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"Mediation is the missing piece of the jigsaw. Simply put, it involves = the transformation, routing, validation and processing of messages, = which in turn enables differences in information models between web = service providers and users to be accounted for and overcome when = creating applications. This is essential when integrating newly defined = web services with existing infrastructure." =20 [1] <http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/6977> = http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/6977 [2] = http://www.looselycoupled.com/sub/print.php?dir=3Dopinion&name=3Dbradl-sa= ve-infr1206&year=3D2004 = <http://www.looselycoupled.com/sub/print.php?dir=3Dopinion&name=3Dbradl-s= ave-infr1206&year=3D2004>=20 =20 Joe =20 Joseph Chiusano Booz Allen Hamilton Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com <http://www.boozallen.com>=20 =20 =20 ________________________________ From: Duane Nickull [mailto:dnickull@adobe.com] Sent: Tue 5/10/2005 1:09 PM Cc: SOA-RM Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing an XML Data Model = In Your SOA - Best Practices" Ken: I would like to explore the notion of "mediation" service. Is it actually mediating? XSLT is declarative and very deterministic. You have a tree model of your entire document, then XSLT processors read an instruction and test the case against the input tree. If the condition matches, then it does the second part of the declaration (usually to write out to a new tree model). It seems to be reduced to a simply set of decision points. Duane Ken Laskey wrote: > Joe, > > I see there being two sets of vocabularies (data models?) in our SOA > discussion. The first is the vocabulary relevant to describing a SOA. > We are developing/collecting that as part of the RM and that will > hopefully facilitate the discussion of SOA by others. The second set > is the domain vocabularies of the various SOA users. These > vocabularies are specific to specific domains of discourse. These > overlap (otherwise, there would be no need for interaction) and is the > focus of most integration efforts. It is for the second set that the > idea of an interchange/compromise/hub-and-spoke/... vocabulary is > introduced to mediate the exchange of information within a consistent > semantic framework. I am interpreting the term "canonical" to refer to > that interchange vocabulary. While this is a standard approach, I > contend it is limited and does not scale. Thus, I'm saying the RM may > include the concept of a mediation service to facilitate information > interchange across vocabularies. If the situation is simple enough > that the interchange vocabulary is sufficient, then this is the > implementation of the mediation service used. (It could be a single > hardwired translation or a more general service that, for example, > processes any XSLT input.) However, the idea of a mediation service > does not codify the use of a canonical vocabulary as the means to > accomplish this functionality. > > I could not figure out how to reference the presentation I gave at the > recent OASIS Symposium (is there a way to find past presentations on > the OASIS Web site?) so I uploaded it to the Member Submission area of > the TC. Please see slide 4. > > If I am misinterpreting what you mean by a canonical data model, > please clarify. > > Ken > > > > On May 9, 2005, at 9:06 PM, Chiusano Joseph wrote: > > Please help me understand the difference between the concept of > canonical data model in the link provided earlier in the thread > below, and what we need to define. I'm very sorry that I am not > understanding here. What is the gap? (yes, I know it's a clothing > store;) > =20 > Joe > =20 > Joseph Chiusano > Booz Allen Hamilton > Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com > =20 > > > From: Ken Laskey [mailto:klaskey@mitre.org] > Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 1:22 PM > To: Chiusano Joseph; Duane Nickull > Cc: soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org > Subject: RE: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing an XML Data > Model In Your SOA - Best Practices" > > If we are basing our concept of SOA on the diagram in the link you > provide, then I object. It works in certain limited situations > but does not scale as a global solution. Even for the limited > cases, there is no extension that adequately covers how to connect > the successes of the limited cases. This does not mean you should > never use a canonical vocabulary, just know its limitations and be > prepared to keep moving on to the next level solution. > > Ken > > At 01:07 PM 5/9/2005, Chiusano Joseph wrote: > > <Quote> > If you want to come up with a "canonical" vocabulary to capture > SOA semantics as will be described in the reference model, that is > fine because it will be the SOA-RM vocabulary. Do not expect it > to provide general translation capabilities for all services. > </Quote> > > Ken, > =20 > I don't know that we would actually come up with such a SOA-RM > vocabulary - instead, I foresee the possibility of our including > the notion of a canonical data model as a component within our > specification. > =20 > Joe > =20 > > Joseph Chiusano<?xml:namespace prefix =3D o ns =3D > "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /> > > Booz Allen Hamilton > > Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com > > > From: Ken Laskey [ mailto:klaskey@mitre.org] > Sent: Mon 5/9/2005 12:57 PM > To: Duane Nickull > Cc: soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org > Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing an XML Data > Model In Your SOA - Best Practices" > > > I'll go back to my comments on 5/6 re Good Recent SOA Piece: > > <recap> > The critical line in this article is > > This article does not discuss how to integrate data models. > > Its premise is the tried (and usually failed) that if we all get > into a > room and be reasonable we can all find a common vocabulary to map > to. I > could go on about when that works