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Subject: RE: [search-ws] queryn: Some further comments


Title: RE: [search-ws] queryn: Some further comments

I can't understand what possible relevance there is to the fact that empty fields are not required to be sent.  Not that I am arguing in favor of this parameter, I still don't want it.  But we are not introducing an explicit form-based model into the protocol are we? Where the processing model dicates that the user inputs the queryn value?  The value gets into the URL however the client decides to get it in there, right, and if it wants to put an empty value in it can do so.  I think we need to clarify what the model is here that we are talking about.

 

From: LeVan,Ralph [mailto:levan@oclc.org]
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 9:47 AM
To: Hammond, Tony; Denenberg, Ray; Matthew Dovey; OASIS SWS TC
Subject: RE: [search-ws] queryn: Some further comments

 

Here’s the W3 page on forms.  The “Successful controls” section describes what fields in a form will or will not be sent.  Pull down lists without defaults are one example.  Unchecked check boxes are another.  Fields without values are not required to be returned.

 

http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/interact/forms.html#h-17.13.2

 

Ralph

 

From: Hammond, Tony [mailto:t.hammond@nature.com]
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 6:39 AM
To: LeVan,Ralph; Ray Denenberg, Library of Congress; Matthew Dovey; OASIS SWS TC
Subject: RE: [search-ws] queryn: Some further comments

 

 

> Forms do not transmit all their fields.

I'm not sure that's correct. Or has certainly not been my experience anyway. If you had some example that I could check that would be really good. Certainly this changes things so there's a real need to substantiate.

Tony


-----Original Message-----
From: LeVan,Ralph [mailto:levan@oclc.org]
Sent: Thu 12/16/2010 7:42 PM
To: Hammond, Tony; Ray Denenberg, Library of Congress; Matthew Dovey; OASIS SWS TC
Subject: RE: [search-ws] queryn: Some further comments

The parameters will not be numbered consecutively if they come from a
form.  Forms do not transmit all their fields.



Ralph



From: Hammond, Tony [mailto:t.hammond@nature.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 12:09 PM
To: LeVan,Ralph; Ray Denenberg, Library of Congress; Matthew Dovey;
OASIS SWS TC
Subject: RE: [search-ws] queryn: Some further comments





No. All the fields are present numbered consecutively in CQL order - not
necessarily form order. The query builder will merely drop clauses (and
fields thereof) with empty terms. It is the field contents that
contribute to the query. The fact that one field was passed over,
another included, is not recorded in the final string which is just a
complete CQL query string.

So, if the fields are iterated over in clause order it does not matter.
They are evaluated in proper sequence. There are no gaps in numbering.

Tony



-----Original Message-----
From: LeVan,Ralph [mailto:levan@oclc.org]
Sent: Thu 12/16/2010 3:23 PM
To: Hammond, Tony; Hammond, Tony; Ray Denenberg, Library of Congress;
Matthew Dovey; OASIS SWS TC
Subject: RE: [search-ws] queryn: Some further comments

There can be gaps in the numbering.  Not all fields present in a form
get submitted.



Ralph



From: Hammond, Tony [mailto:t.hammond@nature.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 6:08 AM
To: Hammond,Tony; Ray Denenberg, Library of Congress; Matthew Dovey;
LeVan,Ralph; OASIS SWS TC
Subject: RE: [search-ws] queryn: Some further comments



Hi:

Some further comments.

1. On reflection I guess that "queryn" could be dispensed with as long
as an empty "query" parameter were present in the query to a) signal the
searchRetrieve operation, and b) to receive the assembled query.

2. I had earlier proposed briefer forms of the parameters which would
make the querystring more manageable.

Instead of

"q1.idx", "q1.rel", "q1.trm", "q1.bln"

I proposed

"qi1", "qr1", "qt1", "qb1"

which are cleaner (half the length) and slighly easier to manipulate
(only prefix and index to manage instead of prefix, index, and suffix).

3. Since the query parameters are built with integers they are
arbitrarily extensible (do not require a fixed length form) and sort
order is completely in hands of the form generator. Doesn't matter where
the parameters appear on the form - just their call order. And then they
can be simply iterated over.

4. My preference is still for an explicit count (queryn) as I think this
is easier than trying to compute the number of clauses. And the count is
already known to the form generator since it is adding an index to the
clause parameters. Would almost seem to be a no-brainer.

5. Because of the boolean coupling of search clauses we require a
boolean associated with the search clause which for convenience we take
to be trailing - i.e. operates between this clause and any subsequent
clause. The final boolean in the series will always be omitted.

Tony


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liability for any statements made which are clearly the sender's own and
not
expressly made on behalf of Macmillan Publishers Limited or one of its
agents.
Please note that neither Macmillan Publishers Limited nor any of its
agents
accept any responsibility for viruses that may be contained in this
e-mail or
its attachments and it is your responsibility to scan the e-mail and
attachments (if any). No contracts may be concluded on behalf of
Macmillan
Publishers Limited or its agents by means of e-mail communication.
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Publishers Limited Registered in England and Wales with registered
number 785998
Registered Office Brunel Road, Houndmills, Basingstoke RG21 6XS 
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DISCLAIMER: This e-mail is confidential and should not be used by anyone who is
not the original intended recipient. If you have received this e-mail in error
please inform the sender and delete it from your mailbox or any other storage
mechanism. Neither Macmillan Publishers Limited nor any of its agents accept
liability for any statements made which are clearly the sender's own and not
expressly made on behalf of Macmillan Publishers Limited or one of its agents.
Please note that neither Macmillan Publishers Limited nor any of its agents
accept any responsibility for viruses that may be contained in this e-mail or
its attachments and it is your responsibility to scan the e-mail and
attachments (if any). No contracts may be concluded on behalf of Macmillan
Publishers Limited or its agents by means of e-mail communication. Macmillan
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Registered Office Brunel Road, Houndmills, Basingstoke RG21 6XS 
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