Draft Minutes for today's OpenCSA Steering Committee

[Mike Kaiser <mkaiser@us.ibm.com>]

DRAFT MINUTES - OpenCSA Steering Committee (StC) Draft
Minutes - 13 March 2009 9:00 AM PST

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NEW ACTION ITEMS: 
        AI20090313-001
Jeff to send recommendation to 
           
    the TC's.        

        
        AI20090313-002
- Jeff to talk with mary to make 
           
    the request to group SCA PR announcements.  
     



        
0. Agenda bashing and Roll
        Attending:  
               Voting Members (X
= Attended)        
           
               
               
               
            
           
               
    X        David Burke
           
               
    X        Bob Freund
           
               
            Anil Gurnani
               
               
           
               
    X        Mike Kaiser
(Secretary/Vice-Chair)
           
               
    X        Jeff Mischkinsky
           
               
    X        Sanjay Patil
           
               
               
               
                 
               
               
               
               
               
               
  
        Apologies:  
               
               
     
           
               
            Mark Little  
             
           
               
            
           
               
            
        OASIS Staff:  
                     
           
               
            Robin Cover
           
               
            Jane Harnad
           
               
            Scott McGrath
           
               
            Mary McRae
           
               
            Dee Schur
           
               
    
        Identified Observers:
        None
           
               
               
    
        
        
        Notes:  
                     
     Mike Kaiser


        NO CHANGES TO
AGENDA.
        

        
1. Minutes Approval 

        - 13 February
2009: 

        http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/opencsa-ms/download.php/31241/Open_CSA_SC_20090213_Draft.txt

           
    
        Motion: Approve
the minutes referenced by the link above. BF, S Sanjay.

        APPROVED unanimously.
 


2. Open Action Item Review and Discussion 

        
        AI20090213-001
Jeff/Sanjay to remind the TC's that they need
           
    to begin the Test Artifact work (Test Assertion and
Test
           
    Case definitions) as it's not as easy as it first
may seem.
           
    Recommendation is to use the SCA-Assembly as a model
for
           
    this work.  They also need to define a schedule
for 
           
    completion of this work.

           
    STATUS: Jeff and Sanjay had detailed discussion at
the
           
            last LSC call.
 Most (maybe all) of the TC's
           
            are wrapping
the process of getting to a PR
           
            draft approval.


           
            Assembly, Policy,
BPEL TC's have voted. For
           
            BPEL it is expect
that they will notify the
           
            admin today.
 
           
            THIS ACTION ITEM
SHOULD NOW BE CLOSED.



        AI20090213-002
       All Steering Committee members need
to
           
    a) review the charter wording for when exactly compliancy
           
    is needed (i.e. before CS or before OASIS Membership

           
    approval submission) and b) review their plans to
have 
           
    a spec compliant implementation that might be a viable
           
    candidate for use by the TC's.  For discussion
at
           
    March 13th, 2009 Steering Committee meeting.

           
    STATUS: There is agreement amongst the Steering
           
            Committee members
that compliancy testing
           
            must be complete
before a specification
           
            is submitted
for standardization ratification,
           
            but there is
no requirement that it be
           
            complete before
Committee Specification
           
            approval.  See
discussion for agenda item
           
            4 and the related
StC recommendation.
           
            THIS ACTION ITEM
SHOULD NOW BE CLOSED.


        AI20081212-001
- Coordinate an effort with Assembly TC to produce an 
           
    SCA primer as the specs approach standardization
(in review).

           
    STATUS: On Hold until we get closer to standardization.

           
    
        
        
3. Overall TC Milestones Status as discussed by LSC:
  
        Tentative dates
for key milestones: 

        On Feb 5, 2009
conf-call [A], the LSC discussed the following as the 
        new anticipated
schedule for the OpenCSA TCs: 

           End
Feb – Assembly and Policy TC to start 1st Public Review (60 day)
           Mid
March – Other TCs to start 1st Public Review (60 day)
           End
June – Finish all the work
           End
July – Submit specs to OASIS for OS vote 

        ASSEMBLY ONLY
(now about a month behind schedule on testing work
           
           resulting in the following
[B]) 
           End
Feb Test Assertion complete
           End
March Test Case complete
           Mid
April for Assembly TC only
           End
June - 1st Public Review complete
        
        Recommendation
that all other TC's set a similiar schedule for
        for about one
month later.        

        [A] http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/opencsa-liaison/200902/msg00003.html
        [B] http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/opencsa-liaison/200901/msg00013.html
        
        Some of these
dates have already been missed and 
        therefore need
to be adjusted. 

        What are schedules
for each TC?

        Have all the TC's
started working on their testing artifacts
        yet since these
are formal deliverables?  