and when that doesn't (see my = OASIS > Symposium presentation for more) but if that is the basis of SOA, > then it > will go no further than any other integration paradigm. The = driving > question is how do you create a system (service?) to do semantic > negotiation between diverse vocabularies in a way that is (1) > visible, (2) > reusable, and (3) allows you to use what you know (or can find) in > ways > that enables you to do more with little or no effort. > > The SOA RM will not specify how this is done but it must also not > codify an > interchange vocabulary paradigm that will not scale. > > End of rant:-) > </recap> > > If you want to come up with a "canonical" vocabulary to capture = SOA > semantics as will be described in the reference model, that is > fine because > it will be the SOA-RM vocabulary. Do not expect it to provide > general > translation capabilities for all services. > > Being trained as a fluid mechanics engineer, I see this as the > classic > nozzle where things funnel down from one large plenum to a minimum > flow > passage and then expands into a second large plenum. The problem > is the > minimum flow can be a choke point. It works the same way with > vocabulary > translation. > > Ken > > > At 12:38 PM 5/9/2005, Duane Nickull wrote: > >Perhaps you are correct sir!! > > > >What do others think? > > > >Duane > > > > > > > > > >Chiusano Joseph wrote: > > > >>Isn't the notion of a "data model" too general for our purposes? > >>Shouldn't we be thinking in terms of a *canonical* data > model[1]? If > >>that is not what is needed, please give specifics as to why = (i.e. I > >>think that "we don't need a data model" is too general a > statement). > >> > >>Thanks, > >>Joe > >> > >>[1] http://www.eaipatterns.com/CanonicalDataModel.html > >> > >>Kind Regards, > >>Joseph Chiusano > >>Booz Allen Hamilton > >>Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com > >> > >> > >> > >>>-----Original Message----- > >>>From: John Harby [mailto:jharby@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, May > 06, 2005 > >>>1:13 PM > >>>To: soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org > >>>Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing an XML > Data Model > >>>In Your SOA - Best Practices" > >>> > >>>IMHO, SOA should really be defined independent of data model = and a > >>>general definition of SOA should support any strategy > employable by data > >>>tiers. Defining the notion of data model really seems out of > scope to me. > >>> > >>>On 5/6/05, Chiusano Joseph <chiusano_joseph@bah.com> wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>>>These are very interesting thoughts - I like the term "SOA > data model". > >>>>Can you please clarify further what the difference > >>>between a "SOA data model" > >>> > >>> > >>>>and a "canonical data model" would be? (since I believe "SOA = data > >>>>model" may now be a newly coined term) > >>>>Joe > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Joseph Chiusano > >>>> > >>>>Booz Allen Hamilton > >>>> > >>>>Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com > >>>> > >>>>________________________________ > >>>>From: Vikas Deolaliker [mailto:vikas@sonoasystems.com ] > >>>>Sent: Fri 5/6/2005 12:37 PM > >>>>To: Chiusano Joseph; 'Frank McCabe'; 'Ken Laskey' > >>>>Cc: soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org > >>>>Subject: RE: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing an XML > Data > >>>>Model In Your SOA - Best Practices" > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>The problem with "canonical data model" is that it does not > >>>scale with time. > >>> > >>> > >>>>Eventually it will not canonicalize but constrain the richness = of > >>>>communication that is expected among various SOA entities. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>IMHO SOA data mode should aim to define (a) the interfaces > used by SOA > >>>>entities to exchange information, (b) mechanisms to > >>>discover these > >>> > >>>>interfaces and (c) mechanisms to negotiate a vocabulary/format > for data > >>>>exchange over these discovered interfaces. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Vikas > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>________________________________ > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>From: Chiusano Joseph [ mailto:chiusano_joseph@bah.com] > >>>>Sent: Friday, May 06, 2005 9:23 AM > >>>>To: Frank McCabe; Ken Laskey > >>>>Cc: soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org > >>>>Subject: RE: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing an XML > Data > >>>>Model In Your SOA - Best Practices" > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>I think some additional context may not have been provided > below. While > >>>>the article does state "This article does not discuss how to > integrate > >>>>data models", it is stated in the context of > >>>"this article > >>> > >>>>will not get into this topic because it is either out of > >>>scope or too complex to discuss". > >>> > >>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>The author is actually a strong proponent of having an > >>>integrated data > >>> > >>>>model, as they depict an integrated data model as one of > >>>the layers of > >>> > >>>>their approach. I interpret this as a "canonical data > >>>model", which is > >>> > >>>>a special type of data model used for data exchange. