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Subject: Prelim minutes for the SCA-BPEL TC formation meeting

Prelim Minutes of OASIS SCA-BPEL TC Formation meeting

Friday Sep 7, 2007

Agenda: http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/sca-bpel/email/archives/200709/msg00000.html

1         Welcome: Convener

Mike Edwards, IBM,  acted as convenor. 

2         Introductions and roll call: Convener     20 mins

2a)  TC roster


 Mike Edwards conducted the initial Roll Call.

Meeting Attendees




Najeeb Andrabi TIBCO Software Inc
Voting Member
Fred Carter AmberPoint
Voting Member
Martin Chapman Oracle
Voting Member
Jacques Durand Fujitsu Limited
Voting Member
Mike Edwards IBM
Voting Member
Mark Ford Active Endpoints, Inc
Voting Member
Alejandro Guizar Red Hat
Voting Member
Khanderao Kand Oracle
Voting Member
Anish Karmarkar Oracle
Voting Member
Jason Kinner Oracle
Voting Member
Dieter Koenig IBM
Voting Member
Rich Levinson Oracle
Voting Member
Monica Martin Sun Microsystems
Voting Member
Jeff Mischkinsky Oracle
Voting Member
Sanjay Patil SAP AG
Voting Member
Michael Pellegrini Active Endpoints, Inc
Voting Member
Michael Rowley BEA Systems, Inc
Voting Member
Ivana Trickovic SAP AG
Voting Member
Danny van der Rijn TIBCO Software Inc.
Voting Member
Pete Wenzel Sun Microsystems Voting Member

Ashok Malhotra

Bill Barnhill
Booz Allen Hamilton
Jean-Sebastien Delfino

 There are 20 voting members.

3         Appointment of Note taker Convener          

 Martin Chapman, Oracle agreed to take notes for the formation meeting.

4         Election of TC chair(s), Convenor

 4a. Determination of number of chairs.

 From discussions it appears that there is a desire that most of

the SCA TCs will have two co-chairs to share the load/responsibility.


Martin moved that the TC have two co-chairs, seconded by Danny.

No objection, motion for two co-chairs passes.

4b. Nominations

 Martin nominates Anish Karmarkar (Oracle) and Sanjay Patil (SAP) as Co-chairs, seconded by Mike Rowley.

 Anish and Sanjay accepted the nomination.

 No other nominations for co-chair.

 Anish's candidate statement: Have been involved in SCA, esp Assembly. Active on other WS and Java groups in W3C, WS-I and OSGI. Experience with the OASIS TC Process.

 Sanjay candidate statement: Have been involved in the SCA specifiations. Worked on several different committees including chairing WS-RX. Very intersted in Business Processes.

There were no objections to appointing Anish as co-chair, so duly elected unanimously.
There were no objections to appointing Sanjay as co-chair, so duly elected unanimously.

4f. Hand-off of meeting from convener to newly elected chair(s).

 Anish and Sanjay took over running the meeting.

5         Approval/agenda bashing of (remaining) meeting agenda TC Chairs

 No changes were requested, agenda approved.

6         Introduction to OASIS process: OASIS staff

[Jamie Clark and Mary McRae gave an overview on the OASIS process, rules and procedures.]
Jamie Clark introduced himself and Mary McRae.
OASIS Staff available to help.
Policies and Procedures available on the OASIS web site.
Use Roberts Rules to operate meetings.
Charters can be changed using published procedures.
This TC is part of the OpenCSA Member Section, that coordinates across the SCA TCs.
Mary introcduced herself.
If you have any problems with OASIS tools, feel free to contact me.
Helps the committee through the oasis process, esp reviews and spec progression.

7         Standing rules

A TC can adopt additonal rules, as long as don't contradict the TC process or roberts rules.
 Motion: Mike Rowley: That there be a standing rule for electronic ballots for motions made on and seconded on the TC email list. Seconded by Mike Edwards.

[discusion on current TC process rules]
Michael Rowley: 2.13 is where it says that electronic ballots may be used.
Martin: the TC process may be ambiguous as to whether a web ballot is considered an electronic ballot
Mike R: intention is to allow either email or web ballots
Jeff: not sure its a good idea. Should stick to web ballots. Not a good idea to start motions outside of a meeting, without the benefit of a discussion. Chairs can always set up admin ballots.
Mark Ford: is the an issue of having multiple open overlapping issues going on?
Jeff: hard to keep track on email.
Mike R: Agree with most of what Jeff says. The primary value of a motion to be raised by mailing list is where the wording of the motion needs to be crafted carefully and can be done off-line. Ballots out of the blue would be bad.
Danny: In response to Mike, def a good thing to craft motions in email. But typically they get crafted, 2nd and could even get ammended this is not good on email. So better to do in a meeting.
Jamie Clark: OASIS staff comment:  it's one thing to permit a web ballot on a seconded motion made at a live meeting;  it's another to permit motions & second to be made async by e-mail.  The former (web ballots) are mandated by our rule in some cases, and in all other cases the TC can choose by standing rule to permit or prohibit them.  The latter (motions by async e-mail) is (as we understand it) the subject of Mike Rowley's motion now under discussion.
Martin: E ballots must last 7 days. Generally against this motion.
 Mike E: there may not be weekly meetings, so e-ballots would be good.
Jeff: a blunt instrument. Two people can create a motion, theres no way to do amendments, so is a bad idea.

