Raw Minutes Chat for meeting #213 on 2018-08-13

["Mr. Stefan Hagen" <stefan@hagen.link>]

[17:52] Room information was updated by: Stefan Hagen
1. Welcome by the chair (Stefan Hagen)

2. Minutes taker
All write into the chat, Stefan assembles and uploads into document area.

3. Roll call

4. Approval of the agenda

5. Approval of minutes from previous calls
5.1 Minutes from call #212 on 2018-07-09:
URL = https://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/63695/chat_trace_dss-meeting-20180709-212.txt

6. Roadmap for 2018
6.1 Milestone DSS 2.0 Core/Base/MVP CSD01/CS01 stage
6.2 Milestone DSS 2.0 Popular Profiles CSD01 stage
6.3 Milestone DSS 2.0 other normative stages
6.4 Milestone DSS 2.0 supportive but supplementary non-normative materials

7. Core 2.0 issues discussion
7.1 Maintenance tasks

7.2 Topology of schemas - structure and relation

7.3 Editorial topics
Revision out now for WD07 - please have a look, thanks.
URL = https://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/63697/dss-core-v2.0-wd07-2018-08-13.docx

7.4 Possible motion to progress core to CSD01 and request public review

8. Profiles

9. Next meeting
Suggested to meet again on 2018-AUG-27  (usual bi-weekly schedule)

10. AOB
[17:54] Stefan Hagen: Attendancecheck: AK, EJvN, SH: Voting Members: 3 of 4 (75%) (used for quorum calculation)
[18:01] Stefan Hagen: 1. Welcome by the chair (Stefan Hagen)
[18:01] Stefan Hagen: 2. Minutes taker
All write into the chat, Stefan assembles and uploads into document area.
[18:01] Stefan Hagen: 3. Roll call
[18:01] Stefan Hagen: AK, EJvN, SH: Voting Members: 3 of 4 (75%) (used for quorum calculation)
[18:01] Stefan Hagen: Quorum reached
[18:01] Stefan Hagen: 4. Approval of the agenda
[18:02] Stefan Hagen: Approved unchanged as published
[18:02] Stefan Hagen: 5. Approval of minutes from previous calls
5.1 Minutes from call #212 on 2018-07-09:
URL = https://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/63695/chat_trace_dss-meeting-20180709-212.txt
[18:02] Stefan Hagen: Approved unchanged as published
[18:02] Stefan Hagen: 6. Roadmap for 2018
6.1 Milestone DSS 2.0 Core/Base/MVP CSD01/CS01 stage
6.2 Milestone DSS 2.0 Popular Profiles CSD01 stage
6.3 Milestone DSS 2.0 other normative stages
6.4 Milestone DSS 2.0 supportive but supplementary non-normative materials
[18:03] Stefan Hagen: 7. Core 2.0 issues discussion
7.1 Maintenance tasks
[18:03] Stefan Hagen: None
[18:03] Stefan Hagen: 7.2 Topology of schemas - structure and relation
[18:03] Stefan Hagen: None
[18:03] Stefan Hagen: 7.3 Editorial topics
Revision out now for WD07 - please have a look, thanks.
URL = https://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/63697/dss-core-v2.0-wd07-2018-08-13.docx
[18:05] Stefan Hagen: Next revision for today's meeting - some changes missing and loads of missing reftargets from the old cooking recipe like descriptions in the processing.

I changed ID to Id where clear, IDREF to IdRef where our stuff (note ID esp. as postfix I left and some comments in the mapping tables show where I am still reluctant as these are generated.

Copied the mapping tables before editing from latest source I found.

Looked up other renames and changed accordingly.

Did add some hint that the tagging for conformance statements spread all over is to guide assertion tools, but here I will have to find a more concise wording, as we should have the term conformance only in the last section named conformance and better only speak of requirements before.

We avoided the captioning of most tables by well putting them singled out into subsections so I think this is ok for referencing.

The big mapping tables I did put into newly inserted subsections and well put redundant captions before the tables - so you guys can take a look.

The figure captions I moved "before" (in the flow) the figures, as the HTML rendering result and a browser positioning a page fragment request, positions the target anchor / ref on the top of the window, which is annoying when seeking a figure (is also an OASIS recommendation for editors).

left for now the holy triplets of assertions /requirements (generic, JSON, XML) as the tables of the JSON mappings would require prose added when replacing the explaining notion of the preceding JSON specific assert linking the syntax JSON to the generics of the type. I am willing to leave them all in.