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Joe > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Joseph Chiusano > >>>> > >>>>Booz Allen Hamilton > >>>> > >>>>Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>________________________________ > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>From: Frank McCabe [ mailto:frank.mccabe@us.fujitsu.com] > >>>>Sent: Fri 5/6/2005 12:03 PM > >>>>To: Ken Laskey > >>>>Cc: Chiusano Joseph; soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org > >>>>Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing an XML > Data > >>>>Model In Your SOA - Best Practices" > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>+1 > >>>>Frank > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>On May 6, 2005, at 8:45 AM, Ken Laskey wrote: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>The critical line in this article is > >>>>> > >>>>>This article does not discuss how to integrate data models. > >>>>> > >>>>>Its premise is the tried (and usually failed) that if we all > get into > >>>>>a room and be reasonable we can all find a common > >>>vocabulary to > >>> > >>>>>map to. I could go on about when that works and when > >>>that doesn't > >>> > >>>>>(see my OASIS Symposium presentation for more) but if that is > the > >>>>>basis of SOA, then it will go no further than any other > >>>integration > >>> > >>>>>paradigm. The driving question is how do you create a system > >>>>>(service?) to do semantic negotiation between diverse > >>>vocabularies > >>> > >>>>>in a way that is (1) visible, (2) reusable, and (3) allows > you to use > >>>>>what you know (or can find) in ways that enables you > >>>to do more > >>> > >>>>>with little or no effort. > >>>>> > >>>>>The SOA RM will not specify how this is done but it must also > not > >>>>>codify an interchange vocabulary paradigm that will not = scale. > >>>>> > >>>>>End of rant:-) > >>>>> > >>>>>Ken > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>On May 6, 2005, at 10:32 AM, Chiusano Joseph wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>Forwarding a good recent SOA piece[1] for those interested > in reading > >>>>>>it. Covers the notion of an integrated data model as a > foundational > >>>>>>concept; also presents a 6-layer approach to SOA (about > mid-article). > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Joe > >>>>>> > >>>>>>[1] http://www.tdan.com/i032ht02.htm > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Joseph Chiusano > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Booz Allen Hamilton > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > = >>>----------------------------------------------------------------------= > > >>> > >>> > >>>>>-------------------- > >>>>>Ken Laskey > >>>>>MITRE Corporation, M/S H305 phone: 703-983-7934 > >>>>>7515 Colshire Drive fax: > >>>>> > >>>703-983-1379 > >>> > >>> > >>>>>McLean VA 22102-7508 > >>>>> > >>>>>*** note change of phone extension from 883 to 983 effective > >>>>>4/15/2005 *** > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>On May 6, 2005, at 8:45 AM, Ken Laskey wrote: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>The critical line in this article is > >>>>> > >>>>>This article does not discuss how to integrate data models. > >>>>> > >>>>>Its premise is the tried (and usually failed) that if we all > get into > >>>>>a room and be reasonable we can all find a common > >>>vocabulary to > >>> > >>>>>map to. I could go on about when that works and when > >>>that doesn't > >>> > >>>>>(see my OASIS Symposium presentation for more) but if that is > the > >>>>>basis of SOA, then it will go no further than any other > >>>integration > >>> > >>>>>paradigm. The driving question is how do you create a system > >>>>>(service?) to do semantic negotiation between diverse > >>>vocabularies > >>> > >>>>>in a way that is (1) visible, (2) reusable, and (3) allows > you to use > >>>>>what you know (or can find) in ways that enables you > >>>to do more > >>> > >>>>>with little or no effort. > >>>>> > >>>>>The SOA RM will not specify how this is done but it must also > not > >>>>>codify an interchange vocabulary paradigm that will not = scale. > >>>>> > >>>>>End of rant:-) > >>>>> > >>>>>Ken > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>On May 6, 2005, at 10:32 AM, Chiusano Joseph wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>Forwarding a good recent SOA piece[1] for those interested > in reading > >>>>>>it. Covers the notion of an integrated data model as a > foundational > >>>>>>concept; also presents a 6-layer approach to SOA (about > mid-article). > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Joe > >>>>>> > >>>>>>[1] http://www.tdan.com/i032ht02.htm > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Joseph Chiusano > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Booz Allen Hamilton > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > = >>>----------------------------------------------------------------------= > > >>> > >>> > >>>>>-------------------- > >>>>>Ken Laskey > >>>>>MITRE Corporation, M/S H305 phone: 703-983-7934 > >>>>>7515 Colshire Drive fax: > >>>>> > >>>703-983-1379 > >>> > >>> > >>>>>McLean VA 22102-7508 > >>>>> > >>>>>*** note change of phone extension from 883 to 983 effective > >>>>>4/15/2005 *** > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > >> > >> > > > >-- > >*********** > >Senior Standards Strategist - Adobe Systems, Inc. - > http://www.adobe.com > >Chair - OASIS Service Oriented Architecture Reference Model > Technical > >Committee - > = http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/tc_home.php?wg_abbrev=3Dsoa-rm > >Vice Chair - UN/CEFACT Bureau Plenary - = http://www.unece.org/cefact/ > >Adobe Enterprise Developer Resources - > > http://www.adobe.com/enterprise/developer/main.html > >*********** > > > > -- > =20 > = -------------------------------------------------------------------------= -------- > > / Ken > Laskey = =20 > \ > | MITRE Corporation, M/S H305 phone: 703-983-7934 | > | 7515 Colshire Drive fax: =20 > 703-983-1379 | > \ McLean VA > 22102-7508 / > =20 > = -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --------- > > > *** note: phone number changed 4/15/2005 to 703-983-7934 *** > > > > > -- > =20 > = -------------------------------------------------------------------------= -------- > > / Ken > Laskey = =20 > \ > | MITRE Corporation, M/S H305 phone: 703-983-7934 | > | 7515 Colshire Drive fax: =20 > 703-983-1379 | > \ McLean VA > 22102-7508 / > =20 > = -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --------- > > > *** note: phone number changed 4/15/2005 to 703-983-7934 *** > > = -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----------------- > > Ken