Re: [ebxml-cppa] Re: [ebxml-msg] Re: Fw: Namespaces

[Christopher Ferris <chris.ferris@sun.com>]

Arvola,

Sorry, as mentioned previously, I've been swamped
with the day-job and haven't been paying enough
attention. My bad.

The thing I have a problem with in using URN's for
the namespace is that many parsers want to find the
schema at the URI of the namespace. If we were to
use a URN there, it would necessitate that either
xsi:schemaLocation be specified explicitly in ALL
messages or else a mapping would need to be made
between the URN and the schema location.

Basically, (IMO) I don't think that use of a URN for the
namespace value is a good idea. I see no reason to
change the namespace from http://oasis-open.org/...

I *do* see value in using the URNs for the URI's we
have specified that are NOT intended to be resolvable
such as the MSH-specific service URIs.

Cheers,

Chris

Arvola Chan wrote:

> Chris and David:
> 
> When I saw the message from Chris suggesting use of the namespace
> that OASIS has registered, I did a search in the regrep TC mail
> archive and found the following:
> 
> http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/regrep/200111/msg00010.html
> 
> I noticed the following declarations under the schema element in
> registry.xsd v 1.8
> 
>   targetNamespace = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-regrep:registry:xsd:2.0"
>   xmlns:tns = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-regrep:registry:xsd:2.0"
> 
> I thought it would be a good idea to get the ebXML-related OASIS
> specs aligned and to have consistent namespace specifications.
> That was why I sent the attached message hoping for feedback
> from Chris.
> 
> Regards,
> -Arvola
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: christopher ferris <chris.ferris@sun.com>
> To: David Fischer <david@drummondgroup.com>
> Cc: Arvola Chan <arvola@tibco.com>; ebXML Msg
> <ebxml-msg@lists.oasis-open.org>
> Date: Thursday, November 08, 2001 7:36 AM
> Subject: Re: [ebxml-cppa] Re: [ebxml-msg] Re: Fw: Namespaces
> 
> 
> 
>>Sorry,
>>
>>Have been so busy that I haven't been paying enough attention to the list.
>>
>>As for the namespace URI's, I see no reason to change them. I would
>>much prefer that the namespace URI remain http://oasis-open.org/yadda/yadda
>>The URN's were for the non-resolvable URIs we used for the MSH specific
>>services only (at least that is what I had intended to suggest).
>>
>>Cheers,
>>
>>Chris
>>David Fischer wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I think we need to step back and think about this.  I thought the
>>>
> namespace
> 
>>>should be:
>>>
>>>http://oasis-open.org/committees/ebxml-msg/schemas/
>>>
>>>or maybe better:
>>>
>>>http://oasis-open.org/committees/ebxml-msg/
>>>
>>>These do not mandate a change throughout the document.  When I started to
>>>
> change
> 
>>>from:
>>>
>>>http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/ebxml-msg/nextMSH
>>>
>>>to
>>>
>>>urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-msg:service:nextMSH
>>>or urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-msg:nextMSH      (which?)
>>>
>>>I thought maybe we need to discuss this (I haven't seen any discussion on
>>>
> the
> 
>>>list yet) and besides, there are developers already coding to the uri
>>>notation -- why change?
>>>
>>>I am not yet sure this switch to urn notation will work.  Maybe it will,
>>>
> but
> 
>>>before we make a sweeping change from something that we know works, let's
>>>
> check.
> 
>>>I am also reluctant since other specs (SOAP, dSig, XMLEncryption) don't
>>>
> do
> 
>>>this -- they still use the url/uri notation and I think maybe we should
>>>
> stick to
> 
>>>that.
>>>
>>>Chris, why should we change to urn?  Why is uri inappropriate?  If it is,
>>>
> why do
> 
>>>other specs still use uri?  I'm not saying this change is wrong, I would
>>>
> just
> 
>>>like some more information before we dive in.
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>
>>>David.
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: Arvola Chan [mailto:arvola@tibco.com]
>>>Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2001 10:51 AM
>>>To: David Fischer; ebXML Msg
>>>Cc: chris.ferris@sun.com
>>>Subject: Re: [ebxml-cppa] Re: [ebxml-msg] Re: Fw: Namespaces
>>>
>>>
>>>David:
>>>
>>>Yes, I need to update the schema to reflect the default value.
>>>Following Chris suggestion regarding namespace, I have
>>>set this default value to:
>>>
>>>"urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-msg:service:errors"
