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Subject: Draft Minutes form 2011-03-29 for review


All,

     Draft minutes from today’s call are attached. Please check your attendance is recorded if – I did not hear the straggler roll call.

 

Best Regards,

                       Eric.

Eric Wells

Consulting Engineer

Hitachi Computer Products (America) Inc.

Cell: +1 415 672 2594

eric.wells@hitachisoftware.com

 

 

 

Title: SCA-Assembly - 2011-03-29


OASIS Logo

- DRAFT -

Oasis SCA-Assembly Teleconference

29 MAR 2011

Attendees

Present

Robert Freund Hitachi, Ltd.Group Member
Eric Wells Hitachi, Ltd.Group Member
David Booz IBMGroup Member
Mike Edwards IBMGroup Member
Simon Holdsworth IBMGroup Member
Diane Jordan IBMGroup Member
Mike Kaiser IBMGroup Member
Jim Marino IndividualGroup Member
Jeff Estefan Jet Propulsion Laboratory:*Group Member
Martin Chapman Oracle CorporationGroup Member
Anish Karmarkar Oracle CorporationGroup Member
Rich Levinson Oracle CorporationGroup Member
Ashok Malhotra Oracle CorporationGroup Member
Jeff Mischkinsky Oracle CorporationGroup Member
Gilbert Pilz Oracle CorporationGroup Member
Sanjay Patil SAP AG*Group Member
Plamen Pavlov SAP AG*Group Member
Eric Johnson TIBCO Software Inc.Group Member
Danny van der Rijn TIBCO Software Inc.Group Member

Chairs

Martin Chapman
Mike Edwards

Scribe

Eric Wells

Agenda:

1. Intro

Roll call
Scribe confirmation
Agenda bashing

2. Approval of minutes of previous SCA-Assembly TC meeting

http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/sca-assembly/download.php/41597/SCA%20Assembly%20minutes%202011-03-22.html

3. Action Items

id=2010-09-22-8 status=pending owner="EricJ" produce new proposal for ASSEMBLY-227
id=2011-01-04-2 status=pending Edwards to write a new proposal for the resolution of Assembly-246 along the lines contained in wsra

4. TC Administrivia

None

5. Exit Criteria

The TC needs to adopt concrete exit criteria.

Consider how to move this forward


6 1.1 Specification Open Issues

ASSEMBLY 260: (v1.1) Remove RFC2119 language for underspecified normative statements
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-260

Proposal in JIRA

ASSEMBLY 261: (v1.1) Upgrade ASM12017, ASM12030, ASM14004 be mandatory statements
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-261

Proposal in JIRA


6. 1.2 Specification Open Issues (1.2)

ASSEMBLY-239: (1.2): Business data filter element needs better name, definition
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-239

Alternate proposals:
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201102/msg00039.html


6. New Issues (1.2)

ASSEMBLY-257: Global domain channels creation inconsistent with pattern established by definitions.xml
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-257

ASSEMBLY-258: Section 11 of spec should be marked non-normative
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-258

ASSEMBLY-259: Some way to "late bind" references to global domain channels
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-259


7. 1.2 Specification Open Issues (1.2)

ASSEMBLY-253: Add Autocreation of Channels to SCA Assembly 1.2
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-253

Latest discussion:
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201102/msg00056.html
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201102/msg00055.html
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201102/msg00054.html


ASSEMBLY-250: Need an equivalent to "autowire" for the eventing world
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-250

Proposal in JIRA
Follow on discussion from previous meeting

Latest discussion:

http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201101/msg00041.html
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201101/msg00030.html


ASSEMBLY-227: Promotion of consumers and producers undermines composability
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-227

Proposal
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201004/msg00044.html
http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/37273/sca-assembly-1.2-spec-wd01-issue-227.pdf
http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/download.php/37272/sca-assembly-1.2-spec-wd01-issue-227.doc

Latest discussions:
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201012/msg00023.html
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201012/msg00022.html
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201012/msg00021.html
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201012/msg00020.html
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201012/msg00019.html
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201012/msg00017.html
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201012/msg00016.html


ASSEMBLY-235: Remotable interface compatibility should not be restricted to a WSDL 1.1 mapping
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-235