Laskey > MITRE Corporation, M/S H305 phone: 703-983-7934 > 7515 Colshire Drive fax: 703-983-1379 > McLean VA 22102-7508 > > *** note change of phone extension from 883 to 983 effective 4/15/2005 > *** > -- *********** Senior Standards Strategist - Adobe Systems, Inc. - http://www.adobe.com Chair - OASIS Service Oriented Architecture Reference Model Technical = Committee - http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/tc_home.php?wg_abbrev=3Dsoa-rm Vice Chair - UN/CEFACT Bureau Plenary - http://www.unece.org/cefact/ Adobe Enterprise Developer Resources - = http://www.adobe.com/enterprise/developer/main.html *********** ------_=_NextPart_001_01C55586.06BE013A Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; = charset=3Diso-8859-1">=0A= <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">=0A= <HTML>=0A= <HEAD>=0A= =0A= <META NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server version = 6.5.7226.0">=0A= <TITLE>Re: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing an XML Data = Model In Your SOA - Best Practices"</TITLE>=0A= </HEAD>=0A= <BODY>=0A= <DIV id=3DidOWAReplyText47139 dir=3Dltr>=0A= <DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Regarding = "what is =0A= mediation?": I realize that these[1][2] are not authoritative sources, = but at =0A= least they provide 2 perspectives of what "mediation" means. Both seem = to =0A= support the notion that transformation (such as XSLT transformation) is = part of =0A= mediation. Would like to hear additional views within our TC as =0A= well.</FONT></DIV>=0A= <DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>=0A= <DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>From [2]:</FONT></DIV>=0A= <DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial><FONT size=3D2>=0A= <P style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN> </P>=0A= <P style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">"Mediation is the missing = piece of =0A= the jigsaw. Simply put, it involves the transformation, routing, = validation and =0A= processing of messages, which in turn enables differences in information = models =0A= between web service providers and users to be accounted for and overcome = when =0A= creating applications. This is essential when integrating newly defined = web =0A= services with existing infrastructure."</SPAN><?xml:namespace prefix =3D = o ns =3D =0A= "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p></P>=0A= <P style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN> </P><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">=0A= <P style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">[1] = </SPAN><SPAN =0A= style=3D"COLOR: black"><A =0A= href=3D"http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/6977";></A></SPAN><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><A =0A= href=3D"http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/6977";>http://www.oreillynet.com= /pub/wlg/6977</A></SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>=0A= <P style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">[2] </SPAN><A =0A= href=3D"http://www.looselycoupled.com/sub/print.php?dir=3Dopinion&nam= e=3Dbradl-save-infr1206&year=3D2004"><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: = Arial">http://www.looselycoupled.com/sub/print.php?dir=3Dopinion&name= =3Dbradl-save-infr1206&year=3D2004</SPAN></A></P>=0A= <P style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><o:p></o:p> </P></SPAN>=0A= <P style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Joe</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>=0A= <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN> </P>=0A= <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Joseph =0A= Chiusano</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>=0A= <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Booz Allen =0A= Hamilton</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>=0A= <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Visit us online@ </SPAN><A =0A= title=3Dhttp://www.boozallen.com/ href=3D"http://www.boozallen.com"; =0A= target=3D_blank><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: = Arial">http://www.boozallen.com</SPAN></A><o:p></o:p></P>=0A= <P style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN =0A= style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: = Arial"></SPAN> </P>=0A= <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><FONT size=3D3><FONT =0A= face=3D"Times New Roman"> <o:p></o:p></FONT></FONT></P>=0A= <DIV></DIV>=0A= <P></FONT></FONT><BR>=0A= <HR tabIndex=3D-1>=0A= <FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> Duane Nickull =0A= [mailto:dnickull@adobe.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tue 5/10/2005 1:09 = PM<BR><B>Cc:</B> =0A= SOA-RM<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing = an XML =0A= Data Model In Your SOA - Best Practices"<BR></FONT><BR></P></DIV></DIV>=0A= <DIV>=0A= <P><FONT size=3D2>Ken:<BR><BR>I would like to explore the notion of = "mediation" =0A= service. Is it<BR>actually mediating? XSLT is declarative = and very =0A= deterministic. You<BR>have a tree model of your entire document, = then XSLT =0A= processors read an<BR>instruction and test the case against the input =0A= tree. If the condition<BR>matches, then it does the second part of = the =0A= declaration (usually to<BR>write out to a new tree model). It = seems to be =0A= reduced to a simply set<BR>of decision points.<BR><BR>Duane<BR><BR>Ken = Laskey =0A= wrote:<BR><BR>> Joe,<BR>><BR>> I see there being two sets of =0A= vocabularies (data models?) in our SOA<BR>> discussion. The first is = the =0A= vocabulary relevant to describing a SOA.