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Subject: Re: [oic] state-of-interop-cd-03 - AGREEMENT ON TC DOCUMENT FORMAT AND TOOLS


I'm supposed to be neutral.

With that disclaimer out of the way, I am a very strong proponent of the editable source being the authoritative version for exactly the reasons Rob has described. Too often I have seen 'odd things happen' in the PDF rendering or XHTML/HTML export options. 

Remember, I'm neutral.

Mary 


On Feb 10, 2010, at 2:10 PM, robert_weir@us.ibm.com wrote:

> The version approved as CD04 was approved with the ODF version as 
> authoritative.
> 
> Of course, we are free to make a different choice if/when we make a post 
> public review revision.
> 
> And remember, just because there are known bugs in the ODF rendering does 
> not mean that there are not also bugs in the HTML or PDF exports.  I've 
> certainly seen my share of those.  I'll take an obvious but benign 
> rendering error over a subtle but pernicious one any day.
> 
> -Rob
> 
> 
> "Dennis E. Hamilton" <dennis.hamilton@acm.org> wrote on 02/10/2010 
> 01:19:07 PM:
>> 
>> Subject:
>> 
>> RE: [oic] state-of-interop-cd-03 - AGREEMENT ON TC DOCUMENT FORMAT AND 
> TOOLS
>> 
>> This is a work-process issue.  We have no agreement on what version and
>> specific tool we share in common in order to be able to produce and work 
> on
>> (authoritative) documents of the OIC TC, and ones the TC Administrator 
> can
>> manipulate in order to produce the OASIS Standard version (if she is the 
> one
>> who needs to be able to do that).
>> 
>> It is an interoperability issue for ourselves in our own work. 
>> 
>> I notice that the proposed solution to the immediate issue involves
>> proposing that a specific product release be used with, I suppose, a 
> prayer
>> that the builds for different platforms don't have interop problems too.
>> 
>> So, when we go to Public Review, how do we deal with this?  That we 
> identify
>> the document as one supported by a specific product version? 
>> 
>> I recommend that we avoid this by making the PDF be the authoritative
>> version.  Whatever fears there are of an unfaithful PDF result, I think 
> the
>> odds of successful consumption by reviewers and user are clearly better 
> than
>> what we are dealing with as a certainty.  Also, the PDFs that are 
> relatively
>> small, easy to review, and for the State of Interoperability, we have no
>> concern about some normative text being corrupted in the PDF.
>> 
>> - Dennis
>> 
>> PS: Rob quipped that a committee can use any document format it wants, 
> even
>> Microsoft Word .doc.  If I'd been on my toes, I would have offered to 
> second
>> that were it to be made as a motion.  (It would be ironic if the ODF 
> exports
>> to .doc were more reliable than what we are seeing in ODF interchange.)
>>    I am now accustomed to OASIS TCs that use ODF.  It is startling when 
> I
>> see .doc files, especially as authoritative sources, from other TCs.  I 
> want
>> us to have a reliable way to use ODF Text documents on the OIC TC.  It 
> is an
>> obvious dog-food issue.  What can we do to achieve that successfully?
>> 
>> PPS: Out of curiosity, I noticed that CD03 itself was identified with
>> office:version="1.2" and
>> <meta:generator>OOo-dev/3.2$Win32
>> OpenOffice.org_project/320m6$Build-9459</meta:generator>.  This opens 
> just
>> fine in OpenOffice.org 3.0.1 and (after ignoring the warning) 
> OpenOffice.org
>> 2.4.1.
>> 
>> PPPS: Since this is not about producing reports about specific products 
> but
>> figuring out a way to use an interoperable set of tools for our own 
> document
>> production, I tried Windows 7 WordPad on cd03.  It doesn't handle 
> numbers on
>> the headings and doesn't handle ToCs.  On the other hand, Word 2007 SP2
>> opens all three of CD03, CD03-wd01 and CD03-wd02 and shows the ToC and
>> in-body headings correctly EXCEPT that, for all three documents, the
>> level-two headings all have page breaks in front of them and, with wd02
>> only, the Section numbering starts over at 1 with the Conclusions 
> section. 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Hanssens Bart [mailto:Bart.Hanssens@fedict.be] 
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 08:30
>> To: dennis.hamilton@acm.org; oic@lists.oasis-open.org
>> Cc: Rob Weir
>> Subject: RE: [oic] Groups - state-of-interop-cd-03-wd02.odt uploaded -
>> NUMBERING
>> 
>> Well, we actually shouldn't comment on implementations per charter, but 
> I
>> guess it's related to
>> 
>> http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=106218
>> 
>> Should be fixed when opening in 3.2 and resaving again, I'll do that 
> when
>> updating to cd4.
>> 
>> 
>> Bart
>> 
>> ________________________________________
>> From: Dennis E. Hamilton [dennis.hamilton@acm.org]
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 4:58 PM
>> To: oic@lists.oasis-open.org
>> Cc: Hanssens Bart; Rob Weir
>> Subject: RE: [oic] Groups - state-of-interop-cd-03-wd02.odt uploaded -
>> NUMBERING
>> 
>> OK, I didn't look closely enough.
>> 
>> When I opened this document in OpenOffice 3.0.1, I did see the TOC with
>> proper subsections, and I saw section numbers on the headings in the 
> body of
>> the document.
>> 
>> However, numbering is not maintained properly in the body.  There are
>> several section 0.1, for example.
>> 
>> E.g., 2.2 is numbered 0.1, 2.3 is numbered 0.1 also, section 3 is number 
> as
>> section 1, 3.2 is numbered 0.1, section 4 is numbered as section 1, etc.
>> 
>> SO, I tried the OpenOffice 2.4.1, Sun Distribution.
>> 
>> It has the TOC right and it has the subsections being in the same 
> section.
>> But the subsections are all numbered *.1.  That is, Section 4 has two
>> subsections each numbered 4.1.
>> 
>> FINALLY, I opened the package in WinZip and confirmed that
>> <office:document-content> office:version="1.1".  And also, in meta.xml,
>> <meta:generator>OpenOffice.org/3.1$Unix
>> OpenOffice.org_project/310m19$Build-9420</meta:generator>
>> 
>> Yes, I would say that this is a big deal for the State of 
> Interoperability.
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: bart.hanssens@fedict.be [mailto:bart.hanssens@fedict.be]
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 07:02
>> To: oic@lists.oasis-open.org
>> Subject: [oic] Groups - state-of-interop-cd-03-wd02.odt uploaded
>> 
>> The document revision named state-of-interop-cd-03-wd02.odt has been
>> submitted by Mr. Bart Hanssens to the OASIS Open Document Format
>> Interoperability and Conformance (OIC) TC document repository.  This
>> document is revision #1 of state-of-interop-cd-03-wd01.odt.
>> 
>> Document Description:
>> 
>> 
>> View Document Details:
>> http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/document.php?document_id=36343
>> 
>> Download Document:
>> 
> http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/36343/state-of-interop-cd-
> 
>> 03-wd02.odt
>> 
>> Revision:
>> This document is revision #1 of state-of-interop-cd-03-wd01.odt.  The
>> document details page referenced above will show the complete revision
>> history.
>> 
>> 
>> PLEASE NOTE:  If the above links do not work for you, your email 
> application
>> may be breaking the link into two pieces.  You may be able to copy and 
> paste
>> the entire link address into the address field of your web browser.
>> 
>> -OASIS Open Administration
>> 
>> 
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