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Subject: draft minutes, 24 Aug 06

Attached, html format.
Please note the actions.


Dave Pawson
Title: OASIS ODF Accessibility SC Meeting

OASIS ODF Accessibility SC Meeting

Date: 2006-08-24T15:36:19.0Z
Time: 1600Z
Venue: Telcon
Date: 2006-08-24T15:36:24.0Z

Version: 1


  • Dave Pawson
  • David Clark
  • Peter Korn
  • Malte Timmerman
  • Steve Noble
  • Janina Sajka
  • Pete Brunet
  • Chieko Asakawa
  • Hironobu Takagi


  • Rich Schwerdtfeger
  • Mike Paciello
  • Tatsuya Ishihara
Scribe(s): Dave Pawson


Item. Roll Call

Item. Review & approve previous minutes

Item. Discuss sections (Assignments as follows: 1, 2 Peter Korn. 3, DaveP. 4, Rich S. 5, Janina. 6, Chieko.) - Problems people are having - Additions people would like to see

Item. Discussion of goals for a11y SC for ODF after 1.1 (see below, and also see posting from Dave Pawson: Oasis)

Item. Discussion of our charter for a11y SC for ODF > 1.1 (see "charter" from minutes). I don't recall if we came to a final statement, nor do our minutes assign an action on this. This remains an open AI on the TC call, so I'd like to button this up.

Item. Issue of nested tables in Writer (HTML examples provided by Hiro)

Item. Review Cheiko's diagrams/charts: Oasis

Item. Carol Geyer put out a request for ODF testimonials. See Oasis Should our a11y SC formally make a statement/testimonial?

Item. Issue of ALT text for background images (Pete Brunet, can you lead this?)

1  Roll call, Minutes approval

DISCUSSION: See attendance list. No objections. Agreed. Agenda modified to drop two for Chieko & Hrio.

2  Notes on Accessibility.

DISCUSSION: PK. From mass.gove. Notes on progress. Mid year assessment. Explicitly references ODF and accessibility. Hence pressure remains on us. AT's in use in Mass were important. Our responses were noted positively.

3  Guidelines. Updates from Accessibility Guidelines authors (drafts due September 7th; draft to share with TC by end of Sept., finished by end of November)

DISCUSSION: JS PK etc were reminded of deadlines.

4  Discussion of goals for a11y SC for ODF after version 1.1

DISCUSSION: PK. No clear statement of final charter position.

  • DC. IIRC we were uncomfortable ratifying without a quarum. Note especially the last item. I.e purpose and deliverables.
  • PK: Reminder, Purpose. 1. Ongoing review of the OpenDocument specification for accessibility,both to discover potential accessibility issues and to improve theusability and functionality of creating, reading, and editing officedocuments for people with disabilities. 2. To provide accessibility related feedback to the OpenDocument Technical Committee and implementors of the OpenDocument specification.
  • PK: Deliverables:  1. Accessibility related guidelines for OpenDocument implementors and users.  2. Proposals for accessibility enhancements to the OpenDocument specification.
  • PK sought consensus. No further objections. Moved to put charter to TC.
  • After CA, HT, PB joined, item re-opened for these to consider. Still unanimous agreement

Action item: Propose this charter to TC.

Who? PK.

Due date: By next week.

5  Issue of nested tables in Writer (HTML examples provided by Hiro)

DISCUSSION: HT. 2 issues. Only in writer tables, not in spreadsheets. ODF spec has two types of tables. When a user split or merge a table cell in Writer. This makes this issue. Two techniques. One is span, similar to HTML span. This has one table. Span is across cells. Other technique is sub-table. When cell becomes a table. Posted examples (to list) show the two types. WAI viewpoint this nested table is not appropriate for navigation. Table 1 example user can still take table header by simple navigation keys. Structure is preserved. In table 2, to check table headers, the structure is not preserved. (See Oasis archive).

  • PK.If nested, should nest properly. Only at explicit user action.
  • HT. The nested table is visually integrated to the parent. From structure view, it exists. Hence ODF is mismatching.
  • PK. Does spec require rendition? HT, yes.
  • HT. Also impacts on ??? Formulea function. We can use formulea in Writer. Screen readers find it difficult to navigate these. PB investigated, our idea is to deprecate the subtable attribute. If visual subtable then OK, but not when different from structural view.
  • PK. Issue for guideline and issue for the spec. via the TC.
  • PK. Can say we recommend you don't do this. (In advance of formal deprecation).

Action item: Write up why, and recommendation

Who? HT, PB

Due date: 14 September.

6  Review Cheiko's diagrams/charts:

DISCUSSION: CA. Described the examples. Decorative examples using colors, has visually weak table structure. Noted that correct link is link. By combining metadata and technology, we can transform visual into a navigable structure. Want to discuss how this might happen.

  • CA. Authors tend to make the slides much more visual. We can process these.
  • PK. A key item for future goals. Lengthy discussion? Longer session needed, possibly next week?
  • CA. We want similar charts please!
  • DC. This is a bigger issue than ODF. Have any other groups addressed this?
  • PK. Edinburgh discussions agreed its big and new. Could we address business graphics? Are they up for categorisation. Could we seek further research?
  • DC. Is it too big?
  • PK. Charter is to discover accessibility issues. These graphics are in scope. Suggest hold it till fuller discussion.
  • PK called to order, now over telcon limit.

7  Request for ODF testimonials.

DISCUSSION: PK. If sent as a SC, could be to talk about how as individuals we are pleased by Oasis welcome and how our suggestions are being quickly incorporated.

  • JS, DP supportive of putting one forward. PK could only speak for Sun.
  • DC. Does it carry any weight for SC to do this? Supported PK idea. Are we advisors or insiders?
  • PK. We have one foot in both camps.
  • JS. Depends on what we say.
  • PK. Propose that if any member feel strongly, put forward an item individually.

Action item: Consider an organisational submission

Who? All.

Due date: by next week.

8  Issue of ALT text for background images

DISCUSSION: PB. IRC has markup. No tagging to allow short name and desc for BG image. E.g. FIRST DRAFT or CONFIDENTIAL. Found the tagging in a style.xml in ODT file. Need to figure out how to tag it properly. Perhaps in the styles.xml file. The image is in styles.xml

  • PK. Is this for 1.1 or 1.2
  • MT. Should be 1.2
  • PB. Needs addressing.
  • PK. Suggest solve it as other images.
  • HT. In CSS, bg image has alt text? RS to find out.

   - <office:automatic-styles> 
 <style:page-layout style:name="pm1"> 
 <style:page-layout-properties fo:page-width="8.5in" 
	style:num-format="1" style:print-orientation="portrait" 
	fo:margin-bottom="1in" fo:margin-left="1.25in" 
	xlink:type="simple" xlink:actuate="onLoad" />  
  <style:footnote-sep style:width="0.0071in" 
	style:adjustment="left" style:rel-width="25%" style:color="#000000" />  
   <style:header-style />  
   <style:footer-style />  

Action item: Find out if CSS has alt text to BG image

Who? JS

Due date: Next week.

The Oasis irc server is irc.oasis-open.org, channel &office-accessibility

Summary of Actions


Action item: Propose this charter to TC.

Due date: By next week.


Action item: Write up why, and recommendation

Due date: 14 September.


Action item: Consider an organisational submission

Due date: by next week.


Action item: Find out if CSS has alt text to BG image

Due date: Next week.

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