<BR>> We are = developing/collecting =0A= that as part of the RM and that will<BR>> hopefully facilitate the = discussion =0A= of SOA by others. The second set<BR>> is the domain vocabularies of = the =0A= various SOA users. These<BR>> vocabularies are specific to specific = domains =0A= of discourse. These<BR>> overlap (otherwise, there would be no need = for =0A= interaction) and is the<BR>> focus of most integration efforts. It is = for the =0A= second set that the<BR>> idea of an = interchange/compromise/hub-and-spoke/... =0A= vocabulary is<BR>> introduced to mediate the exchange of information = within a =0A= consistent<BR>> semantic framework. I am interpreting the term = "canonical" to =0A= refer to<BR>> that interchange vocabulary. While this is a standard = approach, =0A= I<BR>> contend it is limited and does not scale. Thus, I'm saying the = RM =0A= may<BR>> include the concept of a mediation service to facilitate =0A= information<BR>> interchange across vocabularies. If the situation is = simple =0A= enough<BR>> that the interchange vocabulary is sufficient, then this = is =0A= the<BR>> implementation of the mediation service used. (It could be a =0A= single<BR>> hardwired translation or a more general service that, for =0A= example,<BR>> processes any XSLT input.) However, the idea of a = mediation =0A= service<BR>> does not codify the use of a canonical vocabulary as the = means =0A= to<BR>> accomplish this functionality.<BR>><BR>> I could not = figure out =0A= how to reference the presentation I gave at the<BR>> recent OASIS = Symposium =0A= (is there a way to find past presentations on<BR>> the OASIS Web = site?) so I =0A= uploaded it to the Member Submission area of<BR>> the TC. Please see = slide =0A= 4.<BR>><BR>> If I am misinterpreting what you mean by a canonical = data =0A= model,<BR>> please clarify.<BR>><BR>> =0A= Ken<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>> On May 9, 2005, at 9:06 PM, Chiusano = Joseph =0A= wrote:<BR>><BR>> Please help me understand = the =0A= difference between the concept of<BR>> = canonical data =0A= model in the link provided earlier in the = thread<BR>> =0A= below, and what we need to define. I'm very sorry that I am =0A= not<BR>> understanding here. What is the gap? = (yes, I =0A= know it's a clothing<BR>> =0A= store;)<BR>> <BR>> &n= bsp; =0A= Joe<BR>> <BR>> = Joseph =0A= Chiusano<BR>> Booz Allen =0A= Hamilton<BR>> Visit us online@ <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.boozallen.com";>http://www.boozallen.com</A><BR>>&nb= sp; <BR>><BR>><BR>> &nbs= p; =0A= From: Ken Laskey [<A =0A= href=3D"mailto:klaskey@mitre.org";>mailto:klaskey@mitre.org</A>]<BR>>&n= bsp; =0A= Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 1:22 PM<BR>> To: = Chiusano =0A= Joseph; Duane Nickull<BR>> Cc: =0A= soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org<BR>> Subject: RE: =0A= [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing an XML =0A= Data<BR>> Model In Your SOA - Best =0A= Practices"<BR>><BR>> If we are basing our = concept =0A= of SOA on the diagram in the link you<BR>> = provide, =0A= then I object. It works in certain limited =0A= situations<BR>> but does not scale as a = global =0A= solution. Even for the limited<BR>> = cases, =0A= there is no extension that adequately covers how to =0A= connect<BR>> the successes of the limited =0A= cases. This does not mean you = should<BR>> never =0A= use a canonical vocabulary, just know its limitations and =0A= be<BR>> prepared to keep moving on to the = next level =0A= solution.<BR>><BR>> =0A= Ken<BR>><BR>> At 01:07 PM 5/9/2005, = Chiusano =0A= Joseph wrote:<BR>><BR>> =0A= <Quote><BR>> If you want to come up = with a =0A= "canonical" vocabulary to capture<BR>> SOA = semantics =0A= as will be described in the reference model, that =0A= is<BR>> fine because it will be the SOA-RM =0A= vocabulary. Do not expect it<BR>> to = provide =0A= general translation capabilities for all =0A= services.<BR>> =0A= </Quote><BR>><BR>> =0A= Ken,<BR>> <BR>>  = ; I =0A= don't know that we would actually come up with such a =0A= SOA-RM<BR>> vocabulary - instead, I foresee = the =0A= possibility of our including<BR>> the notion = of a =0A= canonical data model as a component within = our<BR>> =0A= specification.<BR>> <BR>> &= nbsp; =0A= Joe<BR>> <BR>><BR>> &nbs= p; =0A= Joseph Chiusano<?xml:namespace prefix =3D o ns =0A= =3D<BR>> = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" =0A= /><BR>><BR>> Booz Allen =0A= Hamilton<BR>><BR>> Visit us online@ <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.boozallen.com";>http://www.boozallen.com</A><BR>><BR= >><BR>> =0A= From: Ken Laskey [ <A =0A= href=3D"mailto:klaskey@mitre.org";>mailto:klaskey@mitre.org</A>]<BR>>&n= bsp; =0A= Sent: Mon 5/9/2005 12:57 PM<BR>> To: Duane =0A= Nickull<BR>> Cc: =0A= soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org<BR>> Subject: Re: =0A= [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing an XML =0A= Data<BR>> Model In Your SOA - Best =0A= Practices"<BR>><BR>><BR>> I'll go back = to my =0A= comments on 5/6 re Good Recent SOA =0A= Piece:<BR>><BR>> =0A= <recap><BR>> The critical line in this = article =0A= is<BR>><BR>> This article does not discuss = how to =0A= integrate data models.<BR>><BR>> Its = premise is =0A= the tried (and usually failed) that if we all =0A= get<BR>> into = a<BR>> room =0A= and be reasonable we can all find a common vocabulary to =0A= map<BR>> to. = I<BR>> =0A= could go on about when that works and when that doesn't (see my =0A= OASIS<BR>> Symposium presentation for more) = but if =0A= that is the basis of SOA,<BR>> then =0A= it<BR>> will go no further than any other = integration =0A= paradigm. The driving<BR>> question is how do = you =0A= create a system (service?) to do = semantic<BR>> =0A= negotiation between diverse vocabularies in a way that is =0A= (1)<BR>> visible, = (2)<BR>> =0A= reusable, and (3) allows you to use what you know (or can find) =0A= in<BR>> ways<BR>> = that =0A= enables you to do more with little or no =0A= effort.<BR>><BR>> The SOA RM will not = specify how =0A= this is done but it must also not<BR>> codify =0A= an<BR>> interchange vocabulary paradigm that = will not =0A= scale.<BR>><BR>> End of =0A= rant:-)<BR>> =0A= </recap><BR>><BR>> If you want to = come up =0A= with a "canonical" vocabulary to capture = SOA<BR>> =0A= semantics as will be described in the reference model, that =0A= is<BR>> fine = because<BR>> =0A= it will be the SOA-RM vocabulary. Do not expect it to =0A= provide<BR>> = general<BR>> =0A= translation capabilities for all =0A= services.