Jeff motions to substitute the motion to allow web ballots to be used to make binding decisions in the TC. Seconded by Martin.
Jamie: don't have to beat this to death this time. Advice adopt any one option for now and co-ord across tcs at the F2F.
Sanjay: TC rules do allow for web ballots. Do we need this amendments since its redundant with the TC process.
Jeff: maybe redundant, but doesnt do any harm. What Mike R is proposing could be harmful, so better at this stage to stick with what the other TCs have adopted.
Mike R: agrees with jamie. do something quickly and move on

No objections to the amendment: Motion is amended.

No objection to the amended motion. Amended motion passed.

8         Future meetings - F2F logistics - Proposed conf call schedule: TC

As has been announced the first F2F meetings and plenary will

be in Palo Alto, CA tues-thurs 18-20 Sep 2007:


If you have not done so please register at https://www.oasis-open.org/

apps/2007_OASIS_OpenCSA_Plenary/register_contact.php? to help us in

logistics planning. There is no fee. The first day Tuesday is

billed as an Open Education Session featuring a comprehensive review

of the current state of the SCA specifications. The official TC

meetings will be on Wed and Thursday.  Bindings TC will meet Thursday Afternoon.


The OSOA collaboration has been having regular teleconf calls on the

following schedule:


Policy   - Mo 0900 PDT

Assembly - Tu 0800 PDT

BPEL     - Th 0800 PDT

C-CPP    - Th 0800 PDT  (no overlap with BPEL)

Bindings - Th 0900 PDT

J        - Th 1000 PDT

OpenCSA Member Section Steering Comm - Fr 0900 PDT


Martin C moved that weekly BPEL calls be held starting Sep 27 for 60 minute, each Thursday at 8:00 AM PDT.
Seconded by Pete Wenzel.

Khanderao: possible to have it at 9am pdt
Martin: Sca Bindings TC has that slot.

No objections, weekly meetings will be each Thursday 8:00 PDT for 60 minutes starting sept. 27.

9         Charter overview, plan of work, TC organization: TC Chair(s)

Relationship to OpenCSA Member Section


TC Roles that will need to be filled:



        issues list,

        implementation/test subgroup,

        OpenCSA TC coordinator/liaison

Sanjay walks through the charter.
charter: http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/sca-bpel/charter.php
Jaques: See deadline for test suits but not for the spec. Is this a typo?
Martin: test suite can't be done until spec is finished, therfore its implied
Jaques: seems very optimistic for a full test suite.
Sanjay: doesn't imply a full reference impl.
Sanjay: plan this at the F2F.
Mike E: there is a requirement that some implemntations exist, not necessarily ref impls.
Martin. ref impls are different beasts and are very onourous on a TC. Exit criteria needs two different impls, but not a ref impl.

TC roles:
Sanjay describes key roles today, and appoint at F2F
Key roles:
secretary (helps managing action items, web site), Notetaker of meetings (if can't appoint perm one will have to rotate)
Specification editor(s): maintain the spec, fold in resolutions, follow templates etc
Issues Editor: mainting issues list, track resolutions, publish issues list
Liaison: laise with openCSA steering committee, other tcs etc
Need to decide what roles we have, and who wants to do these.
Anish: some of these roles take more time than others, so if you volunteer make sure you can committ the time and that you have your management support.
Will decide at F2F.

10   AOB

 No items

 Meeting adjourned.

11   Useful URLs



Original Call for Participation

http://www.oasis-open.org/archives/tc-announce/200707/msg00012.html -


http://www.oasis-open.org/archives/tc-announce/200707/msg00013.html -


http://www.oasis-open.org/archives/tc-announce/200707/msg00014.html -


http://www.oasis-open.org/archives/tc-announce/200707/msg00015.html -


http://www.oasis-open.org/archives/tc-announce/200707/msg00016.html -


http://www.oasis-open.org/archives/tc-announce/200707/msg00017.html -



TC home page:









TC charter








Email archive:








Document repository
















Future F2F meeting schedule








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