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Subject: Re: [energyinterop] RE: EI feedback

I agree that it is important to understand the market requirements and make sure the services/data models we provide will be able to meet those needs. This could be part of feedback from the building to grid and can be looked from the perspective of meeting performance requirements, and telemetry needs, etc. Some of these could also come from other focused activities such as ASHRAE 201/PAP 17 or standards such as EI/PAP 9, OpenADE/PAP 10, etc. We need to have a clear plan and identify these clearly. 

There was a related (not specific to PRD application) from LBNL to look at price duration curves to allow customers to determine optimal participation in the dynamic pricing program -- may be, a good starting point.

  • On Sat, Apr 30, 2011 at 6:36 AM, Phil Davis <pddcoo@gmail.com> wrote:
    I second Dave's comment.  In lay terms, it is as critical to grid operations as a speedometer is to avoiding speeding tickets.

    Phil Davis | Senior Manager | Schneider Electric Demand Response Resource Center | 3103 Medlock Bridge Road, Ste 100 | Norcross, GA  30071 | |: 404.567.6090 | : 678.672.2433 | Skype: PDDCOO | S: phil.davis@us.schneider-electric.com |   Website:  http://www.schneider-electric.com

    -----Original Message-----
    From: Dave Hardin [mailto:dhardin@enernoc.com]
    Sent: Friday, April 29, 2011 9:53 AM
    To: Holmberg, David; 'Gowri, Krishnan'; energyinterop@lists.oasis-open.org
    Subject: [energyinterop] RE: EI feedback

    I'd like to stress that this is extremely important for demand response to function properly. I know that many folks don't agree with this but feedback is critical for any automated process. I can't stress it's importance enough.

    Dave Hardin, PE, PMP, CSDP – Senior Director, SmartGrid Standards EnerNOC, Inc. | 101 Federal Street, Suite 1100 | Boston, MA 02110
    o: 617.692.2543 | f: 617.224.9910 | c: 774-571-5386 dhardin@enernoc.com<mailto:dhardin@enernoc.com> | www.enernoc.com<http://www.enernoc.com/>
    EnerNOC - get more from energy

    From: Holmberg, David [david.holmberg@nist.gov]
    Sent: Friday, April 29, 2011 9:26 AM
    To: 'Gowri, Krishnan'; energyinterop@lists.oasis-open.org
    Subject: [energyinterop] EI feedback

    Just a note—I was looking at a recent PJM white paper on price responsive demand:

    PJM is stressed about not being able to correctly model price responsive demand (PRD) and thus wants info back from the customer. From page 11-12 I quote (and have highlighted what they expect from the facility). This is the only place I know where I have seen written down a request for feedback in some format. The PRD Provider would be someone like an ESP or CSP.

    “In real-time operations, it is essential to understand how much energy will be consumed at or above various prices so that PJM can send out the proper price and dispatch signals to market participants to maintain energy balance and reliability. Without this information PJM may be in a position of ―over- or under-dispatching‖ resources, rather than dispatching the amount necessary to maintain energy balance. The PRD curves submitted by the PRD Provider, which include price-quantity pairs, enable short-term load forecasting to account for reactions to dynamic retail rates. The below figure illustrates what such a PRD curve might look like. PJM Staff Whitepaper Price Responsive Demand March 3, 2011 DOCS# 591114 PJM © 2011 Page 12


    David Holmberg
    NIST Engineering Laboratory

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