<BR>><BR>> Being trained as a = fluid =0A= mechanics engineer, I see this as the<BR>> =0A= classic<BR>> nozzle where things funnel down = from one =0A= large plenum to a minimum<BR>> =0A= flow<BR>> passage and then expands into a = second =0A= large plenum. The problem<BR>> is =0A= the<BR>> minimum flow can be a choke = point. It =0A= works the same way with<BR>> =0A= vocabulary<BR>> =0A= translation.<BR>><BR>> =0A= Ken<BR>><BR>><BR>> At 12:38 PM = 5/9/2005, Duane =0A= Nickull wrote:<BR>> >Perhaps you are = correct =0A= sir!!<BR>> = ><BR>> =0A= >What do others think?<BR>> =0A= ><BR>> = >Duane<BR>> =0A= ><BR>> = ><BR>> =0A= ><BR>> = ><BR>> =0A= >Chiusano Joseph wrote:<BR>> =0A= ><BR>> >>Isn't the notion of a "data = model" =0A= too general for our purposes?<BR>> = >>Shouldn't =0A= we be thinking in terms of a *canonical* = data<BR>> =0A= model[1]? If<BR>> >>that is not what is = needed, =0A= please give specifics as to why (i.e. I<BR>> =0A= >>think that "we don't need a data model" is too general =0A= a<BR>> = statement).<BR>> =0A= >><BR>> =0A= >>Thanks,<BR>> =0A= >>Joe<BR>> =0A= >><BR>> >>[1] <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.eaipatterns.com/CanonicalDataModel.html";>http://www.ea= ipatterns.com/CanonicalDataModel.html</A><BR>> = =0A= >><BR>> >>Kind =0A= Regards,<BR>> >>Joseph =0A= Chiusano<BR>> >>Booz Allen =0A= Hamilton<BR>> >>Visit us online@ <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.boozallen.com";>http://www.boozallen.com</A><BR>>&nb= sp; =0A= >><BR>> =0A= >><BR>> =0A= >><BR>> >>>-----Original =0A= Message-----<BR>> >>>From: John = Harby [<A =0A= href=3D"mailto:jharby@gmail.com";>mailto:jharby@gmail.com</A>] Sent: = Friday, =0A= May<BR>> 06, = 2005<BR>> =0A= >>>1:13 PM<BR>> >>>To: =0A= soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org<BR>> = >>>Subject: =0A= Re: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing an =0A= XML<BR>> Data = Model<BR>> =0A= >>>In Your SOA - Best = Practices"<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>IMHO, SOA = should really =0A= be defined independent of data model and = a<BR>> =0A= >>>general definition of SOA should support any =0A= strategy<BR>> employable by =0A= data<BR>> >>>tiers. Defining the = notion of =0A= data model really seems out of<BR>> scope to =0A= me.<BR>> = >>><BR>> =0A= >>>On 5/6/05, Chiusano Joseph <chiusano_joseph@bah.com> =0A= wrote:<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>These are = very =0A= interesting thoughts - I like the term = "SOA<BR>> data =0A= model".<BR>> >>>>Can you please = clarify =0A= further what the difference<BR>> = >>>between =0A= a "SOA data model"<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>and a = "canonical =0A= data model" would be? (since I believe "SOA = data<BR>> =0A= >>>>model" may now be a newly coined =0A= term)<BR>> =0A= >>>>Joe<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>Joseph =0A= Chiusano<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>Booz = Allen =0A= Hamilton<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>Visit = us =0A= online@ <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.boozallen.com";>http://www.boozallen.com</A><BR>>&nb= sp; =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>________________________________<BR>>  = ; =0A= >>>>From: Vikas Deolaliker [<A =0A= href=3D"mailto:vikas@sonoasystems.com";>mailto:vikas@sonoasystems.com</A> =0A= ]<BR>> >>>>Sent: Fri 5/6/2005 = 12:37 =0A= PM<BR>> >>>>To: Chiusano Joseph; = 'Frank =0A= McCabe'; 'Ken Laskey'<BR>> = >>>>Cc: =0A= soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org<BR>> =0A= >>>>Subject: RE: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing = an =0A= XML<BR>> Data<BR>> =0A= >>>>Model In Your SOA - Best =0A= Practices"<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>The = problem =0A= with "canonical data model" is that it does = not<BR>> =0A= >>>scale with time.<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>Eventually = it will =0A= not canonicalize but constrain the richness = of<BR>> =0A= >>>>communication that is expected among various SOA =0A= entities.<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>IMHO = SOA data =0A= mode should aim to define (a) the =0A= interfaces<BR>> used by =0A= SOA<BR>> >>>>entities to exchange =0A= information, (b) mechanisms to<BR>> =0A= >>>discover these<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>interfaces = and (c) =0A= mechanisms to negotiate a = vocabulary/format<BR>> for =0A= data<BR>> >>>>exchange over these =0A= discovered interfaces.<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>Vikas<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>________________________________<BR>>  = ; =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>From: = Chiusano =0A= Joseph [ <A =0A= href=3D"mailto:chiusano_joseph@bah.com";>mailto:chiusano_joseph@bah.com</A= >]<BR>> =0A= >>>>Sent: Friday, May 06, 2005 9:23 =0A= AM<BR>> >>>>To: Frank McCabe; Ken =0A= Laskey<BR>> >>>>Cc: =0A= soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org<BR>> =0A= >>>>Subject: RE: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing = an =0A= XML<BR>> Data<BR>> =0A= >>>>Model In Your SOA - Best =0A= Practices"<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>I think = some =0A= additional context may not have been = provided<BR>> =0A= below. While<BR>> >>>>the article = does =0A= state "This article does not discuss how = to<BR>> =0A= integrate<BR>> >>>>data models", = it is =0A= stated in the context of<BR>> = >>>"this =0A= article<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>will not = get into =0A= this topic because it is either out of<BR>> =0A= >>>scope or too complex to = discuss".