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Subject: RE: [soa-rm-ra] Diagramming trust - another take


Yes, ownership is definitely a state. The point was that stated goals 
are not all that literally reliable. I think reputation and the 
internal assessment that constitutes trust must use goals as usable 
intermediary formulations against which the assessment or perception 
takes place. We take stated goals as a form of code, such as you 
related, Bob. Might be wise to imply that or else say it explicitly.

Cheers,
Rex

At 8:46 AM -0500 4/6/09, Ellinger, Robert S (IS) wrote:
>Again, isn't ownership a state, not an action.  When I own a house I can
>decide who is allowed in and who isn't.  The boundary, in our culture
>starts either at the door for a condo or the property line for a house.
>But I can demolish the house and plant corn or flowers...what happens to
>the house I decide (governance...every man's house is his castle????).
>Likewise, with services, if I own it, I can decide (govern) who uses it
>and for what purpose.  I can stop offering the service, I can offer it
>free, or conditionally--my decision.  However, once I rent our my house
>or allow organizations to use my service, I now have obligations that
>are implies or explicitly stated in the "contract."  And the T&Cs of
>that contract had better match my policies, or I am SOL.
>
>PS--My experience going through 5 or 6 mergers is that there is no such
>thing...all of them have been acquisitions and as soon as the
>acquisition has taken place, the baby is thrown out with the bath water,
>keeping only those few parts for which the acquisition was made...this
>is the only way large companies, otherwise on the going out of business
>curve avoid going out of business.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Rex Brooks [mailto:rexb@starbourne.com]
>Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 9:24 AM
>To: Rex Brooks; Ellinger, Robert S (IS); Ken Laskey; James Odell
>Cc: David E. Ellis; Francis McCabe; soa-rm-ra@lists.oasis-open.org
>Subject: RE: [soa-rm-ra] Diagramming trust - another take
>
>Of course the thing owned has boundaries that the owner in concert with
>social facts establishes. I don't think it much matters what the goal is
>or is not. CA bought Platinum Technologies. Said that they wanted to
>incorporate it in their offerings and did not carry through on that.
>(What a surprise!).
>
>H-P bought Compaq and the same thing happened. The point is that stated
>goals are not necessarily true.
>
>RWE: The competitor was effectively eliminated. Wonder what'll happen if
>IBM is allowed to buy Sun? Whatever happens will likely be in what IBM
>collectively and managerially decides is in its interest, not the
>public's or the economy's interests, but we will be affected,
>regardless.
>
>Cheers,
>Rex
>
>At 6:14 AM -0700 4/6/09, Rex Brooks wrote:
>>Its not the boundary of the house, Bob,
>>
>>Its the boundary of the owner. You still own the house even if you are
>>on vacation on the other side of the world, and if you haven't invested
>
>>in adequate security, the boundary stays with you while a group of
>>burglars slips in ... just kidding! ;-)
>>
>>Cheers,
>>Rex
>>
>>At 7:39 AM -0500 4/6/09, Ellinger, Robert S (IS) wrote:
>>>Ken:
>>>
>>>I opened the first diagram and was immediately confused.  When I "own"
>
>>>a house I have neither goals or constraints (other than paying the
>>>taxes on the place) so how does the diagram define the boundary of my
>house?
>>>
>>>Bob
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: Ken Laskey [mailto:klaskey@mitre.org]
>>>Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 12:06 AM
>>>To: James Odell
>>>Cc: David E. Ellis; Francis McCabe; soa-rm-ra@lists.oasis-open.org
>>>Subject: [soa-rm-ra] Diagramming trust - another take
>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>After another long talk with Dave Ellis, I am again inspired to try to
>
>>>express some ideas, and this time I come with definitions and
>diagrams.
>>>
>>>Goal: a desired set of real world effects
>>>
>>>Goal may be that the real world effects are realized, avoided, or some
>
>>>combination.
>>>
>>>Constraint: a specified set of real world effects that an actor is
>>>     (1) limited from pursuing or being responsible for indirectly
>>>causing, or
>>>     (2) responsible for pursuing
>>>
>>>Ownership Boundary: the extent of an identifiable set of actors
>>>sharing a common set of goals and constraints, and other common
>>>entities through which the goals and constraints can be expressed.
>>>
>>>A given actor may reside within one or more ownership boundaries.
>>>There may be agreed upon protocols for interactions that cross
>>>ownership boundaries or an actor crossing an ownership boundary may
>>>independently need to resolve any mismatches.
>>>
>>>Reputation: a property of a given actor assigned by other actors based
>
>>>on the accumulated experience experience of the other actors on the
>>>extent to which real world effects resulting from interaction with the
>
>>>given actor are assessed as desirable, neutral, or undesirable.
>>>
>>>Other definitions are needed but I was concentrating on the diagrams
>>>that follow.
>>>
>>>
>>>---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>>
>>
>>--
>>Rex Brooks
>>President, CEO
>>Starbourne Communications Design
>>GeoAddress: 1361-A Addison
>>Berkeley, CA 94702
>>Tel: 510-898-0670
>>
>>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>To unsubscribe from this mail list, you must leave the OASIS TC that
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>
>
>--
>Rex Brooks
>President, CEO
>Starbourne Communications Design
>GeoAddress: 1361-A Addison
>Berkeley, CA 94702
>Tel: 510-898-0670


-- 
Rex Brooks
President, CEO
Starbourne Communications Design
GeoAddress: 1361-A Addison
Berkeley, CA 94702
Tel: 510-898-0670


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