After the meeting I would be happy to finally understand, what exactly was meant with the API /operations grouping under some common heading - it dd not find any structure in the document revisions sent to me claiming to have it - but maybe I have a blind spot 150 pages wide already ...
[18:05] Stefan Hagen: Detlef has joined
[18:11] Stefan Hagen: Can anybody hear me?
[18:12] ernst jan: I don't hear you at the moment...
[18:13] Stefan Hagen: Redialed in
[18:19] Stefan Hagen: Remove the tags for assertion statements (as the counter based on section numbering is not accessible for the generator pipeline) and both syntaxes allow schema based validation (which is noted in the right place already, i.e. the conformance section
[18:20] Stefan Hagen: Maybe in later revisions add them back in
[18:21] Stefan Hagen: Andreas would like to have the changes(editorial) to enhance readability back ported into the base for the generation (i.e. the schema files)
[18:21] Stefan Hagen: Stefan suggests to do this after CSD01 and CS01 so to not loose additional time as this is a private change to the work pipeline and no semantic change we can do this even during public review
[18:22] Stefan Hagen: Detlef would like to have a not so flat structure in the data structures, so that the root element stands more out
[18:23] Stefan Hagen: EJvN: Asks where there would e a really good place to group this. As ebXML and others do it all very specific and different and we do not want to be protocol specific
[18:24] Stefan Hagen: All discuss
[18:24] Stefan Hagen: EJvN: Suggests a section root models
[18:24] Stefan Hagen: Andreas: Subsection in overview would suffice?
[18:25] Stefan Hagen: EJvN: Maybe do both!
[18:26] Stefan Hagen: EJvN: Also mention those root elements (per operation) in the processing model start with the root elements
[18:26] Stefan Hagen: EJvN: Receiving a sign request, you first do the processing model for the signature creation
[18:27] Stefan Hagen: Andreas: Has currently no idea what to write at the further places (despite the overview)
[18:27] Stefan Hagen: Stefan: Would love to only list them in the overvew
[18:28] Stefan Hagen: Andreas: We already mention them in the processing section
[18:29] Stefan Hagen: Detlef: How to see the root without seeing the tree - in the table of contents this is not visible and that would be nice
[18:31] Stefan Hagen: Detlef: Only two functions and thus only a few roots
[18:32] Stefan Hagen: Andreas will try while repairing the mapping table to insert such a highlighting these are the root elements sentence and check if the processing section is clear enough in highlighting these also.
[18:33] Stefan Hagen: Please also add in the heading of the root elements describing sections the term (root) so that we also offer a content table level hint "where to focus on for a start"
[18:35] Stefan Hagen: Andreas will do the changes, upload and then Stefan will sweep through removing assertions and offer a candidate for reading and vote of TC
[18:36] Stefan Hagen: 7.4 Possible motion to progress core to CSD01 and request public review
[18:36] Stefan Hagen: skip
[18:37] Stefan Hagen: 8. Profiles
[18:37] Stefan Hagen: Local signature
[18:37] Stefan Hagen: Detlef responded to the comments of Ernst Jan and provided thus new diagrams
[18:37] Stefan Hagen: EJvN will still need some time for feedback
[18:38] Stefan Hagen: Detlef: With the new chip gateway protocol remote signing is a breeze 
[18:42] Stefan Hagen: Ernst Jan displays the presentation from Detlef sent to the mailing list today which displays the ease with which one can now implement the remote signing using slide no. 7
[18:44] Stefan Hagen: https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/dss-x/201808/msg00010.html
[18:45] Stefan Hagen: Detlef now discusses the scenario on page / slide 9 of ibid document
[18:47] Stefan Hagen: Detlef suggests to come up with a new revision of local signature combined with these chip gateway scenarios and approach based on that ETSI to offer this as a base for such solutions
[18:48] Stefan Hagen: Detlef mentions that the terminology is based on CEN 419241
[18:48] Stefan Hagen: Detlef mentions the protection profile 419241 part 2 refers to signature activation module
[18:49] Stefan Hagen: Detlef: QCD base is on two parts and terminology kind of borrowed from there, thus the idea of a combined / merged revision leading to a local and remote signature document
[18:51] Stefan Hagen: EJvN and Detlef think it would be good to offer version 2 of that profile and switch from docbook to microsoft word
[18:51] Stefan Hagen: Stefan suggests to request a boilerplate in word if he can please receive the editors, title and abstract
[18:53] Stefan Hagen: Who will edit?
[18:53] Stefan Hagen: Detlef and Ernst Jan volunteer as editors
[18:54] Stefan Hagen: Detlef will provide an abstract  and title of document via mailing list
[18:55] Stefan Hagen: Andreas: Is there a schema, so we can provide generated text from the schema?
[18:55] Stefan Hagen: Detlef: Yes he will provide
[18:55] Stefan Hagen: Detlef: This will be a revised schema, so it will take a few days
[18:55] Stefan Hagen: Validation Profile from ETSI:
[18:56] Stefan Hagen: Andreas: Had someone time to look into his comments?
[18:56] Stefan Hagen: All: no.
[18:56] Stefan Hagen: Andreas: Is a bit concerned because of the invention of anew namespace?
[18:56] Stefan Hagen: Andreas and Detlef: Suspect, that this change irritates implementers (it might be due to IPR issues) but nevertheless annoying
[18:57] Stefan Hagen: 9. Next meeting
Suggested to meet again on 2018-AUG-27  (usual bi-weekly schedule)
[18:57] Stefan Hagen: All agree
[18:57] Stefan Hagen: Detlef will not be available on that date
[18:58] Stefan Hagen: Suggested is to meet next week and if core is out for good we can drop the meeting in two weeks time
[18:58] Stefan Hagen: agreed
[18:58] Stefan Hagen: 10. AOB
[18:59] Stefan Hagen: Detlef OpenIdentity summit will take place in March next year and we should think about providing some contribution which presents version 2 f the standard. Call for papers is out and the deadline is around mid of October
[18:59] Stefan Hagen: All agree
[19:05] Stefan Hagen: Adjourned