        DISCUSSION:
        
        Technically the
Steering Committee doesn't have approval
        rights for Committee
Specifications.  The TC's have the
        right to decide
when they go to Committee Specification
        status.  The
most we can do is to make a recommendation
        to the TC's.

        We could get bottoms
up feeling on this.  
        We could also
recommend that testing should have started 
        by CS time frame
so that the TC has a higher level of
        confidence in
the CS. (i.e. at least some sanity testing
        of some sort).
       

        OASIS is missing
is the Call for Implementation stage that
        other groups such
as the W3C has.

        There is benefit
to using the first CS as similar kind of 
        CR level. If we
try to push for stuff that is too stringent 
        (from a testing
standpoint) at this stage we might get 
        pushback.  We
don't have power to do that.

        We should be pushing
the message that the TC's should 
        treat the first
CS as "we think that we are done, now 
        it's time to debug
with some implementations to validate
        the specification".
 The CS provides another higher 
        level of stabilization
for the specification. This 
        should help encourage
people to take the risk of 
        implementation.
        
        
        The test suites
(artifacts) really should be complete 
        before CS and
they should be approved as part of the
        CS process as
well. The Steering Committee should make
        a recommendation
that the TC's go for Test Suite and
        main spec approval
at the same time.
           
    

        MOTION: Steering
Committee Recommends inclusion of the 
           
    test suite with the main package for the initial

           
    CS vote. 
        
        Motion: Mike Second:
David
        Discussion:
        We should add
something along the lines that we expect
        there would be
a subsequent CS once the testing requirements
        are met.

        Before you can
go to OASIS std vote. You have to have
        a CS... 

        This is already
part of the OASIS rules and therefore
        doesn't need to
be said again.  In general the OASIS
        process requires
that a ballot be done on whether to
        submit a CS to
Membership consideration as a standard.
        The other option
is to iterate through the CD, PR,
        CS cycle again
if there are substantive changes found
        by testing or
even field comments.

        Should we include
"completed test suite"? (i.e. the 
        test suite should
be complete when it is subjected to
        the initial CS
vote.

        MOTION TO AMEND:
Amend the wording for the recommendation 
           
    under consideration to include the word "complete"
           
    
        Motion: Sanjay
 Seconded: Jeff
        Discussion:
           
    None
           
    No objections.

        MOTION TO AMEND:
Approved Unanimously.        

        Amended
        Motion: Steering
Committee Recommends inclusion of the 
           
    completed test suite with the main package for 
           
    the initial CS vote. 

        
        Further Discussion
on amended motion:
           
    None
        
           
    No objections.

        AMENDED MOTION:
Approved Unanimously

        

        ACTION: 
           
    AI20090313-001 Jeff to send recommendation to 
           
    the TC's.        


        Should we ask
mary to send out a single PR notice for all 
        specs?

        MOTION: Request
that Mary send out the PR review statements
        for Assembly,
Policy, BPEL and others that might be ready as
        as one announcement.


        Motion: Mike Second:
Jeff
        
        Discusion:
           
    None.
           
    No objections.
           
    Approved


        ACTION:
           
    AI20090313-002 - Jeff to talk with mary to make 
           
    the request to group SCA PR announcements.




4. Compliant implementation plans
        
        We know that we
need something about mid year.  There are
        several companies
working this but implementation timing is 
        unknown.  Open
Source (Apache Tuscany, looks to be one
        source for at
least some of the TC's).  Each TC will have to
        make it's own
decision on what compliant implementations
        they are going
to use based on what's available in the 
        timeframe of standardization
and what their test plan looks
        like.

        The SC must eventually
resolve the question of "how it will
        make approval
decisions" and communicate this to the TC's. 
        It is expected
that the Testing Plans for each TC will 
        incorporate implementation/testing
aspects which encompass
        the broader "SCA"
picture.

        We must address
the following core questions:
          Are we
all in agreement that the exit criteria in each 
          charter
applies to Member Submission for vote and not 
          for Committee
Specification approval?

          At this
stage, what (if any) compliant applications 
          are the
likely candidates which the SC will likely 
          generally
accept?

        DISCUSSION:

        No further information.
 Continue to hold on agenda for
        future discussion.
        
        
5. Any Other Business?
        NONE

        
6. Future SC Agenda Topics? 
        NONE
        
        
7. Next Meeting 

           -
The next regular teleconference is scheduled for April 10th, 2009 
           
    9:00am PST, 12:00pm EST, 5:00pm UK

        (OpenCSA Steering
Committee calls are scheduled for the second Friday 
           
    of each month.)


8. Adjourn
        MOTION: Adjourn.
        Motion: Bob Second:
David.

        Approved Unanimously
without objection.