documents will be sent by AK to ETSI (this evening)
[19:04] Stefan Hagen: DH: SWAGGER et al. that might help an implementer should be anchored somewhere in the specification. WSDL for XML should be easy, but JSON he is still unclear if OpenAPI/Swagger would be right?
[19:04] Stefan Hagen: AK: Is not sure, what should enter and what should be left out. WSDL would describe the endpoints but how many and which?
[19:05] Stefan Hagen: Time over, discussion postponed to next meeting.
[19:06] Stefan Hagen: Meeting adjourned by chair