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Subject: Re: [tm-pubsubj] Re: Country.xtm PSI; also proposed region.xtm PSI


[Steve and Michel, question for you at the bottom...]

Lars Marius Garshol wrote:
[...]
> * Lars Marius Garshol
> |
> | This xtmdtd.xtm PSI set is something I haven't thought about before,
> | and I am not sure what it would be used for. I have no idea how
> | you'd do an XTM-RDF mapping this way.
> 
> * Murray Altheim
> |
> | Well, perhaps I'm overstating, though I'm not sure. I'm *in a sense*
> | unconcerned with what the core.xtm PSIs represent. I merely need a
> | way of re-representing XTM syntax (whatever it happens to mean) in
> | another syntax by use of PSIs for the language components.
> 
> Well, I guess XML namespaces provides you with a set of URIs for the
> different element types, at least. There is no formal definition of
> what the URIs mean, of course, but at least there is agreement on the
> URIs. The attributes are more of a problem, I guess.

I'm not sure what you mean here. What would be the URI for <basename>,
for example? Without faking it and using (say) the table of contents
in the XTM 1.0 Specification or some other trickery (which I'm known
for).
 
> | Had the original core.xtm included PSIs for say, "base name", I'd be
> | able to characterize a resource in RDF as a base name.
> 
> Well, the concept of a base name and the <baseName> element type are
> not the same thing. The concept of a base name will be defined by the
> Standard Application Model, and the PSI for it will be defined in the
> same part of the ISO standard.

Understood. Then I guess I'm just waiting for that work to be available.

> | Absent all of these PSIs, it's always a "custom" map with no
> | resolveable hooks back into XTM (other than what is supplied by
> | human-readable documentation). I'd want this (as in my example) to
> | establish ontological relations between an XTM topic map and a map
> | expressed in RDF.
> 
> Hmmmm. Why do you want PSIs for this? I'm doing RDF-to-XTM conversions
> every now and then, but don't use PSIs for it. How do you intend to
> use PSIs for it? (I'm basically asking for help, as I don't really
> know what you're after.)

What I meant of "custom" is exactly what you've done (no criticism
intended). You've made some sort of mapping of RDF-to-XTM, but if 
you've also done an XTM-to-RDF, you had no way of expressing (in
a machine-understandable way) how each language component in the RDF 
result maps to the language components in XTM. Had you a PSI for 
each you could have built an RDF schema providing that information.

> * Lars Marius Garshol
> |
> | Do you mean that the documentation and publishing of the PSIs for
> | concepts in the models should follow the PubSubj TC guidelines, even
> | if the documentation is published by ISO? If so, I agree fully.
> 
> * Murray Altheim
> |
> | Yes. That is, if the concepts in the models even use XTM syntax for
> | their expression. I don't see that this is clear.
> 
> The concepts in the models will use prose for their expression (that
> is, to establish what a t-node is, for example). That does not mean
> that they cannot be accompanied by a topic map in XTM syntax that
> establishes the PSIs for the different concepts, however. If this is
> what the PubSubj TC recommends I assume it is also what ISO will do.

That's exactly what I need.
 
> | I wonder how long it'll be before we see these PSIs?
> 
> You'll have to ask SRN and MB about this, I'm afraid, as it's their
> turf, and not mine. The plan was to have new versions of the different
> documents by Barcelona, but whether the Barcelona version of their
> stuff version will have these PSIs I can't say.

Well, whatever I can do to help, I'm at their feet/mercy/beckoning.

Steve, Michel, if you give me some sort of clue as to what the 
requirements of this might be, I'd make a first crack at it and send
it on to you for comments/fixes. I'd do what I could to have at least
a draft by Barcelona. Ie., I'm willing to do the legwork if you give
me some directions.

Murray

...........................................................................
Murray Altheim, Staff Engineer          <mailto:murray.altheim&#64;sun.com>
Java and XML Software
Sun Microsystems, 1601 Willow Rd., MS UMPK17-102, Menlo Park, CA 94025

       Ernst Martin comments in 1949, "A certain degree of noise in 
       writing is required for confidence. Without such noise, the 
       writer would not know whether the type was actually printing 
       or not, so he would lose control."


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