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Subject: [ebxml-msg] minutes for Nov 15, 2001 face-to-face meeting

MINUTES FOR ebXML Messaging Committee
November 15, 2001

1. Doug suggests that section 7.4, reliable messaging needs to be rewritten for   
1a.Roll call
   Kazunori Iwasa
   Jeff Turpin
   Doug Bunting
   David Burdett
   Brian Gibb
   Chris Ferris   
   Ian Jones
   Dan Weinreb
   Colleen Evans
   Sally Wang*
   Shirley Wu*
   Bruce Pedretti
   Dale Moberg
   David Fischer
   Brian Hayes*
   *not voting member
2. Iwasa requests addition to agenda:   evaluate term "Optional" for the separated modules in the spec
   2.1   Jacques requests conformance clause be added first:  will affect this issue over which "profile"
         needs to be optional or mandatory.
   2.2   Conformance clause should specify conformance level "profiles" against
         which implementation may be tested.
   2.2   Ian suggests that Core remains as "Base functionality".  Conformance 
         clause calls optional features  "additional" features.  Conformance 
         clause specifies which profiles contain which additional features.
   2.3   Jacques: Security should be optional
      2.3.1 Ian asserts that this causes interoperability problems
      2.3.2 Jacques 
      2.3.3 Doug question: are profiles operating modes, or building models?
         2.3.4 Jacques answer: both. 
      2.3.4 Jacques: Conformance levels build upon each other.  Pass level 1, 
            then attempt level 2.
      2.3.4 Chris: Must have security as base functionality.
   2.4 Chris: modules are independent.  why not treat them that way.
   2.6   Jacques asserts some modules are dependent on others.
   2.7   Jacques argues security is not in base.  Users assert guarenteed 
         deliver is most important.  Users less interested in security.  
   2.8   Doug says one profile that has security, one that includes msg ording,     
         one for guarenteed delivery -- not profiles that contain combinations.  
         Hence, profiles without levels.
   2.9   Chris says conformance should and can be tested by modules
   3.0   Iwasa says his customers want reliable messaging (RM) and security.
      3.0.1 Chris:  reliable need not be in core services because
            transport may be inherently reliable (for example, JMS)
      3.0.2 Iwasa:  interoperability problems then:  one vendor has
            reliable, the other doesn't.
      3.0.3 Chris: mainly speaking to closed systems.  Vendors that want
            to interoperate must implement RM module.
   3.1   General informal agreement that conformance testing should be performed
         modularly.  Conformanc claus to come from IIC?
4.0   Break 12:00-12:15
5.0   Brian Chairs
   5.1   Chris sync reply module
      5.1.1 Bruce: how are conditions handled where IM must close connection
      5.1.2 Burdett:  should time out error be sent back in such a case?
      5.1.3 Doug:  transient error conditions are loosely/not defined and
         (secretary infers) this spec may need to embellish on it
          3 things to do on error:  1) retry immediate, 2) wait and retry, 
          3) give up.  
   5.2 MOTION by David Burdett:  Accept Chris's proposal with the addition of a 
   new error code in the event the timeout. Doug seconds.  
      5.2.1 Burdett:  error should have severity of "warning"
      5.2.2 Doug: "error" means not processing.  "warning" means may still be
      5.2.3 Burdett and Doug realize agreement.
      5.2.4 MOTION DEFERRED until con call (or next quorem).
      5.2.5 Chris: if connection is dropped, that may be a sufficient error
            condition that does not require a special ebXML error message
      5.2.6 Doug proposes chris amend proposal to discuss IM role and 
            error conditions with respect to timeout conditions and
            general communication errors.
      5.2.7 Chris agrees to ACTION ITEM.
   5.3 Dan discusses text for idempotency sematics (changing duplicate 
      5.3.1 Fischer wants to keep duplicate elimination
      5.3.2 Dan says could keep duplicate elimination as a turn.
   5.4   Chris and Dan: if CPA says dup elim, then CPA must also provide 
6.0 MOTION chris:  accept original syncReply (sent to message list this morning)
      proposal with Doug's suggestion of 
      text describing IM role in sync reply mode and error conditions.
      for: burdett, doug, arvola, chris, colleen, dan, bruce   
      opposed: none, fischer
      abstain: Iwasa, Dale
7.0 Ian explains release process
   7.1   Submit by 12/1 to OASIS board.  Board presents to OASIS members on 1/1.  
         90 day review period.
         April 1, members have 30 day voting period.
   7.2   Chris:  since cpa is behind by a quarter, should msg team wait for 
         them?  Shoot for publishing TC standard at beginning of January and 
         submit for OASIS approval in March.
   7.3 MOTION chris:  
         1) Make four type of changes: 
            a) results of this f2f, 
            b) one round of editorial tweaking, 
            c) cpa / msg alignment, 
            d) add conformance clause, 
         2) publish tc spec 1st week of Jan
         3) submit spec on March 1st 2002 to OASIS.
      7.3.1 Seconded: Colleen
      7.3.2 Discussion: no discussion.
      7.3.3 VOTE
            For: Iwasa, Arvola, Dale, Doug, Chris, Colleen, Dan, Bruce
            Against: Burdett, Fischer
            Absain: Brian, Hima
7.A   Dale withdraws earlier motion regarding non-repudiation of receipts (wrt security).      
8.0 ebXML Namespace
   8.1   Doug: 3 issues:  1) exact form for namespace;  Normative schema 
         location for that namespace; 3) Common base (such as OASIS URN).
   8.2   Chris:  OASIS has URN namespace.  Karl Best has sub domains of that 
         namespace. In our case ebXmlMsg (caps?).  Current version of spec uses 
         "uri:" scheme.  May not be valid?  must we fix URI?  We should make sub 
         domains for each service.
   8.3   Doug namespace and schema location should be identical?  Not normative 
         items -- only appears in examples.
   8.4   MOTION doug: The schema location for the namespace described 
         above in 2.2.1 must be exactly the value of <that 2.2.1 schema location 
      8.4.1 VOTE
         For:  Arvola, Dale, doug, david F, david B, Hima, chris, colleen, dan, 
         Abstain: Iwasa
      8.4.2 MOTION PASSES
   8.5   MOTION chris: change "uri:www.oasis-open.org/messageService/" namespace 
         to be with the OASIS URN ebXml Message namespace appended with 
         "/service" in section 3.1.4
         of version 1.0.8 in spec (and any other references to it).
      8.5.1 Seconded: Bruce
      8.5.2 Discussion: Chris clarifies for ping and pong services.
      8.5.3 VOTE:
         for:  Arvola, doug, dale, chris, colleen, bruce, dan
         against: none
         abstain: Iwasa, Hima
      8.5.5 MOTION PASSED
   8.6 MOTION doug: change actor uri's as defined in section 2.2.10 & 11 to be 
      prefixed with OASIS URN instead of "/service" appended with "/actors".
      8.6.1 Second: Chris
      8.6.2 Discussion:  none
      8.6.3 VOTE
         For: arvola, dale, doug, chris, colleen, bruce, dan
         Against: none
         Abstain: Hima, Iwasa