<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>The = author is =0A= actually a strong proponent of having an<BR>> =0A= >>>integrated data<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>model, as = they =0A= depict an integrated data model as one = of<BR>> =0A= >>>the layers of<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>their = approach. I =0A= interpret this as a "canonical data<BR>> =0A= >>>model", which is<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>a special = type of =0A= data model used for data exchange.<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>Joe<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>Joseph =0A= Chiusano<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>Booz = Allen =0A= Hamilton<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>Visit = us =0A= online@ <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.boozallen.com";>http://www.boozallen.com</A><BR>>&nb= sp; =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>________________________________<BR>>  = ; =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>From: = Frank =0A= McCabe [ <A =0A= href=3D"mailto:frank.mccabe@us.fujitsu.com";>mailto:frank.mccabe@us.fujits= u.com</A>]<BR>> =0A= >>>>Sent: Fri 5/6/2005 12:03 = PM<BR>> =0A= >>>>To: Ken Laskey<BR>> =0A= >>>>Cc: Chiusano Joseph; =0A= soa-rm@lists.oasis-open.org<BR>> =0A= >>>>Subject: Re: [soa-rm] Good Recent SOA Piece: "Managing = an =0A= XML<BR>> Data<BR>> =0A= >>>>Model In Your SOA - Best =0A= Practices"<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>+1<BR>> =0A= >>>>Frank<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>On May = 6, 2005, =0A= at 8:45 AM, Ken Laskey wrote:<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>>The =0A= critical line in this article is<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> = >>>>>This =0A= article does not discuss how to integrate data =0A= models.<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> = >>>>>Its =0A= premise is the tried (and usually failed) that if we =0A= all<BR>> get = into<BR>> =0A= >>>>>a room and be reasonable we can all find a =0A= common<BR>> >>>vocabulary =0A= to<BR>> = >>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>map to. I could go on about when that works = and =0A= when<BR>> >>>that =0A= doesn't<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>>(see my = OASIS =0A= Symposium presentation for more) but if that = is<BR>> =0A= the<BR>> >>>>>basis of SOA, = then it =0A= will go no further than any other<BR>> =0A= >>>integration<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> = >>>>>paradigm. =0A= The driving question is how do you create a =0A= system<BR>> >>>>>(service?) to = do =0A= semantic negotiation between diverse<BR>> =0A= >>>vocabularies<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>>in a = way that =0A= is (1) visible, (2) reusable, and (3) = allows<BR>> you =0A= to use<BR>> >>>>>what you know = (or can =0A= find) in ways that enables you<BR>> = >>>to do =0A= more<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>>with = little or =0A= no effort.<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> = >>>>>The SOA =0A= RM will not specify how this is done but it must =0A= also<BR>> not<BR>> =0A= >>>>>codify an interchange vocabulary paradigm that will = not =0A= scale.<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> = >>>>>End of =0A= rant:-)<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>Ken<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> = >>>>>On May =0A= 6, 2005, at 10:32 AM, Chiusano Joseph = wrote:<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>>Forwarding a good recent SOA piece[1] for those =0A= interested<BR>> in =0A= reading<BR>> >>>>>>it. = Covers the =0A= notion of an integrated data model as a<BR>> =0A= foundational<BR>> = >>>>>>concept; =0A= also presents a 6-layer approach to SOA = (about<BR>> =0A= mid-article).<BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>>Joe<BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>>[1] <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.tdan.com/i032ht02.htm";>http://www.tdan.com/i032ht02.ht= m</A><BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>>Joseph Chiusano<BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>>Booz Allen = Hamilton<BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>>Visit us online@ <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.boozallen.com";>http://www.boozallen.com</A><BR>>&nb= sp; =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>-------------------------------------------------------------= ---------<BR>><BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>--------------------<BR>> =0A= >>>>>Ken Laskey<BR>> =0A= >>>>>MITRE Corporation, M/S H305 =0A= phone: 703-983-7934<BR>> =0A= >>>>>7515 Colshire =0A= Drive &n= bsp; =0A= fax:<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>703-983-1379<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>>McLean = VA =0A= 22102-7508<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> = >>>>>*** =0A= note change of phone extension from 883 to 983 =0A= effective<BR>> >>>>>4/15/2005 =0A= ***<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> >>>>On = May 6, =0A= 2005, at 8:45 AM, Ken Laskey wrote:<BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> >>>>>The =0A= critical line in this article is<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> = >>>>>This =0A= article does not discuss how to integrate data =0A= models.<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> = >>>>>Its =0A= premise is the tried (and usually failed) that if we =0A= all<BR>> get = into<BR>> =0A= >>>>>a room and be reasonable we can all find a =0A= common<BR>> >>>vocabulary =0A= to<BR>> = >>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>map to. I could go on about when that works = and =0A= when<BR>> >>>that =0A= doesn't<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>>(see my = OASIS =0A= Symposium presentation for more) but if that = is<BR>> =0A= the<BR>> >>>>>basis of SOA, = then it =0A= will go no further than any other<BR>> =0A= >>>integration<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> = >>>>>paradigm. =0A= The driving question is how do you create a =0A= system<BR>> >>>>>(service?) to = do =0A= semantic negotiation between diverse<BR>> =0A= >>>vocabularies<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>>in a = way that =0A= is (1) visible, (2) reusable, and (3) = allows<BR>> you =0A= to use<BR>> >>>>>what you know = (or can =0A= find) in ways that enables you<BR>> = >>>to do =0A= more<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>>with = little or =0A= no effort.