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Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Groups - Generic SOA-RM BootCamp(SOAReferenceModel-Generic-rev1_05-03.ppt) uploaded
Martin: Thank you. Regardless of the definition, are you amend able to simply referring to the undefined concept as "process management" rather than scoping it exclusively for the domain of business? Process management would include all types of process, not just eBusiness related. If so, can I ask you to add a term for both of these and first definitions to the WIKI? Duane Smith, Martin wrote: >Duane - - > >Thanks for the response. > >What I meant by "distributed" is adequately captured by your paraphrased >definition. This could mean separate computers on a LAN, but the more >interesting case is applications running across the Internet. Not only >does the Internet involve different systems, but also different >management domains. Dealing with different management domains is an >important part of the core problem SOA is trying to address. In fact, >the move to the Internet as the typical implementation environment seems >to be the reason that our terminology evolved from "component-based >architecture" to "services-oriented architecture." > >Regarding BPM or process management, I'm not that fond of the >Google-sources definition you came up with. In the framework of >distributed apps, BPM plays the role of business logic connecting large >chunks of encapsulated functionality (the services). I suppose it's >possible to have a useful single-service app, but surely in the general >case we're connecting multiple services somehow . . . (And again, I >think we need to scope the RM to cover the common cases, not the minimum >case excluding optional elements.) > >Thanks, > >Martin > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Duane Nickull [mailto:dnickull@adobe.com] >Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2005 12:37 PM >To: Smith, Martin >Cc: >Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Groups - Generic SOA-RM Boot >Camp(SOAReferenceModel-Generic-rev1_05-03.ppt) uploaded > >Martin: > >These are good points we need to understand. Can I ask for >clarification on a few points. > >(1) What is your definition of "distributed"? This will probably be >important to reach consensus on in our TC. I googled "define: >distributed system" and found these definitions: >http://www.google.com/search?q=define%3A+distributed+system&btnG=Google+ >Search > >Paraphrased: Distributed System: an aggregation of functionality from >several computing entities to collaboratively run a computational task >in a transparent and coherent way, so that they appear as a single, >centralized system. > >Some of the definitions talked specifically about being distributed on a > >network (not good for RM). The physical separation aspect is not >something I am clear about WRT being distributed. Can a chip >hyperthread two processes and aggregate those at a higher level to >appear as an opaque computational task? Perhaps distributed means >logical separation? Not sure. > >(2) Even though we have not made a decision WRT BPM in the RM, do you >think we could use a more abstract term for it such as "Management" or >"Process Management"? This is primarily in recognition of the fact that > >not all SOA's are built for businesses. The concept can be added to our > >glossary and will need to be defined. I also used google to find some >starter suggestions. I paraphrased several as: > >Process Management "..a multi-layered approach to the orchestration of >lower activities, which produces a result for a given customer at a >higher level." > >Would this work for folks? Comments? > >Duane > > >Smith, Martin wrote: > > > >>Duane - - >> >>This a a good sort of thing to have available - - sort of a graphical >> >> >FAQ. Thanks. > > >>Couple of substantive comments: >>(1) I think many of us are scoping the work too narrowly: a "services >> >> >RM" does not solve what I (at least) need, which is a "services-oriented >distributed application" reference model. I had always assumed that when >people said "SOA" they meant the latter. This draft seems to define the >former. > > >>(2) I don't think the RM should necessarily be limited to elements >> >> >that are mandatory in all implementations. You suggest a formulation >that avoids this for security (i.e, null security policy is a security >policy); Rebecka used a similar device in observing that all mechanisms >in a software environment can be defined as services and therefore we >might not need to include any particular "SOA infrastructure" services >separately in our RM. I would prefer to be explicit in getting a >maximum set of elements on the table (BPM for example) and then coming >back later to refactor or simplify the model. Otherwise we may end up >with an elegantly simple but trivial product, meaning one that does not >provide any useful guidance to architects. > > >>Martin >> >> >>________________________________ >> >>From: dnickull@adobe.com [mailto:dnickull@adobe.com] >>Sent: Fri 4/15/2005 4:29 PM >>To: soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org >>Subject: [soa-rm] Groups - Generic SOA-RM Boot Camp >> >> >(SOAReferenceModel-Generic-rev1_05-03.ppt) uploaded > > >> >>This is a draft submission to help orient new members as they join. >> >> >Please > > >>review and comment on. Want to ensure that we are in basic agreement >> >> >on > > >>these items. >> >>-- Duane Nickull >> >>The document revision named Generic SOA-RM Boot Camp >>(SOAReferenceModel-Generic-rev1_05-03.ppt) has been submitted by Duane >>Nickull to the OASIS SOA Reference Model TC document repository. This >>document is revision #1 of SOAReferenceModel-Generic-rev1_05-03.ppt. >> >>Document Description: >>A draft presentation for orienting new members. >> >>View Document Details: >>http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/soa-rm/document.php?docume >> >> >nt_id=12276 > > >>Download Document: >>http://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/soa-rm/download.php/12276/ >> >> >SOAReferenceModel-Generic-rev1_05-03.ppt > > >>Revision: >>This document is revision #1 of >> >> >SOAReferenceModel-Generic-rev1_05-03.ppt. > > >>The document details page referenced above will show the complete >> >> >revision > > >>history. >> >> >>PLEASE NOTE: If the above links do not work for you, your email >> >> >application > > >>may be breaking the link into two pieces. You may be able to copy and >> >> >paste > > >>the entire link address into the address field of your web browser. >> >>-OASIS Open Administration >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > -- *********** Senior Standards Strategist - Adobe Systems, Inc. - http://www.adobe.com Vice Chair - UN/CEFACT Bureau Plenary - http://www.unece.org/cefact/ Adobe Enterprise Developer Resources - http://www.adobe.com/enterprise/developer/main.html ***********
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