Latest discussion:
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201102/msg00079.html
http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/sca-assembly/201102/msg00078.html


ASSEMBLY-233: Define how Policy works for SCA Eventing
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-233

No Proposal

ASSEMBLY-243: Is the default channel configurable?
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-243

No proposal

ASSEMBLY-244: How to enable extensibility to multiple bindings on a channel
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-244

Outline proposal in JIRA

ASSEMBLY-245: Adopt the WS-RA Event Description specification to declare SCA Event Types
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-245

Proposal in JIRA

ASSEMBLY-246: Provide Location within SCA Contributions for eventType Declarations
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-246

Proposal in JIRA


ASSEMBLY-247: What are the requirements on an SCA Binding for eventing purposes?
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-247

No proposal

ASSEMBLY-248: RFC2119 wording and conformance statement need to be added for event processing
http://www.osoa.org/jira/browse/ASSEMBLY-248

No proposal


8. AOB

Contents

Topics
[1]  Opening
[2]  Approval of Minutes
[3]  Action Items
[4]  Aministrivia
[5]  Exit Criteria
[6]  Open Issues (1.1)
[7]  ASSEMBLY-260 Remove RFC2119 language for underspecified normative statements
[8]  ASSEMBLY-261 Upgrade ASM12017, ASM12030, ASM14004 to be mandatory statements
[9]  AOB
Table of Resolutions
Table of Action Items

Action Items

Pending:
id=2010-09-22-8 status=pending owner="EricJ" produce new proposal for ASSEMBLY-227
id=2011-01-04-2 status=pending Edwards to write a new proposal for the resolution of Assembly-246 along the lines contained in wsra

Resolutions


Minutes

<Bob>
eric, are you there?
<EricW>
Yes

Scribe: Eric Wells

Opening

<Mike Edwards>
Thanks for sribing Eric
<Mike Edwards>
or even scribing
Roll call - 16/21 = 76%
Agenda - accepted as posted

Approval of Minutes

Meeting of 2011-03-22
Resolution: Minutes of 2011-03-22 approved w/o

Action Items

Action: id=2010-09-22-8 status=pending owner="EricJ" produce new proposal for ASSEMBLY-227
Action: id=2011-01-04-2 status=pending Edwards to write a new proposal for the resolution of Assembly-246 along the lines contained in wsra
No changes to status
EricJ:
Notes that new issues to be considered have impact on his AI

Aministrivia

None

Exit Criteria

MikeE:
Notes previous discussions, but no significant progress
 
...does not porpose to discuss until there seems to be progress via E-mail
(no comments from TC)

Open Issues (1.1)

ASSEMBLY-260 Remove RFC2119 language for underspecified normative statements

MartinC reviews his proposal
MartinC:
"Quick & dirty" way of removing "optional" RFC2119 from spec
 
...e.g. why have untestable statements as normative text?
ASM12008 Proposal
Change: "[ASM12008] An SCA runtime MAY provide the contribution operation functions (install Contribution, update Contribution, add Deployment Composite, update Deployment Composite, remove Contribution)."

To: "It is strongly encouraged that an SCA runtime provides the contribution operation functions (install Contribution, update Contribution, add Deployment Composite, update Deployment Composite, remove Contribution); how these are provided is implementation specific."
MartinC:
Probaly use "ought to" instead of "can"
No discussion
ASM12013 Proposal
Change: "[ASM12013] For components at the Domain level, with references for which @autowire="true" applies, the behaviour of the SCA runtime for a given Domain MUST take ONE of the 3 following forms:

1) The SCA runtime disallows deployment of any components with autowire references. In this case, the SCA runtime MUST raise an exception at the point where the component is deployed.

2) The SCA runtime evaluates the target(s) for the reference at the time that the component is deployed and does not update those targets when later deployment actions occur.

3) The SCA runtime re-evaluates the target(s) for the reference dynamically as later deployment actions occur resulting in updated reference targets which match the new Domain configuration. How the reconfiguration of the reference takes place is described by the relevant client and implementation specifications."

