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Subject: Re: [regrep] Core Components Riddle


Joe,
 
Ah!  That is a horse of a different question!!!
 
What you need for that is (of course) a weighted score chart! ; -)
 
Somethings that go into that:
 
1) what does your currrent data world look like and how much is it costing you?
 
   a) you could control your own data space and all your partners - therefore low value
   b) other extreme - you have to deal with hundreds of other agencies - all with their
       own data definitions.
 
2) are you trying to create a "plug-n-play" system for 1,000s of external org's to
    potentially interface to you electronically? (paper reduction act drivers)
    a) if so - how much does it cost you to on-board each one?
    b) look at XML2004 Interop approach to solve this - with registry managed
        services.
 
3) How big is your agency?
    a) US Department for Investigating Broom Handle Design Impacts
        - ok - probably a sledge-hammer to crack a nut
    b) US DOD - no sledgehammer is big enough - but you have to start
        somewhere!
 
DW
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2005 7:27 PM
Subject: RE: [regrep] Core Components Riddle

<Quote>
Is that enough business benefit level?
</Quote>

Not enough to (hypothetically speaking) convince a US federal agency executive as to why they should spend X thousands of dollars to have their technical folks "Core Component-tize" a large chunk of their data. :)
 
Kind Regards,
Joseph Chiusano
Booz Allen Hamilton
Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com
 


From: David Webber (XML) [mailto:david@drrw.info]
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2005 7:24 PM
To: Chiusano Joseph; regrep@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: Re: [regrep] Core Components Riddle

Joe,
 
Of course - I think the CAM executive summary probably
covers this off in terms of building industry dictionaries -
but in a nutshell- you go from the CCTS model to the
business nouns in XML in the registry - that now
gives you the industry dictionary - along with re-use.
 
Your re-use improves as you enhance the semantics
around the business nouns to include OWL based
definitions and classification schemes and association
links - so the usual "see also", "associated with", and
other tools become instanciated.
 
Of course the UBL approach - of publishing a pre-defined
set of purpose built transactions also fits in here. The
idea being to provide pre-done BPSS scripts, CAM
templates, CPA partner profiles, and UBL-structure
schema that allow rapid adoption.
 
Is that enough business benefit level?
 
DW
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2005 7:00 PM
Subject: RE: [regrep] Core Components Riddle

Thanks so much David.
 
Additional opinions, including a "business benefit" level?
 
Joe
 
Joseph Chiusano
Booz Allen Hamilton
Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com
 


From: David Webber (XML) [mailto:david@drrw.info]
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2005 6:53 PM
To: Chiusano Joseph; regrep@lists.oasis-open.org
Subject: Re: [regrep] Core Components Riddle

Joe,
 
No surprises here.  If you want to couple CCTS to actual
runtime validation and content processing then you
have to use technology such as CAM templates - and
the associated business noun definitions as XML
in registry - so that you now have direct linkage
between the model definitions and the runtime.
 
UBL have been finessing this by using W3C XSD
to carry the structure information from the CCTS model
with limited content semantics.
 
This only gets you so far before you hit insurmountable
issues relating to context and structure permutations.
Not to mention codelist processing and then
permutations based of codelist selections - eg if
countrycode="US" then require ZIPcode, else require
postalcode.
 
Then you have to use CAM templates to resolve 
and implement this.
 
Since CAM has been purpose built for delivering this
for CCTS all along - this is a bit of a non-surprise here.
 
DW
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2005 6:38 PM
Subject: [regrep] Core Components Riddle

Now that our V3.0 specs are in OASIS public review, I have a general question on Core Components please:
 
The basic question is: What precise value do Core Components bring for data exchanges?
 
More details:
 
Scenario #1:
 
- Suppose 2 trading partners are exchanging data.
 
- Also suppose that none of the Core Components that are used in the exchange are part of the TBG17 Core Component Library (this will be the variable for the next scenario).
- The sending trading partner decides to indicate in their XML document the various Core Component entities (CC's, BIEs, etc.) using a content model (set of elements/attributes) near each entity (where does not matter - but let's assume just below) that indicates what type of entity it is.
 
- The receiving trading partner processes the XML document, but does not process the entity information because all it "cares" about is the actual data, not the data model. What value does using Core Components bring here?
 
Scenario #2:
 
- Same as above, except that all of the Core Components that are used in the exchange are part of the TBG17 Core Component Library (and stored in the UN/CEFACT Core Component registry - assume it is in production), and are indicated as such using their registry identifiers.
- The receiving trading partner processes the XML document, but should they "care" about the entity information this time? What value does using Core Components bring here? Is it different than the value in Scenario #1?
 
A third question: Absent any data exchanges, what would motivate someone to "Core Component-enable" all of their data? (for example, creating a relational representation of the CCTS Core Component entity metadata, and populating the tables/fields with the metadata values + the original data).
 
Thanks,
Joe
 
Joseph Chiusano
Booz Allen Hamilton
Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com
 


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