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Subject: Re: [legaldocml] Public Comments


Dear Catherine,

many thanks for your very constructive answer.
We appreciate this fruitful dialogue concerning the IRI topic and our intention is to be inclusive and open to external suggestions for improving the AKN adoption.
However we have also to take in consideration that we are in OASIS Standardization Body and one of the main goal is to build solutions for supporting interoperability.

Please find our answers in quote inside of the text.
We are looking forward to receiving your feedbacks.

Best regards,
Fabio and Monica


Il 22/07/2016 15:27, Tabone, Catherine ha scritto:

Dear Monica and Fabio,

 

The National Archives fully supports the proposal that, in addition to the Akoma Ntoso naming convention, "functionally equivalent naming conventions" (FENC), are acceptable in Akoma Ntoso XML documents and considers it to be a very useful and constructive way allow integratation between Akoma Ntoso and other well strucutred URI schemes and naming contentions.

 

However, we would like to request a few small changes to three points of the proposal:

 

1)  *recognizable*: a syntactical means exists to recognize the specific syntax used for the URI (e.g., a specific prefix);

 

We suggest that a website domain, such as legislation.gov.uk, should be sufficient for this purpose and no further syntactical means should be necessary or required in a FENC equivalent URI. We also note that any of the resources returned from a given domain can point to the specification of the FENC URI scheme in the http response or resource metadata.

We think that a website domain qualifies as specific prefix, of course, but it requires that ALL href and src attributes within the document use the website domain, i.e., and full, absolute URIs. If this is good for you, it is good for us.

 

6) *equivalent*: at least one working, accessible, available, robust converter must exist that converts URIs/IRIs according to the specific syntax into equivalent URIs/IRIs according to the Akoma Ntoso Naming convention; 
 
We intend to build a resolver to support any of our users who wish to refer to UK legislation online using the Akoma Ntoso Naming Convention. However, we don't feel that this should be a mandatory requirement as it may create a significant barrier for LegalDocML implementers, especially if the identification features of their historical legislative documents do not naturally correspond with the values in the Akoma Ntoso Naming Convention. 
 
We will be glad to help streamline any difficulty in providing the corresponding Akoma Ntoso URI, and in case no solution is found, to extend as appropriate the naming convention. Nonetheless. we insist in keeping under control the conversion from and to FENCs and AKN naming convention, and not just rely on good feelings and best intentions.
7) *evident*: Akoma Ntoso XML documents identifying themselves (in <FRBRUri> and <FRBRThis> elements) using a FENC URI, must also provide equivalent <FRBRalias> elements with the URI ref corresponding to <FRBRThis> according to the Akoma Ntoso Naming Convention, one for each of the first three FRBR levels. 
 
As expressed in response to point 6) above we don't feel  it should be essential to provide a converter from  a FENC syntax to the Akoma Ntoso equivalent. If no converter exists it would be of little benefit to provide Akoma Ntoso compliant URIs as these would not resolve and to include them as <FRBRalias> would be equivalent to creating a template for a resolver.

 

We insist that a converter is provided. We understand the difficulties and are willing to help building a good converter. But interoperability is among our most important goals, and we would rather not allow multiple independent and autonomous document collections claiming to be Akoma Ntoso.

For this reason, the minimum requirement is to have one additional element where the AKN URI for the document is provided. It is the ONLY AKN URI required: all others, including components, references, links, etc, can all be using the other naming convention.

We do not think this is an exorbitant requirement.



Kind regards,

 

Catherine

 

 

Catherine Tabone

 

Data Manager

Legislation Services

The National Archives, Kew, Richmond, Surrey TW9 4DU

+44 (
0)20 8876 3444 ext. 2233
catherine.tabone@nationalarchives.gsi.gov.uk

www.legislation.gov.uk | www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

 

 

 