To: "For components at the Domain level, with references for which @autowire="true" applies, the behaviour of the SCA runtime for a given Domain is implementation specific although it is expected that ONE of the 3 behaviours below is followed:

1) The SCA runtime disallows deployment of any components with autowire references. In this case, the SCA runtime can raise an exception at the point where the component is deployed.

2) The SCA runtime evaluates the target(s) for the reference at the time that the component is deployed and does not update those targets when later deployment actions occur.

3) The SCA runtime re-evaluates the target(s) for the reference dynamically as later deployment actions occur resulting in updated reference targets which match the new Domain configuration. How the reconfiguration of the reference takes place is described by the relevant client and implementation specifications."
No discussion
ASM12014 Proposal
Change: "[ASM12014] Where <wire/> elements are added, removed or replaced by deployment actions, the components whose references are affected by those deployment actions MAY have their references updated by the SCA runtime dynamically without the need to stop and start those components."

To: "Where <wire/> elements are added, removed or replaced by deployment actions, the components whose references are affected by those deployment actions can have their references updated by the SCA runtime dynamically without the need to stop and start those components. How this is achieved is implementation specific."
No discussion
ASM12015 Proposal
Change: "[ASM12015] Where components are updated by deployment actions (their configuration is changed in some way, which includes changing the wires of component references), the new configuration MUST apply to all new instances of those components once the update is complete."

To: "Where components are updated by deployment actions (their configuration is changed in some way, which includes changing the wires of component references), the SCA implementation needs to ensure that the updates apply to all new instances of those components once the update is complete."
No discussion
ASM12016 Proposal
Change: "[ASM12016] An SCA runtime MAY choose to maintain existing instances with the old configuration of components updated by deployment actions, but an SCA runtime MAY choose to stop and discard existing instances of those components."

To: "An SCA runtime can choose to maintain existing instances with the old configuration of components updated by deployment actions, although an implementation of an SCA runtime can choose to stop and discard existing instances of those components."
No discussion
ASM12018 Proposal
Change: "[ASM12018] Where a component that is the target of a wire is updated, future invocations of that reference SHOULD use the updated component."

To: "Where a component that is the target of a wire is updated, an SCA runtime can direct future invocations of that reference to the updated component."
No discussion
ASM12020 Proposal
Change: " [ASM12020] Where a component is added to the Domain that is a potential target for a domain level component reference where that reference is marked as @autowire=true, the SCA runtime MUST:
. either update the references for the source component once the new component is running.
. or alternatively, defer the updating of the references of the source component until the source component is stopped and restarted."

To: "Where a component is added to the Domain that is a potential target for a domain level component reference where that reference is marked as @autowire=true, the SCA runtime can:
. either update the references for the source component once the new component is running.
. or alternatively, defer the updating of the references of the source component until the source component is stopped and restarted."
No discussion
ASM14001 Proposal
Change: "[ASM14001] An SCA runtime SHOULD detect errors at deployment time where those errors can be found through static analysis."

To: " An SCA runtime is expected to detect errors at deployment time where those errors can be found through static analysis."
No discussion
ASM14002 Proposal
Change: "[ASM14002] The SCA runtime SHOULD prevent deployment of contributions that are in error, and raise the error to the process performing the deployment (e.g. write a message to an interactive console or write a message to a log file)."

To: "An SCA runtime has to prevent deployment of contributions that are in error, and raise an error to the process performing the deployment (e.g. write a message to an interactive console or write a message to a log file). The exact timing of checking contributions for errors is implementation specific."
MartinC:
Notes there are other statements that prevent runtime running artifacts that are in error
ASM60021 Proposal
Change: "[ASM60021]

For the case of an un-wired reference with multiplicity 1..1 or 1..n the deployment process provided by an SCA runtime SHOULD issue a warning."