>>>
>>>I don't think it is proper to leave out the xml:lang attribute
>>>from the Error and Description elements. It is customary
>>>to allow an optional indication of the language used in
>>>textual descriptions. The CPP/A schema also makes
>>>use of the xml:lang attribute in the Comment element.
>>>
>>>As far as I know, the namespace
>>>
>>>"http://www.w3.org/XML/1998/namespace"
>>>
>>>is predefined, but the attribute xml:lang is not. That is why
>>>we have to import the xml_lang.xsd (which we provide)
>>>into the above namespace. With the Extensibility XML
>>>Authority which I am using, I get errors parsing the
>>>MSG header schema if I omit the importing of xml_lang.xsd.
>>>
>>>Chris:
>>>Can you please comment on the necessity of the
>>>xml:lang attribute?
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>-Arvola
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: David Fischer <david@drummondgroup.com>
>>>To: Arvola Chan <arvola@tibco.com>; ebXML Msg
>>><ebxml-msg@lists.oasis-open.org>
>>>Date: Wednesday, November 07, 2001 7:47 AM
>>>Subject: RE: [ebxml-cppa] Re: [ebxml-msg] Re: Fw: Namespaces
>>>
>>>
>>>Hi Arvola,
>>>
>>>The spec says that codeContext has a default of:
>>>
>>>http://www.oasis-open.org/messageServiceErrors
>>>
>>>but I don't see that in the schema?
>>>
>>>Also:
>>>What about leaving the xml:lang attribute out of the schema since there
>>>seems to
>>>be widespread confusion and non-support?  Since this is supposed to be
>>>predefined, can the attribute be put on without having it in our schema?
>>>
> If
> 
>>>not, what if we omit xml:lang from the spec?
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>
>>>David Fischer
>>>Drummond Group.
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: Arvola Chan [mailto:arvola@tibco.com]
>>>Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2001 7:00 PM
>>>To: David Fischer; ebXML Msg
>>>Subject: Re: [ebxml-cppa] Re: [ebxml-msg] Re: Fw: Namespaces
>>>
>>>
>>>David:
>>>
>>>Sorry for the delayed response. I had the day off.
>>>
>>>The latest schema is attached. There are two changes from
>>>the previous version:
>>>
>>>1. target namespace changed to
>>>        "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-msg:service:xsd:1.1"
>>>
>>>2. added
>>>    <any namespace="##other" processContents="lax"
>>>             minOccurs="0" maxOccurs="unbounded"/>
>>>    under MessageHeader.
>>>
>>>-Arvola
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: David Fischer <david@drummondgroup.com>
>>>To: Arvola Chan <arvola@tibco.com>; ebXML Msg
>>><ebxml-msg@lists.oasis-open.org>
>>>Date: Tuesday, November 06, 2001 10:01 AM
>>>Subject: RE: [ebxml-cppa] Re: [ebxml-msg] Re: Fw: Namespaces
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>We're starting to run out of time so I am going to publish v1.08 tomorrow
>>>>evening.  Any more changes from anyone?
>>>>
>>>>Arvola, have you made any changes to the Schema that I need to include?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>(please
>>>
>>>
>>>>send the whole schema).
>>>>
>>>>There are still outstanding issues about TraceHeaderList but I have not
>>>>corrected them in anticipation of its removal.
>>>>
>>>>Regards,
>>>>
>>>>David Fischer
>>>>Drummond Group
>>>>
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: Arvola Chan [mailto:arvola@tibco.com]
>>>>Sent: Friday, November 02, 2001 11:37 AM
>>>>To: Christopher Ferris; ebXML Msg; ebxml-cppa@lists.oasis-open.org
>>>>Cc: Nikola Stojanovic
>>>>Subject: [ebxml-cppa] Re: [ebxml-msg] Re: Fw: Namespaces
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Chris:
>>>>
>>>>I notice in the latest registry.xsd
>>>>
>>>>http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/regrep/200111/msg00010.html
>>>>
>>>>the following declarations under the schema element:
>>>>
>>>>targetNamespace = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-regrep:registry:xsd:2.0"
>>>>xmlns:tns = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-regrep:registry:xsd:2.0"
>>>>
>>>>I suppose that the XSD's we use for MSG and CPP/A should similarly have:
>>>>
>>>>targetNamespace = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-msg:service:xsd:1.1"
>>>>xmlns:tns = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-msg:service:xsd:1.1"
>>>>
>>>>and
>>>>
>>>>targetNamespace = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-cppa:cppa:xsd:1.1"
>>>>xmlns:tns = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-cppa:cppa:xsd:1.1"
>>>>
>>>>respectively.
>>>>
>>>>I will continue to post the working drafts of the XSD's as
