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Subject: [ebxml-msg] RE: Public usage scenario documents
David, In addition to baked beans, some people would like to do financial transactions where messaging reliability does matter. Even with the baked beans, a system failure could mean that you receive two container-loads of beans instead of the one you thought you ordered because you re-sent the order, thinking that the first one was not delivered when it was delivered. We do not have a note in the msg spec which says that reliability is not guaranteed in the face of system failures. In general, unless we lay out the rule for determining whether a use case is in the 95% that work or the 5% that don't work, people will meet disasters. "The requirements were not clear" is one example of under-specification. No doubt, the Hubble Space Telescope initial disaster was also a case of under-specification of test cases if nothing else. Regards, Marty ************************************************************************************* Martin W. Sachs IBM T. J. Watson Research Center P. O. B. 704 Yorktown Hts, NY 10598 914-784-7287; IBM tie line 863-7287 Notes address: Martin W Sachs/Watson/IBM Internet address: mwsachs @ us.ibm.com ************************************************************************************* David RR Webber - XMLGlobal To: Martin W Sachs/Watson/IBM@IBMUS <Gnosis_@compuser cc: "Cutler, Roger (RogerCutler)" <RogerCutler@chevrontexaco.com>, ve.com> Randy Clark <Randy.Clark@bakerhughes.com>, "'bhaugen'" <linkage@interaccess.com>, ebxml-msg@lists.oasis-open.org, eBTWG List 05/28/2002 09:01 <ebtwg@lists.ebtwg.org>, "'Duane Nickull'" <duane@xmlglobal.com>, AM Christopher Ferris <chris.ferris@sun.com> Subject: RE: Public usage scenario documents Message text written by "Martin W Sachs" > - Except that in this case, there is a small matter of interoperability between arms-length implementations, so merely relying on implementers to know what to do won't get us there unless the specification is precise and complete. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Marty, I'm looking for a balance here - we have to understand that we are NOT trying to put orbiters around far flung planets, but instead trying to put a better cheaper tins of baked beans on the shelves at Walmart by truck and railroad. So while I understand the desires to get things right - we need to separate out goals - and say - hey for right now - for the implementations being fielded we have enough - we have technical notes in the spec's giving clear marks where the extended functionality is underconstruction. And we should certainly not be saying the spec' does not work or is broken, when for 95+% of use cases its more than good enough. Now when it comes to the W3C - they have a happy habit of getting the requirements totally mismashed, IMHO. So if we can do anything for the W3C it is getting their requires straight before hand. Strangely enough - the rockets failed not because of the technical bit and bytes - but because the requirements were not clear... a) All measurements will be in metric. b) Re-use of old components from earlier sub-systems must be crosschecked and approved. If one half of the team is building a cruise-ship and the other half a ferry, you're in big trouble! So I'm not against extended work here - we just need to understand why and for what audience / use case needs. Cheers, DW.
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