<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> = >>>>>The SOA =0A= RM will not specify how this is done but it must =0A= also<BR>> not<BR>> =0A= >>>>>codify an interchange vocabulary paradigm that will = not =0A= scale.<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> = >>>>>End of =0A= rant:-)<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>Ken<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> = >>>>>On May =0A= 6, 2005, at 10:32 AM, Chiusano Joseph = wrote:<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>>Forwarding a good recent SOA piece[1] for those =0A= interested<BR>> in =0A= reading<BR>> >>>>>>it. = Covers the =0A= notion of an integrated data model as a<BR>> =0A= foundational<BR>> = >>>>>>concept; =0A= also presents a 6-layer approach to SOA = (about<BR>> =0A= mid-article).<BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>>Joe<BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>>[1] <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.tdan.com/i032ht02.htm";>http://www.tdan.com/i032ht02.ht= m</A><BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>>Joseph Chiusano<BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>>Booz Allen = Hamilton<BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>>Visit us online@ <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.boozallen.com";>http://www.boozallen.com</A><BR>>&nb= sp; =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>-------------------------------------------------------------= ---------<BR>><BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> =0A= >>>>>--------------------<BR>> =0A= >>>>>Ken Laskey<BR>> =0A= >>>>>MITRE Corporation, M/S H305 =0A= phone: 703-983-7934<BR>> =0A= >>>>>7515 Colshire =0A= Drive &n= bsp; =0A= fax:<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>703-983-1379<BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> =0A= >>><BR>> >>>>>McLean = VA =0A= 22102-7508<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> = >>>>>*** =0A= note change of phone extension from 883 to 983 =0A= effective<BR>> >>>>>4/15/2005 =0A= ***<BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>>><BR>> =0A= >>>><BR>> =0A= >><BR>> =0A= >><BR>> = ><BR>> =0A= >--<BR>> =0A= >***********<BR>> >Senior Standards = Strategist =0A= - Adobe Systems, Inc. -<BR>> <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.adobe.com";>http://www.adobe.com</A><BR>>  = ; =0A= >Chair - OASIS Service Oriented Architecture Reference =0A= Model<BR>> = Technical<BR>> =0A= >Committee -<BR>> <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/tc_home.php?wg_abbrev=3Dsoa-= rm">http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/tc_home.php?wg_abbrev=3Dsoa-rm</= A><BR>> =0A= >Vice Chair - UN/CEFACT Bureau Plenary - <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.unece.org/cefact/";>http://www.unece.org/cefact/</A><BR= >> =0A= >Adobe Enterprise Developer Resources = -<BR>> =0A= > <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.adobe.com/enterprise/developer/main.html";>http://www.a= dobe.com/enterprise/developer/main.html</A><BR>> &nbs= p; =0A= >***********<BR>> =0A= ><BR>><BR>> =0A= --<BR>> <BR>>&= nbsp; =0A= -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --------<BR>><BR>> =0A= / Ken<BR>> =0A= Laskey &= nbsp; &n= bsp; &nb= sp; &nbs= p;  = ; <BR>> =0A= \<BR>> | MITRE =0A= Corporation, M/S H305 phone: = 703-983-7934 =0A= |<BR>> | 7515 = Colshire =0A= Drive &n= bsp; =0A= fax: <BR>> =0A= 703-983-1379 = |<BR>> =0A= \ McLean VA<BR>> =0A= 22102-7508 &nb= sp; &nbs= p;  = ; =0A= /<BR>> <BR>> &n= bsp; =0A= -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---------<BR>><BR>><BR>> =0A= *** note: phone number changed 4/15/2005 to 703-983-7934 =0A= ***<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>> =0A= --<BR>> <BR>> &= nbsp; =0A= -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --------<BR>><BR>> =0A= / Ken<BR>> =0A= Laskey &= nbsp; &n= bsp; &nb= sp; &nbs= p;  = ; <BR>> =0A= \<BR>> | MITRE = Corporation, =0A= M/S H305 phone: 703-983-7934 =0A= |<BR>> | 7515 = Colshire =0A= Drive &n= bsp; =0A= fax: <BR>> =0A= 703-983-1379 |<BR>> =0A= \ McLean VA<BR>> =0A= 22102-7508 &nb= sp; &nbs= p;  = ; =0A= /<BR>> <BR>> &n= bsp; =0A= -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---------<BR>><BR>><BR>> =0A= *** note: phone number changed 4/15/2005 to 703-983-7934 = ***<BR>><BR>> =0A= -------------------------------------------------------------------------= -----------------<BR>><BR>> =0A= Ken Laskey<BR>> MITRE Corporation, M/S H305 phone: = 703-983-7934<BR>> 7515 =0A= Colshire Drive fax: 703-983-1379<BR>> McLean VA = 22102-7508<BR>><BR>> =0A= *** note change of phone extension from 883 to 983 effective = 4/15/2005<BR>> =0A= ***<BR>><BR><BR>--<BR>***********<BR>Senior Standards Strategist - = Adobe =0A= Systems, Inc. - <A = href=3D"http://www.adobe.com";>http://www.adobe.com</A><BR>Chair =0A= - OASIS Service Oriented Architecture Reference Model Technical = Committee =0A= -<BR><A =0A= href=3D"http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/tc_home.php?wg_abbrev=3Dsoa-= rm">http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/tc_home.php?wg_abbrev=3Dsoa-rm</= A><BR>Vice =0A= Chair - UN/CEFACT Bureau Plenary - <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.unece.org/cefact/";>http://www.unece.org/cefact/</A><BR= >Adobe =0A= Enterprise Developer Resources - <A =0A= href=3D"http://www.adobe.com/enterprise/developer/main.html";>http://www.a= dobe.com/enterprise/developer/main.html</A><BR>***********<BR><BR></FONT>= </P></DIV>=0A= =0A= </BODY>=0A= </HTML> ------_=_NextPart_001_01C55586.06BE013A--
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