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Subject: Re: [office] Proposal for Advanced Document Collaboration Subcommittee
Jos, I have more experience of Change Tracking (CT) than real-time collaborative editing (RTCE) but I have always understood them to be different problems. That said, they are related and I am OK for RTCE to be taken into account in the work of the SC. I am in agreement with you that it should not be a requirement that the RTCE protocol problem is solved, rather that RTCE be considered in the CT solution. Robin Jos van den Oever wrote: 201011081728.01292.jos@vandenoever.info" type="cite">On Saturday, November 06, 2010 20:24:22 pm robert_weir@us.ibm.com wrote:An example:: Real-time collaborative editing needs to track changes as well, because it sends changes over the wire. So it would be beneficial if we design change tracking in a way that this would work naturally. One could, as an example, decide to store complete versions of the changed document, and rely on runtime intelligence of the editor to generate, on-the-fly the change tracks. This would satisfy the core change tracking needs perfectly. But it would not be something that one could easily use for real-time collaborative editing and similar scenarios. So I'd argue that we want to be discussing these common technical concerns together, not separately, since the choice of the exact change tracking solution has a large impact on how some other scenarios are done, and how hard it will be for ODF implementations to support these and related scenarios. Some commonalities (not exhaustive) are: 1) the need to identify content at a sub-document level. 2) the need to identify the styles relevant to content at a sub-document level 3) the need to identify metadata relevant to content at a sub-document level 4) the need to idetify extension content relevent to content at a sub-document level 5) The need to associate content, styles, metadata and extensions at a sub-document level 6) The need to package and exchange and merge coherent sub-document fragments If these discussions no not occur together, among the same parties, then the overall solution will likely be needless complex and hard to implement.Change tracking (CT) is very comparable to real-time collaborative editing (RTCE). The biggest difference from a user point of view is the time between edits and the possible visibility of other people's caret in your document. Etherpad, Google Docs and Abiword and probably others have already implement RTCE. Yet these programs cannot collaborate amongst each other. I would like the subcommittee to have a scope that encompasses both forms of collaborative editing. In RTCE, CT would play the role of visualizing a differences that have come from concurrent edits in a document and cannot be merged by one of the merge algorithms. In a nutshell, CT is RTCE without the automatic merging of changes in live documents. I agree that DeltaXML is certainly not the only option under consideration for this use case. There are two implementations of it underway and these may help the committee in determining if DeltaXML would fit with the desired use-cases. As such this subcommittee would advice or prepare information for the ODF-Next committee on this part of the functionality. Tasking the SC to come up with a sanctioned protocol for RTCE now would go too far, but I do think the existing protocols and their compatibility with TC should be considered and combination scenarios made explicit in the recommendations of the SC so that future effort- and specification duplication can be avoided. Cheers, Jos --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC that generates this mail. Follow this link to all your TCs in OASIS at: https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/portal/my_workgroups.php -- -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Robin La Fontaine, Director, DeltaXML Ltd "Change control for XML" T: +44 1684 592 144 E: robin.lafontaine@deltaxml.com http://www.deltaxml.com Registered in England 02528681 Reg. Office: Monsell House, WR8 0QN, UK |
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