>>>>
>>>>http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/ebxml-msg/schema/draft-msg-header-<N
>>>>
> N>
> 
>>>.
>>>
>>>
>>>>xsd
>>>>
>>>>and
>>>>
>>>>http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/ebxml-cppa/schema/draft-cpp-cpa-<NN>
>>>>
> .x
> 
>>>s
>>>
>>>
>>>>d
>>>>
>>>>The finalized versions will be posted as:
>>>>
>>>>http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/ebxml-msg/schema/msg-header-1_1.xsd
>>>>
>>>>and
>>>>
>>>>http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/ebxml-cppa/schema/cpp-cpa-1_1.xsd
>>>>
>>>>Regards,
>>>>-Arvola
>>>>
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: Christopher Ferris <chris.ferris@sun.com>
>>>>To: Nikola Stojanovic <nikola.stojanovic@encodasystems.com>; ebXML Msg
>>>><ebxml-msg@lists.oasis-open.org>; ebxml-cppa@lists.oasis-open.org
>>>><ebxml-cppa@lists.oasis-open.org>
>>>>Date: Friday, November 02, 2001 8:03 AM
>>>>Subject: [ebxml-msg] Re: Fw: Namespaces
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>All,
>>>>
>>>>Please see the note from Nikola below. Apparently, OASIS
>>>>has got a URN namespace that we can use (woo hoo). We can,
>>>>and should (IMO) leverage this in our spec (and possibly
>>>>also in the CPP/A specs if appropriate.
>>>>
>>>>We are currently using a uri: scheme for some of our
>>>>URIs which (upon further investigation) is inappropriate.
>>>>I think that this may be my fault (sheepish grin).
>>>>
>>>>I would therefore like to recommend that we consider replacing
>>>>the "uri:www.ebxml.org/messageService" prefixed URIs in our
>>>>spec with "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-msg:service:" as this URN
>>>>is a formally registered URN namespace.
>>>>
>>>>Thoughts?
>>>>
>>>>Cheers,
>>>>
>>>>Chris
>>>>
>>>>Nikola Stojanovic wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>>>From: "Nikola Stojanovic" <nikola.stojanovic@encodasystems.com>
>>>>>To: <regrep-raws@lists.oasis-open.org>
>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2001 11:07 AM
>>>>>Subject: Namespaces
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>One of the outstanding items for this subteam was the resolution on
>>>>>namespaces. Here is what I'd like to suggest to the group to consider.
>>>>>
>>>>>One of the few registered formal URN Namespaces is "A URN Namespace for
>>>>>OASIS" (see [1]). It seems that its structure and semantics would be
>>>>>sufficient for our work. According to [1] ebXML namespaces would be
>>>>>
> under
> 
>>>>>"names:tc:" hierarchy so they would start with urn:oasis:names:tc: A
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>unique
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>"tc-id" in our case, according to Karl Best, would be ebxml-regrep. Then
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>the
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>rest of it might look like:
>>>>>
>>>>>urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-regrep:registry:xsd:1.1 - this would be a
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>Registry
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>schema
>>>>>urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-regrep:services:wsdl:1.7 - this would be a
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>Registry
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Services WSDL
>>>>>urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-regrep:soapbinding:wsdl:1.8 - this would be a
>>>>>Registry Services WSDL SOAP binding
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>[1]
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>http://lists.research.netsol.com/pipermail/urn-nid/2001-January/000120.ht
>>>>
> ml
> 
>>>>>Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>>Nikola Stojanovic
>>>>>Lead Technologist, Research and Development
>>>>>Encoda Systems Inc.
>>>>>101 Pineview Terrace
>>>>>Ithaca, NY 14850 USA
>>>>>nikola.stojanovic@encodasystems.com
>>>>>Tel: 607-273-2224
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription
>>>>>manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription
>>>>manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription
>>>>manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl>
>>>>
>>>
>>>----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription
>>>manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Subject:
>>
>> Re: [ebxml-msg] Re: Fw: Namespaces
>> From:
>>
>> "Arvola Chan" <arvola@tibco.com>
>> Date:
>>
>> Fri, 2 Nov 2001 09:36:30 -0800
>> To:
>>
