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Subject: RE: [energyinterop] Notification vs. Request vs. Order

Title: Notification vs. Request vs. Order



Those are interesting comments.  I don’t recall if we have discussed this before.  But it begs questions about whether there are smart grid messages in this space that are tied to contractual obligations as described by the “Orders” classification Dave mentions.


My first impulse is that regulatory and contractual obligations should not be tied to the messages but should be enabled and supportable by the messages.  I think this discussion may fall under the header of project scope.


Although I see the difference, I have a difficulty separating  a notification from a request.  If you don’t intend to motivate a response, why would you send a notice?  If the message is an “Order”, the real difference is that you are not only wanting a grid-impacting change, you are counting on it.  But it would seem that OpenADR  DRAS should be able to accommodate this difference in a way that enables a clean one-to-many message rather than peer-to-peer.  If peer-to-peer is desired, then the DRAS would represent the end use node and be considered the “peer” that responds to the “order”.


My 2-cents,




Gale R. Horst

Electric Power Research Institute (EPRI)
Office: 865-218-8078

From: Wilson, David C (St. Paul) [mailto:DavidCWilson@trane.com]
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 9:16 AM
To: energyinterop@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: [energyinterop] Notification vs. Request vs. Order


Hi EI folks,

In reflecting on Ed Koch’s presentation last week, I start to think about the semantics of “Notifications”, “Requests”, and “Orders”.  Especially in the context of normal business transactions (Purchase Orders, Requests for Quotes, Price Notifications.

I think part of what Ed was saying (and Ed I’d like to hear your thoughts) is that the presence of price information in the ESI messages don’t identify the nature (i.e. sender’s intent) of the message.  I think it would be good if the ESI message/information is clearly identified as “Notifications”, “Requests”, or “Orders”.  Here is how I think of them:

From the sender’s perspective:

Notifications: Here is some information.  I want to be sure you received it because that is my responsibility.  I don’t care what you do with it (I might care what the majority of recipients do).

Requests: I’d like you to do XYZ.  Please let me know if you will do it or that you did it and maybe what the results are.

Orders:  We agreed that I could tell you to do XYZ.  I may want you to confirm that you will and/or have.  I might only care to learn after the fact that you did not do XYZ because I need to punish you.  I may or may not be able to do anything with the knowledge that you plan to defy our agreement.

Part of the difficulty I have in reconciling the CA OpenADR and the concept of the ESI is that the paradigm in my head for the DRAS is one system (Server, Client).  I imagine the ESI “interface” to be between two systems (“Peer to Peer”).  Not sure if that makes much of a difference at the Type level.

I am advocating that the ESI we define have clear options for distinguishing between “Notifications”, “Requests”, and “Orders”.



David Wilson

Enterprise Solutions Portfolio Manager

Trane Commercial Systems

Ingersoll Rand

Office: +1.651.407.4168

Mobile: +1.612.741.2759

Email: davidcwilson@trane.com



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