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Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Architectural Scope of Reference Model


+1 - good point.  811 g is another example.  Of course, I making 
assumptions about what SOA is again ;-)

Duane

Ruiz, Michael E. (US SSA) wrote:

> Joseph
>
>  
>
> It seems to me that MOM (message oriented middleware) would be 
> specific to a particular implementation.  If one considers Bluetooth 
> to be a specific implementation of a SOA then one might have to 
> concede that MOM would not be part of the implementation. 
>  Irrespective the MOM is to concrete for a reference model.  The 
> reference model should not be concerned with the specific 
> communication pattern but the pattern of interaction between the model 
> constructs.
>
>  
>
> /r
>
> Michael Ruiz
>
> 703-668-4243
>
> 703-785-9503
>
>  
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> From: Chiusano Joseph [mailto:chiusano_joseph@bah.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 2:03 PM
> To: Schuldt, Ron L; Duane Nickull; Thomas Erl
> Cc: soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: RE: [soa-rm] Architectural Scope of Reference Model
>
>  
>
> +1
>
>  
>
> I believe a communications specification (or however we term it) is 
> key. When implemented, this may be a MOM capability/product (for example).
>
>  
>
> Kind Regards,
>
> Joseph Chiusano
>
> Booz Allen Hamilton
>
> Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com <http://www.boozallen.com/>
>
>  
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> From: Schuldt, Ron L [mailto:ron.l.schuldt@lmco.com]
> Sent: Wed 3/30/2005 10:19 AM
> To: Duane Nickull; Thomas Erl
> Cc: soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: RE: [soa-rm] Architectural Scope of Reference Model
>
> Team,
>
> I agree in principle with Thomas and Duane. For the reference model, I 
> agree that we should not be defining messages. Message design is 
> clearly an implementation architecture artifact.
>
> However, is any SOA possible if there are no communications? I can't 
> think of any example and I'm not saying one doesn't exist. If no 
> example exists, then don't we need a communications element in the 
> reference model? If so, then there would be a need for an artifact 
> called a communications specification - although the reference model 
> would not define the content of a communications specification.
>
> Ron
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Duane Nickull [mailto:dnickull@adobe.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 7:45 AM
> To: Thomas Erl
> Cc: soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org
> Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Architectural Scope of Reference Model
>
>
> Thomas:
>
> Thank you for this very elegant summary!
>
> I think the answer may be in the definition of a "reference model" vs.
> "architecture".  I think case studies will help clear up this
> confusion.  A reference model will normally not contain "messages" as a
> component.
>
> 1. Please look at the OSI Reference model.  This is a communication
> stack yet it does not contain messages:
> http://www.scit.wlv.ac.uk/~jphb/comms/std.7layer.html 
> <http://www.scit.wlv.ac.uk/%7Ejphb/comms/std.7layer.html>
>
> This does not contain any "message" although messages will occur in
> implementations using the reference model
>
> 2. The ITA Reference Model likewise does not have "messages":
> http://www.ewita.com/earlywork/itarefr.htm
>
> 3. RCS Reference Model
> http://www.isd.mel.nist.gov/documents/messina/euro_cast.pdf
>
> Again - no messages even though there is an element marked
> "Communications" in figure one. 
>
> The reference Model should not contain "messages" as a component.  That
> belongs in architecture or implementations based on the reference
> model.  I have never encountered one reference model with concrete terms
> in it.  If it had such, it would not be abstract.
>
> We must think abstract, not concrete.
>
> Duane Nickull
>
>
>
>
>
> Thomas Erl wrote:
>
>> Some thoughts regarding the on-going discussion of whether a message
>> element should be part of our reference model:
>> 
>> As per our chosen definition of architecture, in order to describe
>> service-oriented architecture we need to:
>> 1. Define elements that comprise the structure of a system.
>> 2. Define external properties of these elements.
>> 3. Define relationships between these elements.
>> 4. Define the overall structure of the system.
>> (not necessarily in this order)
>> 
>> Starting with the first point, different element collections have been
>> proposed in the two position papers submitted so far. As has been
>> discussed, the MacKenzie/Nickull paper does not identify a message
>> element, whereas Kohring's does.
>> 
>> A related difference I noticed when reviewing these papers is that
>> Kohring's establishes a broader range of SOA elements. Specifically,
>> both service provider and requestor (consumer) roles are separately
>> identified and described. As mentioned in item #3 above, we are
>> required to define the relationship between the elements we define.
>> Therefore, it makes sense that this paper includes a separate element
>> (message) that can be used to help describe the relationship between a
>> service and its requestor.
>> 
>> The elements identified in the MacKenzie/Nickull paper are:
>> - Service
>> - Service Description
>> - A form of advertisement to facilitate discoverability.
>> - Service Contract
>> - Data Model
>> These elements form a narrower architectural scope, leading to a
>> proposed architecture that revolves primarily around the service (or a
>> service assuming the provider role). Because a service requestor is
>> not explicitly identified as a separate element, it makes sense that
>> an element representing some unit of communication (message or
>> otherwise) is also not identified. Within this model's scope, the
>> definition of a relationship between a service and its requestor
>> (beyond details implied by description, contract, data model, and
>> advertisement elements) is not a requirement.
>> 
>> I believe that in order to address the issue of whether a message is a
>> legitimate element within the reference model, we should begin
>> by clearly defining the scope of our abstract architecture. Given that
>> we are establishing core elements that are expected to be present in
>> all forms of SOA, this raises the question: Does an architecture
>> require the presence of both a service provider and a service
>> requestor (the coffee shop and the patron) in order to be classified
>> "service-oriented"? If yes, we must define this relationship. To
>> properly do so, we very well may need to further identify and define a
>> separate element to represent an abstract unit of communication passed
>> between them.  
>> 
>> Thomas
>> 
>> 
>
>
> --
> ***********
> Senior Standards Strategist - Adobe Systems, Inc. - http://www.adobe.com
> Vice Chair - UN/CEFACT Bureau Plenary - http://www.unece.org/cefact/
> Adobe Enterprise Developer Resources  - 
> http://www.adobe.com/enterprise/developer/main.html
> ***********
>

-- 
***********
Senior Standards Strategist - Adobe Systems, Inc. - http://www.adobe.com
Vice Chair - UN/CEFACT Bureau Plenary - http://www.unece.org/cefact/
Adobe Enterprise Developer Resources  - http://www.adobe.com/enterprise/developer/main.html
***********



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