From: monica.palmirani [mailto:monica.palmirani@unibo.it]
Sent: 20 July 2016 10:44
To: John Dann; Sheridan, John
Cc: Fabio Vitali; Tabone, Catherine; 'Søren Broberg Nielsen (957sbn)'; Patrice Platel; 'Matthews, Gerry'; Jean-Michel THIVEL; 'Nina Koch (957nko)'; 'Hietanen Aki (OM) (aki.hietanen@om.fi)'; SCIARRINO Valeria (OP); KOENIG Kurt (OP); MALAGON Carmen (OP); SCHMITZ Peter (OP); PAPPALARDO Roberto (OP); KARDAMI Maria (OP); BAGOLA Holger (OP)
Subject: Re: [legaldocml] Public Comments

 

Dear John & John,

we were wondering if you have received any comment about our proposal for the modification to the compliance with the Akoma Ntoso naming convention.
Tomorrow we will have our LegalDocML TC meeting and it would be nice to have some inputs on this issue.

We intend to speed up the standardization process soon, especially since Monica was elected in the OASIS Board of Directors.

All the best,
Monica and Fabio

Il 12/07/2016 13:57, John Dann ha scritto:

Hi Monica,

 

Thanks for taking into consideration our comments.

 

I forward your proposition to the ELI TF, as I sent the comments on behalf of all, and also the OPUE, whose comments we all supported, so they can also react.

 

I am sure we will find a suitable flexible solution.

 

John

 

From: monica.palmirani [mailto:monica.palmirani@unibo.it]
Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2016 12:04 PM
To: John Dann <John.Dann@scl.etat.lu>; 'Sheridan, John' <jsheridan@nationalarchives.gsi.gov.uk>
Cc: Fabio Vitali <fabio@CS.UniBO.IT>
Subject: [legaldocml] Public Comments

 

Dear John & John, 
 
during the last LegalDocML TC, on June 29th, the group has analyzed your comments and discussed about a possible way to satisfy both your concerns and our need to preserve the consistency of our overall design of the Akoma Ntoso proposal. 
 
In this message we would like to advance to you, informally, the gist of the solution, and once we receive your approval, proceed to actually draft and emit a new version of the documentation for the formal approval procedure. 
 
Briefly, the most relevant and pivotal comment is on the naming convention and on your request to allow "on an equal footing" other naming conventions than Akoma Ntoso's own one. We understand the request and the underlying need, and we are inclined to accept that as long as we can express a few simple and reasonable requirements. 
 
In brief, we would like to adopt your concept of "functionally equivalent naming convention" (FENC), specify that only FENCs are acceptable in Akoma Ntoso XML documents, and provide a few reasonable indications of what we mean by functional equivalence. 
 
A functionally equivalent naming convention is defined as follows: 
 
1) *recognizable*: a syntactical means exists to recognize the specific syntax used for the URI (e.g., a specific prefix); 
2) *published*: a sufficiently detailed description of the syntax is publicly available and backed by a recognizable institution; 
3) *FRBR compliant*: A full distinction between "distinct intellectual creations", "specific intellectual forms", "physical embodiments" and "exemplars" of relevant documents must be explicitly supported and aligned with the FRBR conceptualizations. Support for items is not necessary nor requested. 
4) *CEN Metalex compliant*: the seven rules in CEN Metalex requirements (section 6.1 of [1]) must be fully implemented: 
 "To allow for the discovery of IRI identifiers, names must be:
      1. Persistent: names at all levels must maintain the same form over time regardless of the political,
         archival and technical events happened since their first generation;
      2. Global: all relevant documents by all relevant bodies must be represented;
      3. Memorizable: names should be easy to write down, easy to remember, easy to correct if they were written
         down wrongly;
      4. Meaningful: names should mean something; It should be possible to make assumption about the kind, freshness
         and relevance of a citation by looking only at the document’s name;
      5. Guessable across levels: references to different levels of the same document must be similar; e.g., 
         given a reference to an _expression_ a user should be able to deduce the name of the work;
      6. Guessable across document classes: references to different instances of the same document type must 
         be similar; and
      7. Guessable across document components: references to different components of the same document at the 
         same level must be similar."
5) *active*: at least one working, accessible, available, robust resolver must exist that provides dereferencing of URIs/IRIs according to the specific syntax;
6) *equivalent*: at least one working, accessible, available, robust converter must exist that converts URIs/IRIs according to the specific syntax into equivalent URIs/IRIs according to the Akoma Ntoso Naming convention; 
7) *evident*: Akoma Ntoso XML documents identifying themselves (in <FRBRUri> and <FRBRThis> elements) using a FENC URI, must also provide equivalent <FRBRalias> elements with the URI ref corresponding to <FRBRThis> according to the Akoma Ntoso Naming Convention, one for each of the first three FRBR levels. 
 