      8.6.4 MOTION PASSED
   8.7 MOTION fisher: Change namespace to exclude file name of .xsd file
      8.7.1 Seconded: no
      8.7.2 Discussion:
            chris:   servers that provide default directory pages may not 
                     resolve correctly
            doug:    implementations of caching parsers index by namespace -- 
                     may cause discrepancies
            chris:   w3c adds date to namespace
            fischer: why do we need version attribute?
            chris:   to facilitate programming ease in determining version 
            doug:    namespace alterations allow dispatching messages on 
            chris:   namespaces are broken.

9  Fischer: discuss changes chris submitted.
   9.1   Issues regarding use of term "transport" protocol for communication 
   9.2   Doug 2.2.2 and 2.2.4 examples illustrate identical concepts.  Strike 
   9.3   Arvola: section 2.2.9 -- should all ebXml soap header 
         extensions must have "mustUnderstand='1'"
      9.3.1 Chris: yes
10 Upcoming meetings
   Ian: proposes conference call for Monday December 3, 2001
   Burdett: meet on the 19th?
   Burdett: meet on the 26th?
   Ian: December 3rd  gives David Fischer a chance to get done
        No editorial changes after the 30th. 
        December 3 conference call is to discuss comments
        Time is 10 pacific.
        Tentative date of 12/17.
   Chris:   need cpa alignment (cpa phone call). IIC conformance statement.
   Doug: Weekly meetings in december until xmas
   Colleen: volunteers to host the 10th conference call
   Ian:  Formal conference call on January 7th to vote on spec acceptence
         Require 2/3 acceptence (implied attendance)
   Ian:  F2F opportunity in February in Seattle
         Propose requirements workshop for version 2
11 Brian Hayes requests admissioin to technical committee 

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