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Subject: certificate exchange messaging - emerging issue in Australia

Sander; Pim, et al;


We here in AU are now starting to hit a general situation where the two year anniversary of AS4 deployments are coming up for all players.  Thus the comments below re CEM are suddenly apposite; and an ideal time to propose a solution to this problem.  Principally at issue are the following:

·        Certificates are expiring two years (exactly) since deployment and will cease operations if no (manual) intervention

·        New Certificates must be SHA-256; whereas old certificates are SHA 128 (by mutual agreement)

·        This will keep happening at random times and lead to network instability

·        Currently about 20 players; later this will escalate as new players come on line with AS4 based solutions.


This round of renewals is further complicated by the latter SHA upgrade die to the fact threat Certificate Vendors are not now issuing any 128 bit certificates; only 256; claiming the former is obsolete!


Thus I am interested in helping to bring this item to a conclusion.  If not; various parties will suggest their own solution based on local conditions etc and avoid implementing a standards based and reliable cross vendor solution.


Ideally via such messages each B2B counterparty may “negotiate” by exchange of such defined messages a timely and seamless transition to a new certificate.  Additionally, we should be able to send a new certificate through the already trusted channel for deployment to counterparties; automating the upgrade “hands free”.


Is there an Issue Number etc as a reference at this point?




David Tuke

Enterprise Architect


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From: ebxml-msg@lists.oasis-open.org [mailto:ebxml-msg@lists.oasis-open.org] On Behalf Of Sander Fieten
Sent: Thursday, 4 June 2015 9:22 PM
To: ebxml-msg@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: [ebxml-msg] Draft meeting minutes for May 13th meeting





            Sander Fieten (chair)

            Theo Kramer

            Pim van der Eijk

            Bram Bakx



            Approval of previous minutes

            Explanation on CEM (Certificate Exchange Management)



Approval of previous minutes

The meeting minutes of the April 8th are unanimously approved. 


Explanation CEM

Pim provides an explanation on an e-mail he sent to the mail list about certificate exchange messaging (CEM). There was a draft for this at the IETF but currently there no work and progress on this. Certificate exchange however is often a problem in user communities and therefor a standard would be useful. There are however different views on how to configure certificates: Some vendors/parties take a TradingPartner centric solution where other use a exchange based (agreement or P-Mode based) solution. The proposal is based on the exchanged based configuration where certificates configured in an exchange can be replaced.


Pim indicates that the ebCore TC would be the TC to standardise this. Pim would like to get comments on the posted information. Theo asks if this would be a formal specification or a committee note. Pim thinks that it would be a formal specification. Sander asks if there no other initiatives or solutions that solve this problem. WS-Trust does something similar but is very bound to web services. Theo will look within domain registry community to see if there are initiatives/standard used to solve this.



Issue #15 was discussed. It is clear that there are P-Mode parameters missing that define how to report the error. Basically there are two options: use the “bracket” approach as already specified in Core spec or extra P-Mode parameters for errors. Pim will add a comment to the issue to list which P-Mode parameters apply to reporting of errors.

On the mail list there was also a summary of a discussion with vendors on this topic. Pim will add reference in the issue to the mail list.

Theo points out that in the interop tests he has seen there are no signed error messages, and products also do not offer support for it at this date. It is also clear that in some situations the error can not be related to a P-Mode so no signing configuration is available. In such cases the error has to be sent unsigned.


Request errata document

TC members agree to start with an errata document. Chair(s) will ask TC admin to create a template document. 



Pim requests the chair(s) to ask Jamie Clark about the status of ISO approval of the ebXML specifications. 


Next meeting

The next meeting is scheduled for June 10th

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