Any Naming Convention that complies with these requirements is termed a *functionally-equivalent Naming Convention* and its URIs can be used in any situation where Akoma Ntoso URIs/IRIs are appropriate. 
 
Finally we resist at allowing custom syntaxes for inner-document ids in eId and wId, because 
a) inner document identifiers are a reflection of the overall XML structure, which is still Akoma Ntoso, and not of the document-level URI syntax adopted, 
b) allowing multiple syntaxes for the same attributes would create havocs in any decent resolver and editor trying to deal with documents coming from different sources, and 
c) a good destination for custom ids already exists, attribute guid, that has exactly the stated purpose and allows custom ids without polluting the id space expressed by eIds and wIds. 
 
[1] ftp://ftp.cen.eu/CEN/Sectors/List/ICT/CWAs/CWA15710-2010-Metalex2.pdf
 
We plan to work on a new draft including this kind of flexibility, and would appreciate your opinion within the next week.
 
Thank you for your comments and opinions on this. 
 
Monica and Fabio



Il 21/06/2016 08:48, John Dann ha scritto:

Dear members of the LegalDocumentML

As Chair of the ELI Task Force, and on behalf of

·         Denmark

·         Finland

·         Ireland

·         Luxembourg

·         Publications Office of the European Union (comments also sent individually)

·         United-Kingdom (comments also sent individually)

·         France

we would like to send the following comments.

Constructing a universal naming convention, given the differences in national legal systems, is very complex and does not cover all national legislation cases and especially hinder existing naming conventions.

In line with the principle of proportionality and the principle of decentralization, each country and company should continue to operate its own national Official Journals, Legal Gazettes or legal databases in the way they prefer. We should therefore carefully consider not to impose a naming convention in order to respect the legal and constitutional differences between countries, and authorize on equal footing other naming conventions, e.g. URN-Lex, ECLI, ELI etc.

This flexibility would help the implementation of the revised version of AKN.

We therefore fully support the comments of the Office of Publications of the EU sent earlier by email.

 

Best regards,

 

John

 

John Dann

Directeur

LE GOUVERNEMENT DU GRAND-DUCHÉ DE
LUXEMBOURG
Ministère d'État

Service central de législation

43, bd Roosevelt . L-2450 Luxembourg

Tél. (+352) 247-82961 . Fax (+352) 46 74 58
E-mail : john.dann@scl.etat.lu

www.legilux.public.lu 

 

 

 

 

 

-- 
===================================
Associate professor of Legal Informatics 
School of Law
Alma Mater Studiorum Università di Bologna 
C.I.R.S.F.I.D. http://www.cirsfid.unibo.it/ 
Palazzo Dal Monte Gaudenzi - Via Galliera, 3 
I - 40121 BOLOGNA (ITALY) 
Tel +39 051 277217 
Fax +39 051 260782 
E-mail  monica.palmirani@unibo.it 
====================================
 

 

 

-- 
===================================
Associate professor of Legal Informatics 
School of Law
Alma Mater Studiorum Università di Bologna 
C.I.R.S.F.I.D. http://www.cirsfid.unibo.it/ 
Palazzo Dal Monte Gaudenzi - Via Galliera, 3 
I - 40121 BOLOGNA (ITALY) 
Tel +39 051 277217 
Fax +39 051 260782 
E-mail  monica.palmirani@unibo.it 
====================================
 


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-- 
===================================
Associate professor of Legal Informatics 
School of Law
Alma Mater Studiorum Università di Bologna 
C.I.R.S.F.I.D. http://www.cirsfid.unibo.it/ 
Palazzo Dal Monte Gaudenzi - Via Galliera, 3 
I - 40121 BOLOGNA (ITALY) 
Tel +39 051 277217 
Fax +39 051 260782 
E-mail  monica.palmirani@unibo.it 
====================================



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