To: "For the case of an un-wired reference with multiplicity 1..1 or 1..n the deployment process provided by an SCA runtime is encouraged to issue a warning."
Motion: Resolve ASSEMBLY-260 with proposal in JIRA with modification posted above m= MartinC s=AnishK
AnishK noted for roll
No discussion - no objections
Resolution: Resolve ASSEMBLY-260 with proposal in JIRA with modification posted in chat room
AnishK:
Notes that some of the normative statements are shaded differently from each other (formatted color)

ASSEMBLY-261 Upgrade ASM12017, ASM12030, ASM14004 to be mandatory statements

MartinC:
Thinks these should be mandatory (not an anti-optional campaign!)
ASM12017 Proposal
Change: "[ASM12017] Where a component that is the target of a wire is removed, without the wire being changed, then future invocations of the reference that use that wire SHOULD fail with a ServiceUnavailable fault...."

To: "[ASM12017] Where a component that is the target of a wire is removed, without the wire being changed, then future invocations of the reference that use that wire MUST fail with a ServiceUnavailable fault...."
EricJ:
Why was this looked at - because there's no test case?
MikeE:
There is no test case but no marked untestable
MartinC:
Yes but also because in this case there MUST be an error
MikeE:
Don't think this could be tested as there no standard API for this
AnishK:
Should be OK to have MUST in an untestable statement
DannyV:
If an API is not required then how come we specify something that depends on an API?
<anish>
12017 in its entirety is:
MartinC:
An API isn't needed for this to occur
 
...maybe we should think of rewording to cover removal of wire "by any means"
MikeE:
Think there's other normative statements that would cover this
DannyV:
Then this would be no-normative
ASM12030 Proposal
Change: "[ASM12030] For XML definitions, which are identified by QNames, the @namespace attribute of the export element SHOULD be the namespace URI for the exported definitions."

To: "[ASM12030] For XML definitions, which are identified by QNames, the @namespace attribute of the export element MUST be the namespace URI for the exported definitions."
MikeE:
Intent is to cover situations that use extensions
EricJ:
Not sure what this is supposed to constrain - target is too vague
 
...how can tools implement this constraint?
AnishK:
Agrees with EricJ - doesn't seem to reflect intent of consrtaining extensions
 
...a MUST would cover situation where extensions are used with import/export
ASM14004 Proposal
Change: "[ASM14004] When an error that could have been detected through static analysis is detected and raised at runtime for a component, the component SHOULD NOT be run until the error is fixed."

To: "[ASM14004] When an error that could have been detected through static analysis is detected and raised at runtime for a component, the component MUST NOT be run until the error is fixed."
MartinC:
Can't see any reason why a runtime can be allowed to run a component in error
EricJ:
Static analysis of components can't see whole situation and may give false positive errors
EricW:
I seem to remember that this was discussed at length and "SHOULD" was chosen to allow for incorrect static errors
<anish>
The target is called "SCA Composite Document"
martinC:
We've just removed (de-normatized?) other statements that covered this
 
...but there should be one rule that says "if there's an error then don't run component"
MikeE:
Notes there was some deliberation over this - we wanted to cover different types of runtime
 
...would preclude some runtime environments (e.g. within eclipse)
EricJ:
Static analysis really only covers design time errors - at compile time
 
...doesn't cover "assembly"
<anish>
For a component that is contained in a non-conformant deployed SCA Composite Document, the runtime MUST NOT run the component. [ASM14004] For runtimes and tools that delay detecting errors that could have been detected through static analysis, cannot run the erroneous component till it is fixed.
FIVE MINUTES
MikeE:
There is a statement that say error MUST be raised so we could rewrite 11.1 11.2 as non-normative?
AnishK:
Add text to the effect that component in error cannot be run until fixed (error resolved)?
<anish>
Fixed: For a component that is contained in a non-conformant deployed SCA Composite Document, the runtime MUST NOT run the component. [ASM14004] Runtimes and tools that delay detecting errors that could have been detected through static analysis, cannot run the erroneous component till it is fixed.
MartinC:
If the contribution is invalid should the runtime be allowed to run it?
 
...what ought the runtime do with errors?
No consensus - needs further discussion
EricW:
Sorry my 'phone dropped

AOB

Straggler Roll
AnishK DannyV
<MartinC >
<MartinC >
thanks ericw
COB 9:01AM PDT

[End of Minutes]
Formatted on 2011-03-29 at 11:53:43 GMT-7


Minutes formatted by Schreiber, a collection of XSLT stylesheets by Bob Freund modeled after David Booth's scribe

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