>> "Christopher Ferris" <chris.ferris@sun.com>, "ebXML Msg" 
>> <ebxml-msg@lists.oasis-open.org>, <ebxml-cppa@lists.oasis-open.org>
>>
>>
>>Chris:
>>
>>I notice in the latest registry.xsd
>>
>>http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/regrep/200111/msg00010.html
>>
>>the following declarations under the schema element:
>>
>>  targetNamespace = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-regrep:registry:xsd:2.0"
>>  xmlns:tns = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-regrep:registry:xsd:2.0"
>>
>>I suppose that the XSD's we use for MSG and CPP/A should similarly have:
>>
>>  targetNamespace = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-msg:service:xsd:1.1"
>>  xmlns:tns = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-msg:service:xsd:1.1"
>>
>>and
>>
>>  targetNamespace = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-cppa:cppa:xsd:1.1"
>>  xmlns:tns = "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-cppa:cppa:xsd:1.1"
>>
>>respectively.
>>
>>I will continue to post the working drafts of the XSD's as
>>
>>http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/ebxml-msg/schema/draft-msg-header-<NN>.
>>xsd
>>
>>and
>>
>>http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/ebxml-cppa/schema/draft-cpp-cpa-<NN>.xs
>>d
>>
>>The finalized versions will be posted as:
>>
>>http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/ebxml-msg/schema/msg-header-1_1.xsd
>>
>>and
>>
>>http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/ebxml-cppa/schema/cpp-cpa-1_1.xsd
>>
>>Regards,
>>-Arvola
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Christopher Ferris <chris.ferris@sun.com>
>>To: Nikola Stojanovic <nikola.stojanovic@encodasystems.com>; ebXML Msg
>><ebxml-msg@lists.oasis-open.org>; ebxml-cppa@lists.oasis-open.org
>><ebxml-cppa@lists.oasis-open.org>
>>Date: Friday, November 02, 2001 8:03 AM
>>Subject: [ebxml-msg] Re: Fw: Namespaces
>>
>>
>>All,
>>
>>Please see the note from Nikola below. Apparently, OASIS
>>has got a URN namespace that we can use (woo hoo). We can,
>>and should (IMO) leverage this in our spec (and possibly
>>also in the CPP/A specs if appropriate.
>>
>>We are currently using a uri: scheme for some of our
>>URIs which (upon further investigation) is inappropriate.
>>I think that this may be my fault (sheepish grin).
>>
>>I would therefore like to recommend that we consider replacing
>>the "uri:www.ebxml.org/messageService" prefixed URIs in our
>>spec with "urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-msg:service:" as this URN
>>is a formally registered URN namespace.
>>
>>Thoughts?
>>
>>Cheers,
>>
>>Chris
>>
>>Nikola Stojanovic wrote:
>>
>>
>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>From: "Nikola Stojanovic" <nikola.stojanovic@encodasystems.com>
>>>To: <regrep-raws@lists.oasis-open.org>
>>>Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2001 11:07 AM
>>>Subject: Namespaces
>>>
>>>
>>>One of the outstanding items for this subteam was the resolution on
>>>namespaces. Here is what I'd like to suggest to the group to consider.
>>>
>>>One of the few registered formal URN Namespaces is "A URN Namespace for
>>>OASIS" (see [1]). It seems that its structure and semantics would be
>>>sufficient for our work. According to [1] ebXML namespaces would be under
>>>"names:tc:" hierarchy so they would start with urn:oasis:names:tc: A
>>>
>>unique
>>
>>>"tc-id" in our case, according to Karl Best, would be ebxml-regrep. Then
>>>
>>the
>>
>>>rest of it might look like:
>>>
>>>urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-regrep:registry:xsd:1.1 - this would be a
>>>
>>Registry
>>
>>>schema
>>>urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-regrep:services:wsdl:1.7 - this would be a
>>>
>>Registry
>>
>>>Services WSDL
>>>urn:oasis:names:tc:ebxml-regrep:soapbinding:wsdl:1.8 - this would be a
>>>Registry Services WSDL SOAP binding
>>>
>>>
>>>[1]
>>>
>>>
>>http://lists.research.netsol.com/pipermail/urn-nid/2001-January/000120.html
>>
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>
>>>Nikola Stojanovic
>>>Lead Technologist, Research and Development
>>>Encoda Systems Inc.
>>>101 Pineview Terrace
>>>Ithaca, NY 14850 USA
>>>nikola.stojanovic@encodasystems.com
>>>Tel: 607-273-2224
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription
>>>manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>----------------------------------------------------------------
>>To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription
>>manager: <http://lists.oasis-open.org/ob/adm.pl>
>>